There's Something Wrong with the Children | Crooked Media
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August 29, 2023
Ruined with Alison Leiby and Halle Kiefer
There's Something Wrong with the Children

In This Episode

Halle and Alison implore you to stay away from the hole as they ruin There’s Something Wrong with the Children.





[theme music]: If scary movies give you dread. Keep you up late night in bed, here’s a podcast that will help you ease your mind. We’ll explain the plot real nicely then we’ll talk about what’s frightening, so you never have to have a spooky time. It’s Ruined.


Halle Kiefer: Oh, hello. Welcome to Ruined. I’m Halle. 


Alison Leiby: And I’m Alison. 


Halle Kiefer: This is the podcast where we ruin a horror movie just for you. 


Alison Leiby: Just for you, Halle. What’s new? How are you doing? 


Halle Kiefer: I’m good. Um, I’m trying to think. Nothing. I live. 


Alison Leiby: I know. 


Halle Kiefer: A life of static existence. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: Though I will say I’m officially starting to write, I’ve been ruminating on what I’m calling a lesbian werewolf movie. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: And I. I have two weeks off from work, well not off, but work working. Not what I traditionally do. And I am going to start writing an outline for it, and I want—


Alison Leiby: I’m so excited for you. 


Halle Kiefer: Thank you. I want it to be disgusting. I want. I want vomiting. I want blood. I want stabbing. I wanted to be a movie that you will never see. Truly. 


Alison Leiby: There it is. 


Halle Kiefer: There we have it. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. That’s your that should be your goal. Your inspiration in writing should be like, how do I make sure Alison can’t see this? Even though all I want to do is support my friends and the things they make? 


Halle Kiefer: Yeah, you’ll support me in other ways. But it is funny. It’s like that is a good reminder. And also but also you can’t watch any of it. So—


Alison Leiby: Yeah, I know it’s like—


Halle Kiefer: It encompasses so much, you know. 


Alison Leiby: Yes, it’s true. 


Halle Kiefer: How are you doing? 


Alison Leiby: Well, that’s exciting. 


Halle Kiefer: Thanks. 


Alison Leiby: I’m good. I am. I’ve been on the road a bit, and so I’ve had to leave little Rizz. And now that I’m back, he is being so snuggly. 


Halle Kiefer: Oh. 


Alison Leiby: He’s just, like, on my lap. Like he’s not even a big lap cat. He normally likes to lay just next to me. And he’s been lying like. Like putting his arms and, like, the front half of his body on my lap and then, like, facing that, like watching TV, like, kind of, like, laying on me the way like a partner might. [laughs]


Halle Kiefer: That’s so sweet. 


Alison Leiby: And I’m like, well, I’ve got the cat. So we’re all set over here. 


Halle Kiefer: Your—


Alison Leiby: And he’s been so cute. And I’m sure people saw that I posted on Instagram however many weeks ago. It was now that this is whenever this comes out that he did a really high jump. 


Halle Kiefer: Where did he go? 


Alison Leiby: So proud. 


Halle Kiefer: Where did he jump to? 


Alison Leiby: He jumped because I have the spotted lanternfly is our, our—


Halle Kiefer: I meant to ask.


Alison Leiby: —it’s an evolving. 


Halle Kiefer: You got the salt gun. You got a salt gun. 


Alison Leiby: I did not. Sabrina, our producer got the salt gun.


Halle Kiefer: Oh I’m so sorry, Sabrina got a salt gun to kill them.


Alison Leiby: Which was recommended. And also thank you all for all of the recommendations about how to deal with this. I was especially intrigued by the vinegar because she said you’re a part or your building will smell like salad dressing. [laughs]


Halle Kiefer: That sounds great honestly.


Alison Leiby: They seem to. There are not as many as there were. Like, I think that they’re like starting to die off a little bit because it was that there were like. Ten or 20 out there. And now it’s like I see one or two during the day out there and it’s fine. But there was one on kind of the outside of my door, the glass door and so Rizz clocked that and then jumped really high to try and get it. 


Halle Kiefer: I will say I saw somebody get a lantern. What are they called? Lantern flies. 


Alison Leiby: Spotted lantern flies. 


Halle Kiefer: Spotted lanternfly tattoo. And it was very cute. 


Alison Leiby: Oh yes, yes, I know They are beautiful. I’ve been seeing a lot of their undercarriage because—


Halle Kiefer: God. Jesus Christ. Alison—


Alison Leiby: Because they they land—


Halle Kiefer: Never say again [laughter] never say that to me. 


Alison Leiby: They land on my glass door and like, you just don’t see the underside of a bug very often. 


Halle Kiefer: No. 


Alison Leiby: It is terrible. 


Halle Kiefer: You know, you don’t see the underside of many animals. And—


Alison Leiby: Yeah. And there’s a reason that we don’t that that’s not front and center—


Halle Kiefer: None of our business. 


Alison Leiby: None of our business. 


Halle Kiefer: None of our fucking business what’s going on down there? 


Alison Leiby: None of our business. 


Halle Kiefer: Wow. I want to see that. We’ll have to remind Sabrina, we want to see that salt gun in action. I’d like to see it—


Alison Leiby: Yeah, yeah, yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: —just absolutely mow down. 


Alison Leiby: Firing it away. 


Halle Kiefer: Yeah.


Alison Leiby: Yeah. And. A reminder to people listening. If you’re listening on Patreon, this is like a helpful reminder. And if you’re listening to it live the day it comes out, you have a minimal amount of time to see our live show that was on or is on August 27th, Sunday night, 7 p.m., depending on when in time you’re listening to this. If you are in September already, we can’t help you. 


Halle Kiefer: Yeah, we’re so sorry. You’re the we are the future and we wish you well. 


Alison Leiby: Yes, I either am or will have ruined Sharknado for Halle. So You can still get it. If it’s if it’s Tuesday the 29th, I think you still have a day. So you could still get a ticket. Go watch it. You can get some merch, you can see what’s going on there. But we can’t help you if it’s after that. I’m so sorry. 


Halle Kiefer: I think this because we haven’t done a ruining or a reverse ruin in a while. 


Alison Leiby: It’s been a minute. 


Halle Kiefer: I’m going to prepare some questions beforehand because—


Alison Leiby: Okay. 


Halle Kiefer: —I have some questions about the Sharknado I’m sure the film will address. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: But I’d like it to prepare something because otherwise I just I can’t give up total control. 


Alison Leiby: No, no, of course not. 


Halle Kiefer: I need to feel like I will still have an iron fist over the episode.


Alison Leiby: We’ll need, it’ll be kind of a hybrid [laughs] experience. 


Halle Kiefer: Absolutely. And thank you for coming to that or having gone to that. We really appreciate it. 


Alison Leiby: Yes, yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: And let us begin. We are doing, I believe, our final vacation horror. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: Look, I know what I’ve been saying about not wanting to watch horror movies with kids and my point still stands. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: But when there’s a movie with this title, I thought, well, I gotta do it. 


Alison Leiby: I. Gotta. Yep. 


Halle Kiefer: Title is, of course, a film from 2023. Heard of it? The year we’re in currently. And the title is of course, There’s Something Wrong with the Children, which I like because it cuts to the chase. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah, I don’t need like a cheeky. 


Halle Kiefer: One word. 


Alison Leiby: Title. Just tell us. Yeah, it’s like bear—


Halle Kiefer: Forest. 


Alison Leiby: No. 


Halle Kiefer: No. There is Something Wrong—


Alison Leiby: There is Something Wrong—


Halle Kiefer: —with the Children. There’s something currently wrong. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: And there’s more than one child that the wrongness applies to. 


Alison Leiby: We have so much information already. 


Halle Kiefer: I love it also feels like a title from the seventies. I feel like in the seventies—


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: —horror movies you’d get a long title. 


Alison Leiby: Totally. 


Halle Kiefer: This is directed by Roxanne Benjamin and she has directed oh, Body at Brighton Rock. I want to do that. And produced V/H/S and V/H/S 2. 


Alison Leiby: Oh. 


Halle Kiefer: Huge fans.


Alison Leiby: We’re big fans. 


Halle Kiefer: Has also written, produced, directed segments for Southbound and XX. I have not seen Southbound but I love XX. Huge fan of Roxanne Benjamin, as it turns out. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. Learn something new every day. 


Halle Kiefer: Shout out. And this, of course, we always like to have Alison watch the trailer and we’re really— 


Alison Leiby: I watched the right trailer this time.


Halle Kiefer: Okay, I was gonna say. We’re really going to try to do the right trailer, though it doesn’t effect— 


Alison Leiby: There are not a bunch of movies with this title, so. 


Halle Kiefer: Right, right yeah. You end up watching the trailer for The Kids Are All Right and you have no idea what’s going on. [laughter]


Alison Leiby: And I’m like, I just want those lesbians to be parents. Isn’t that what—


Halle Kiefer: I hated that movie. I hate it more as a lesbian, and I didn’t like it—


Alison Leiby: I can’t remember if I saw it or not. 


Halle Kiefer: Yeah, it’s that kind of movie. Okay. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: I said it. Fucking wasting    Annette Bening’s time. She’s great. Everyone’s great in it. It’s just like the most insipid, fucking like. 


Alison Leiby: It’s a, yeah, yeah, yeah.


Halle Kiefer: What if Mark Ruffalo comes like it fucks your wife. Well, I wouldn’t be very happy about it, I’ll tell you that much. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: Please don’t fuck my wife [both speaking] Mark Ruffalo. Unless we have a conversation, and then I think that seems fine. 


Alison Leiby: And I’m sure he’s a lovely man. 


Halle Kiefer: I’m sure, I’m sure he’d be very respectful of our marriage. But I, what, how, we, talk to me about this. And my wife. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: Of course I am. She’s not my property. Let’s have a conversation and then you can fuck my wife. Okay? Mark Ruffalo. 


Alison Leiby: Okay. 


Halle Kiefer: For God sakes. Anyways, so we did watch the right trailer. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: And what did you think about the There’s Something Wrong with the Children trailer? Alison?


Alison Leiby: I did not like it. 


Halle Kiefer: Mm hmm. 


Alison Leiby: It was scary. 


Halle Kiefer: What jumped out to you as the thing you didn’t like the most. 


Alison Leiby: Well, I don’t like caves and it seems like there is a cave. 


Halle Kiefer: Cave heavy. There’s a big pit. Pit in the earth.


Alison Leiby: Pit, a pit in a cave, it seems like. And I didn’t like that, but it seemed, from what I could gather, this is like there’s some kind of destabilization of reality for one of the characters. And you seeing something like. Like, terrifying and then realizing no one else around you is seeing that reality. I don’t like it. 


Halle Kiefer: And also that the thing you’re seeing involves, something wrong with the children. [both speaking]


Alison Leiby: Yes. Well, there is something wrong with the children. 


Halle Kiefer: There really, really is. We also we also take a baseline scary. Alison, how scary do you find the concept of and I’m just throwing this out here, something being wrong with the children? 


Alison Leiby: Very scary. 


Halle Kiefer: How wrong do you think the children would have to be for you to, like, get involved? 


Alison Leiby: Well, like, it would just depend on the kind of wrong. 


Halle Kiefer: Yeah. It would


Alison Leiby: That the children are. [laughs] I mean, because, like, sometimes like kids are already pretty unpredictable and strange. So it would take me a minute to sus out, like, how strange are they? 


Halle Kiefer: And these kids make it pretty clear pretty quick. So at least you’d have that information. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: I again, like, I just haven’t been in the mood to watch horror movies with children. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah of course. 


Halle Kiefer: And I feel like this is actually okay because it is so explicitly about the children being, it’s not like The Babadook. Where like, you’re just watching this poor little kid scream and like, need to go to like grief therapy you know what I mean?


Alison Leiby: Yeah, no, that’s a different kind of thing. 


Halle Kiefer: This is more the children have been replaced or perhaps something is posing as the children. There’s it’s more it’s not campy but it to me it was not we’re not terrorized. The children are creating terror. The children are not being terrorized. Does that make sense? 


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: And that I’m totally fine with. It was also written by T.J. Cimfel and David White, just to have that out there. And of course, it is a Blumhouse film. And based on the correct trailer, which we did manage to watch this week, would you like to guess the twist in There’s Something Wrong With the Children? 


[voice over]: Guess the twist. 


Alison Leiby: Okay. I’m going to guess that the kids died. 


Halle Kiefer: Okay. 


Alison Leiby: And that everything that I think like the main character and his like seeing the children with the nosebleeds and threatening to like kill other kids and stuff is hallucinating, that they are still alive and that they, they died. And so he doesn’t. Yeah.


Halle Kiefer: Fabulous. We absolutely fucking love it. And once again, you are getting better and better at this every week. Let us begin ruining. There’s Something Wrong with the Children. We see our two little adorable tykes, Lucy and Spencer they’re running around the backyard. It is sort of is during the day, but the the it is completely green. It’s like a night vision green. There’s very, a neon green. 


Alison Leiby: Okay. 


Halle Kiefer: And they’re running around in slow motion to the song More by Sisters of Mercy. And I have not listened to or thought of Sisters of Mercy since high school. 


Alison Leiby: No, no. 


Halle Kiefer: And I feel like that it really it’s set me up for success. I was like, great, glad to hear it. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah, I love that. 


Halle Kiefer: Suddenly we get a thunder crash. We’re at the same house the kids are running outside. It’s a cabin near a lake. So there’s a rainstorm and we see Lucy and Spencer. The kids we just saw. Spencer is nine. I’m gonna say Lucy’s ten. So they’re not little, little kids, but they’re not middle schoolers either. 


Alison Leiby: Right. 


Halle Kiefer: They’re running around screaming. And we see their parents, Ellie and Thomas, and they’re making cocktails with their couple of friends, Margo and Ben. Margo do not have children. And the implication is that they have been friends a long time, I believe, since college. So these are like old, old, old friends. 


Alison Leiby: Okay. 


Halle Kiefer: And much like we just did the beach house. Oh, this made me want to go to a cabin so bad. 


Alison Leiby: I know that’s it’s such a horror, the thing in horror where I’m just like, you’re really picking, like, the most relaxing, luxurious places to have the worst time. 


Halle Kiefer: Like making a cocktail with your good friends during a rainstorm in a cabin. Sounds so good.


Alison Leiby: In a cabin, that sounds awesome. And I don’t even love, like, go into a house. So.


Halle Kiefer: Yeah. It wasn’t my choice. But I will say the vac— We do The Rental, too, all these vacation movies. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: It had the opposite effect where it’s like, I would love to go to an isolated area and be in a cabin. Like, I would love to be in the middle of nowhere, totally defenseless right now. That seems great. Ben brings Margo, his wife, her drink, but when Ellie says to her husband, Thomas, Where’s my couch service? He says, The bottle’s right over there. And both Margo and Ben are like. Uh oh.


Alison Leiby: Not good.


Halle Kiefer: Trouble in paradise. They talk about the next day, Thomas asks about the forecast, and Ben says, Oh, it’s going to be gorgeous tomorrow. And I’ve planned a hike for all of us, and the kids could do it too. And everyone’s like, Can’t we just sleep in and not do anything? But Ben sort of the he’s like the the the woodsman. And he’s like, No, we came out here, these kids are gonna have a great time, we’re going to run around the woods. Something’s clearly going on with Thomas. So Thomas is in a bad mood. So Ellie says, you know what? We’re going to go back to our cabin. We’ll take the kids and we’ll see you guys in the morning. So obviously there’s something there’s something wrong with the children, but there’s also something wrong with the marriage. Okay. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: Something’s going on. And there is a, there’s a lot of projection from Margo and Ben of like the problems of the marriage being about the kids. 


Alison Leiby: Right. 


Halle Kiefer: And then you find out what it’s about. And I really like this movie a lot more honestly, than I’m like, Oh, this seems like a plausible conundrum for people to find themselves in separate from what’s going to happen, of course, to the children and how wrong they get. But they sort of collect their kids and they had their cabin is literally like 100 feet away facing the back of this cabin. And before they go, Ellie says, like mouthed to Margo, like, we’re going to smoke weed tomorrow and Margo’s like, Hell, yeah, we are. 


Alison Leiby: Oh yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: And Ben and Margo are like, you know, well they went, they took their kids, they’re going to bed. We don’t have to go to bed. So they like, drink. They watch the rain coming down and it’s just so good. 


Alison Leiby: Gorg. 


Halle Kiefer: And the next morning everyone meets up and they go for a hike. And Lucy’s playing a game that I’m presuming is supposed to be a licensed free version of Magic the Gathering. So she’s sort of showing Ben all these cards and he’s she’s like, that’s this is the Serpentine Lord, and you never want to get this. And Margo says, Well, well, are you sure we don’t want to invite the Serpentine Lord to taco night? And Lucy’s like, he eats souls, not tacos. Okay, this is serious business, but it’s very cute. 


Alison Leiby: That’s cute. 


Halle Kiefer: And we see Ellie and Margo kind of lag behind. And Ellie, I think there is this, and I do believe it is due to the crushing pressure of being a woman within a capitalist society, within the confines of the white nuclear family. But Ellie is like we as a mom, I need to constantly be drinking like I’m a wine mom. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: And I have immense sympathy for that. 


Alison Leiby: Yes, of course. I can’t imagine what it would be like to be a parent and not just constantly be like, I need a drink. 


Halle Kiefer: As gals who drink regardless, and don’t have children, I could only imagine, you know. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. Yes.


Halle Kiefer: But Ellie goes to Margo and says, Oh, look here, I brought something in my thermos. She brought a thermos of gin and tonics. And there’s something about hiking while drinking gin and tonic that seems so viscerally wrong to me. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah, it’s such a. 


Halle Kiefer: It’s not that cocktail. 


Alison Leiby: It’s also a relaxing drink. 


Halle Kiefer: Yes— 


Alison Leiby: Like whiskey feels like what you hike with. 


Halle Kiefer: Yeah. 


Alison Leiby: You know what I mean?


Halle Kiefer: Yeah, gin and tonic is like. 


Alison Leiby: Like a gin and tonic is for, like, sitting near an umbrella. 


Halle Kiefer: My. My gin tonic is. It’s Christmas, and you have your your best gay couple friends over, and you all have sweaters on. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: And there’s like, holiday music that to me is gin and tonic. And the idea of like being hot in the woods and taking a sip and it’s gin and tonic. Like what?


Alison Leiby: Also, like, tonic, like will get flat. 


Halle Kiefer: Yeah. A carbonated—


Alison Leiby: So then you’re kind of drinking, like flat quinine. Ugh. [laughter]


Halle Kiefer: You don’t take a carbonated mixer on a hike. We all know this. 


Alison Leiby: Be smart about this. 


Halle Kiefer: While they’re kind of chatting, Ellie says to Margo, So how has is Ben doing? So Ben has his own problems. You know, we see that Ellie and Thomas, their marriage has been on the rocks. But she, Ellie’s asking Margo, how is Ben doing after what happened? Margo says he’s fine. He’s totally fine. Everything’s great, and immediately sort of closes off real conversation. So we know that’s going to come up later, you know, whatever Ben’s problem is. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: You know, and Ellie’s like, no, that’s no problem. I was just asking you. I was asking you, you’re my friend. I want you to be happy. You know, we don’t have to talk about it. And Margo’s like, no, we’re we’re really good. We just went on a trip to Yosemite and Ellie’s like, Oh, my God, I saw the photos are so beautiful, so quickly skirting around an away from what is obviously a serious topic that will come up later. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: Meanwhile, Ben has a machete and it’s like excitedly hacking through the underbrush. And Ellie keeps trying to say, please don’t get the machete near the children. I’m just concerned about the machete. I didn’t know there’d be a machete. 


Alison Leiby: He had the machete. Like, we don’t need that with the kids. 


Halle Kiefer: Luckily, someone’s going to need it later. 


Alison Leiby: Oh boy. 


Halle Kiefer: So it is good that there’s a machete on hand. But he gives it to Thomas and Thomas gives it a go and they’re having fun. I should also add that Thomas is, his ethnicity is not called out, but he is Latino. Oh, he’s he’s Puerto Rican. The actor’s Puerto Rican. So I’m presuming the the character is Puerto Rican. So their family also speaks Spanish. So clearly they’ve raised the kids bilingual. And he will occasionally speak to them in Spanish, you know, and you know what they’re saying because it’s contextual. And also then they explain it most of the time. 


Alison Leiby: Right. 


Halle Kiefer: So, you know, he’s saying, like, don’t get close here. You know, we’re going through this underbrush, Alison. You’re not going to believe this. But at the middle of the goddamn woods, they found a huge abandoned building. And it looks immediately to me like an abandoned mental asylum. 


Alison Leiby: Of course. 


Halle Kiefer: They don’t even ask a question. Ben and Thomas, just start putting the kids through and open a window into the building. 


Alison Leiby: Why? Why are people stupid? 


Halle Kiefer: Tetanus. Asbestos. A giant pit in the middle of a building that you don’t know where it goes or what’s inside of it. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. I mean, there’s just a lot. 


Halle Kiefer: What are we doing? 


Alison Leiby: Like, what we just don’t know is that there’s not someone in there. 


Halle Kiefer: There’s also like, broken glass, like, you know, like metal shards. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah it’s not like a McDonalds play place. 


Halle Kiefer: Exactly. Yeah. It’s not Dave & Buster’s, for God’s sake. Ellie is the only one who’s like, I’m not going in there. Like, it’s. It’s. There’s no light in there. It’s the middle of what, what even is this? And Thomas is like, God I thought we were trying to be adventurous for once and as a result of saying that his wife then climbs in after them. It is pitch dark inside. 


Alison Leiby: Get out. 


Halle Kiefer: Part of the part of the ceiling has crumbled. So you do have these sort of skylight effects. And Ben says, you know. 


[clip of Zach Gilford]: There’s actually a lot of these old ruins around the countryside out here. Could be anything. Decommissioned military fort, fur trading company, abandoned miner can. 


Halle Kiefer: Again. 


Alison Leiby: Sure. 


Halle Kiefer: What—


Alison Leiby: Best case scenario it’s that.


Halle Kiefer: So it’s like what if they have chemicals I was like I don’t know what—


Alison Leiby: Or a bunch of guns. 


Halle Kiefer: Right just like ammunition’s just somewhere. It just doesn’t seem a place to take two children under ten. Does that make sense? Or two kids who are not teenagers? 


Alison Leiby: Yeah, no, that makes sense.


Halle Kiefer: Alison, while they’re talking about what was this building? Ellie turns around and says, where did the kids go? 


Alison Leiby: Like, you’re in an abandoned building in the middle of the woods. 


Halle Kiefer: That’s dark. 


Alison Leiby: You took your eyes off the kids?


Halle Kiefer: We hear Lucy screaming in the distance. I’m immediately like I hope everyone had their Tdap because she’s going to get tetanus. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: I hope these kids are up to date on their vaccinations. 


Alison Leiby: I hope so. 


Halle Kiefer: They run to go find them and they’re standing near sort of like a crumbling hole in the wall. Spencer has found a bird’s nest and has picked it up and he’s like, look, all the babies and the mother are dead and all the adults are like, Put it down, don’t pick them up. And Lucy’s are kicking something and Ellie to stop, and she’s just kicking the dead mother bird against the wall. And it is just to set up like even the best case scenario, like kids don’t have, like our, our, our relationship with death or dead things. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: So I think even before something becomes wrong with them, it’s sort of like the, the, the callousness, but it’s just like. It doesn’t mean anything. You’re like, I don’t know. I’m just kicking dead birds—


Alison Leiby: Yeah they’re not connected to it in the same way that we are. 


Halle Kiefer: Now. When I kick a dead bird, I fucking mean it. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: Okay. It’s because that bird did something to me. 


Alison Leiby: And I know I’m going to die. 


Halle Kiefer: Margo calls everyone over and says, Oh, I found. Basically, there’s a staircase to a wall. And it looks like a staircase led up to a landing and a wall was built to brick it off. And then that wall crumbled. And you know this because on the other side of the wall, so now this big gap, they walk up, there’s a gigantic fucking pit in the ground. And so they all stand over it Alison. 


Alison Leiby: Get away from the pit. 


Halle Kiefer: Including the children. And Ellie at least, is like, get the kids away. Do not stand near there.


Alison Leiby: I would be throwing the kids back out the window like, get out. 


Halle Kiefer: Ben drops a rock and it just plummets into the void. It’s incredibly deep. Also, everyone has asbestos like I’m sure everyone has. 


Alison Leiby: I mean you’re all dead. 


Halle Kiefer: Mesothelioma. Like you’re, you you hope you’re going be able to be a part of a class action lawsuit. Now that you’ve gone in there.


Alison Leiby: Yeah. Oh. Also, I filed for the Facebook data sharing lawsuit. 


Halle Kiefer: Oh I didn’t know this. 


Alison Leiby: There’s a class action lawsuit. 


Halle Kiefer: Oh. 


Alison Leiby: If you just Google like the Facebook class action lawsuit, it’s like if you used Facebook between May of 2007 and like 2022, you could get like a couple of hundred bucks. They said. 


Halle Kiefer: Well, I guess I’ll do that. 


Alison Leiby: I filled it out. And the longer you were on Facebook in that window, the more money you got. 


Halle Kiefer: Because the more data they took?


Alison Leiby: Yep. 


Halle Kiefer: Well. 


Alison Leiby: I’m like, Give me my money. Anyway. Everybody go do that. 


Halle Kiefer: Spencer looks down into the pit. Spencer was nine again, and he says, El lugar que brilla. The place that shines. And both kids look into the pit and say, Es brillante. It’s brilliant. Of course, the adults are like it’s total, it’s a dark pit. There’s no like, shining in it. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: It’s not brilliant in any way. Suddenly Lucy’s nose begins to bleed. Unfortunately, that’s the sign—


Alison Leiby: Probably from the asbestos. 


Halle Kiefer: We got to get. Exactly. I’m like. You could be inhaling military chemicals. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: Like, why would you? If you—


Alison Leiby: You don’t know. 


Halle Kiefer: What are you doing? 


Alison Leiby: Get out of there. God, I hate these people. 


Halle Kiefer: So they all go to leave Alison, they all turn away and they, nobody notices that Spencer is still standing over the hole. And they turn around, right as he goes to jump in. And fortunately, Ben is still close enough. He grabs Spencer freaking out and hauls him back. But nobody addresses the fact that he looked like he was about to jump in. They’re just like you have to be more careful. 


Alison Leiby: That’s not. That’s different. 


Halle Kiefer: Yes. That’s different. And Spencer’s nose starts to bleed. Back at the cabin. The adults are drinking a beer. The kids are taking a nap because they’re tired from the hike. And Ben informs them that he bought Spencer devil sticks. Do you ever devil sticks from, like, the nineties? 


Alison Leiby: What are they? 


Halle Kiefer: They’re basically two sticks. And then there’s like a third stick that you kind of, like, juggle around. 


Alison Leiby: Yes, yes. It’s like. It’s like wooden hacky sack. [laughs] Like, there’s—


Halle Kiefer: A thousand percent. It’s exactly like that. Yeah. There was much more of a hacky sack devil stick sort of. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: Vibe in the nineties. 


Alison Leiby: They’re not a thing anymore, right? 


Halle Kiefer: I think somebody is doing them on Venice Beach. But I wonder if kids I mean, if you gave a kid. Much like if you gave a kid— 


Alison Leiby: I had one. Did you have one? 


Halle Kiefer: Oh, absolutely. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: Oh, yeah. Hackey sacks, We had devil’s dicks. I think it’s just like one of those things where, like, eventually you’re like, what do, what do kid’s like? I’ll go to, like. I don’t know—


Alison Leiby: Here’s this. 


Halle Kiefer: According to Wikipedia, this is literally this is what the this is how the Wikipedia article for devil stick starts. The manipulation of the devil stick is a form of gyroscopic juggling or—


Alison Leiby: Okay. 


Halle Kiefer: —and it’s like, okay, all right. But I remember it being fun and. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. Something to do.


Halle Kiefer: You know, something to do. But I also I was like, You can’t get Spencer a gift and not get Lucy a gift. You get one kid a gift. You got to get both of them a gift. 


Alison Leiby: You got to get everybody a gift. 


Halle Kiefer: Or you say, hey, this is for both of you. You got to share. That seems fine. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah.


Halle Kiefer: And again, I think we’re just establishing like Ben really does like kids. Like Ben, you know what I mean really is bonding with the kids and, like, loves being sort of like an uncle to them, you know, over time, meanwhile, the women are sort of talking about a potential trip they could take next year. Thomas is trying to show Ben how to open a beer on the side of the table, which I’ve never done, but it’s sort of like—


Alison Leiby: I’ve never done it. 


Halle Kiefer: I just feel like I would break the bottle immediately. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. And, like, hurt myself in the process. 


Halle Kiefer: Yeah. And he’s just hitting it over and over again until Ellie basically yells like, Do you really have to keep doing that? This isn’t our furniture. Thomas is like, You’re right. That was so inappropriate. And it’s immediately awkward and icy. And Ben, picking up on the vibes said, Hey, do you want to go toss around some horseshoes? And so he and Thomas go off to toss around horseshoes. And Margo says to Ellie, how about you come inside? And we’ll start making the salad for dinner because the guys are going to grill out again my mouth is watering. Just thinking about a salad. That’s, that’s—


Alison Leiby: Me too. When you said tacos earlier, I was like, What’s happening with tacos? 


Halle Kiefer: So they go inside and Margo immediately says, What the fuck is going on between you two? Like, because again, they’re old friends. 


Alison Leiby: Right. 


Halle Kiefer: Like, this is a new dynamic. It’s like what happened that’s—


Alison Leiby: What’s going on? 


Halle Kiefer: You guys are just like each other. And Ellie says, If you want to know, we’re going to have to get some drinks. Meanwhile, Ben and Thomas start grilling and Thomas, I don’t really I feel like a lot of most of my friends are really honest about parenthood. 


Alison Leiby: Mm hmm. Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: And would never try to convince you to be a parent. 


Alison Leiby: No. 


Halle Kiefer: Like, I know it’s sort of a stereotype, but like, I don’t have those friends. Like.


Alison Leiby: I don’t either. They’re like, they’re all like, We should have done what you’re doing. [laughs]


Halle Kiefer: It’s like, well, even if you love your children, I was like, let’s not why underplay how hard this is. 


Alison Leiby: It’s hard. 


Halle Kiefer: It’s incredibly hard. And you can obviously love your children and love your family and still be like, good Lord, I am exhausted, you know. 


It’s a lot of work. So but Thomas is really pitching Ben to have kids because I think Thomas really wants to have like a dad friend, like, we are here. We want you guys to start your, you know, something, I don’t know. Just like you join us at this level. And Ben’s like, I don’t know if we’re ready, but the undercurrent is it seems like Margo is doesn’t seem like she’s really ready. Like Margo’s the one kind of put it pumping the brakes on it. Inside. This is where I’m like, what is it? I’m so thrilled to report the awkwardness is because Ellie and Thomas had a foursome with these other college friends, Kyle and Katie. 


Alison Leiby: Oh, my God. 


Halle Kiefer: And like had them over I can have over and fucked them. And I was like—


Alison Leiby: I love that. 


Halle Kiefer: I loved it because I was like, oh, that’s like if any of my old friends said that I’d be like [gasps] people from college even. I’d be like. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: Please tell me everything. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah, I would need to know everything that went down. 


Halle Kiefer: So there’s this very funny, like back and forth where these, like Margo’s of course, like, No, tell me everything. And then Ben is like, spilling his guts about his fears about parenting to Thomas, [laughter] and being like, I just don’t know. Like we love traveling and, like, doing our own thing. And. And Thomas is like, I know what you’re saying, but, like, it’s hard to have your life change, but like, it sometimes it does change for the good. Like there is so much caring you can still have fine and you just like, take pleasure in them getting older. Then we cut back and Margo’s like, No, she’s like, I would have thought Kyle, but Katie agreed to do it? And so basically by foursome I guess, I mean like swinging or like partner swapping. So basically, like Ellie and Kyle ended up having, like, incredible sex. But then Thomas and Katie were like, kind of just awkwardly, like, sort of—


Alison Leiby: That’s. Yeah, that’s going to throw things. 


Halle Kiefer: And I’m sure that happens a lot where it’s like, Oh, uh oh some of us are really enjoying this, and other of us are just sort of watching and maybe having different feelings about it. And Ellie tells Margo, she’s like, You know, I told Thomas that I faked it just to, like, make him feel better, but I had like, an insane orgasm. It was like it was like incredible sex. And I’m like, Well, yeah, I guess that would that would put Thomas back on his heels, if that’s the first time you’ve done something like—


Alison Leiby: Yeah it would. 


Halle Kiefer: And Margo’s like, You know what? Like you guys been together forever? Like, it seemed like it was a mutual decision. Like it wasn’t like, Oh, it was just his idea or, like, hers. It was like, well, it’s happening, you know? And he’s like, he’ll come around like I, you know, me, it’s a new thing, I’m sure. Whatever. And she’s like, Well, we have not had sex. Like, he hasn’t even touched me since this happened. So Margo—


Alison Leiby: I mean you guys shook things up too much. 


Halle Kiefer: But, you know, listen, these things happen. We all you know, we’ve all had we all had group sex that didn’t go the way we want it to. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah that then shifted kind of the dynamics of our—


Halle Kiefer: Exactly. 


Alison Leiby: —permanent relationship. [laughter]


Halle Kiefer: And Margo says, well, why don’t you have we’ll have Lucy and Spencer stay the night in our cabin and you and Thomas can sort of have an evening alone to, like, reconnect. 


Alison Leiby: Okay, that’s nice. 


Halle Kiefer: Which I was like, helpful. A really good idea. And also a great situation in which something to go wrong with the children. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: And Ellie asked Margo again, like, now that we’ve talked about my like, sex life, when are you guys going to have kids? And Margo says we are not having kids, we are too busy traveling. And then she kind of slips up, slips up and says, we’re too busy doing all the cool stuff you and I did before. And it was just sort of like, Oh, sorry. I didn’t mean like. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: I didn’t mean like I’m still doing cool stuff and you had kids. But Ellie, of course, knows that that’s—


Alison Leiby: That’s what that’s. 


Halle Kiefer: Yeah. 


Alison Leiby: What she said and what she meant. 


Halle Kiefer: You know, afterwards they all meet up outside after dinner there around the bonfire, which also is really fun. And Spencer’s playing with his devil sticks and he’s horrible at them. And Ben’s trying to teach him. And honestly, here’s the problem with these kids in this movie, and it’s not a problem, but these kids are too adorable. 


Alison Leiby: Mm. 


Halle Kiefer: These these two actors. 


Alison Leiby: They are cute. 


Halle Kiefer: These actors are adorable. And I think you either have to go very realistic, creepy, or like I’m a little boy in a tuxedo, like, staring at you. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: Like you have to sort of go in between because they seem like normal kids. So then when they act creepy, it’s just them smirking like they’re in a Pixar movie.


Alison Leiby: Right. And they’re so cute. 


Halle Kiefer: They’re so cute, it’s not scary enough. 


Alison Leiby: That you’re like, what’d you do? 


Halle Kiefer: Yeah, exactly. And eventually these start to ratchet up, which I appreciate, but for the most part, like here is just like, Oh, that’s cute. It’s like, I want him to learn the devil sticks. And once they’re, Ellie sort of nudges Margo. And Margo says, Hey, here’s an idea. Why do you kids want to stay with Auntie Margo and Uncle Ben tonight? You know, and we can have a good time. They she turns to look at Lucy. Lucy is just staring up at the bug light and doesn’t even turn around. 


Alison Leiby: Okay. 


Halle Kiefer: And Thomas is like, Oh, that’s fine if you guys want to do that. And Ellie says, Well, if that’s the case, I’m ready to go now. And I think Thomas is also exactly on the same page because Thomas is like, Oh, okay, great, let’s go. So I think it’s like we’re supposed to think like this happened. But also he understands what’s going to happen. You know what I mean? 


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: Like, okay, we’re going to reconnect. This is why we’re sort of pawning the kids off, you know, as the night goes on. It’s not super late, but it is dark. Margo and Ben play Lucy’s card games and Spencer is kind of playing, too, but they’re all at the table, like trying to play this Magic the Gathering type game. And Lucy says, You don’t want to know what happens when you get the rabid queen. And they’re like, What happens? She’s like, I told you, you don’t want to know. I’m not gonna tell you. And Spencer turns to Ben and says, I want to go. I want to go back to the hole in the ground. 


Alison Leiby: No. 


Halle Kiefer: And Ben’s like well got a lot of cool stuff. We could take another hike. There’s a lake. We don’t have to go that. And Spencer hisses at him. And Ben kind of rears back. But then Spencer says, okay, Ben, and kids do do weird stuff like that. 


Alison Leiby: They do weird stuff. So it’s like, again, like it would take me a minute to figure out how wrong they are. 


Halle Kiefer: I always remember this kid, Mark, in fifth grade. This is just like Jurassic Park was. I mean, every kid loves dinosaurs, but like, Jurassic Park, like he, I think all in fifth grade pretended to be a raptor the entire time. And at a certain point, it’s like, okay, that’s just his thing. 


Alison Leiby: Okay. 


Halle Kiefer: He’s just standing on his chair being a raptor. So if this kid starts to act like a raptor, I’d be like, oh, sure, he saw Jurassic Park, and now it’s his entire being. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. And that’s his entire personality, his existence, his future, all of it.


Halle Kiefer: Yeah. So this kid saw a hole in the ground was like, I only care about—


Alison Leiby: I love the hole. 


Halle Kiefer: What? Could we throw some more stuff in there? 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: What the fuck is happening with the hole? I kind of get it. The kids turn in for the night, and Ben’s like, I’ll be honest. Like, I love kids, but you have to see, like, look what happens to the parents. Like, that’s what I don’t like because Ellie and Thomas are each other’s throats. And Margo finally gets to tell, like, Oh, that’s not the kid’s fault. You won’t believe what they did. She’s like—


Alison Leiby: Imagine getting to tell that gossip. 


Halle Kiefer: The most satisfying gossip. 


Alison Leiby: It is. That is my that is a that is a great feeling. 


Halle Kiefer: And not simply swinging or a foursome or whatever. But a foursome with people you know, from college. 


Alison Leiby: People, you know. Right, right.


Halle Kiefer: There is nothing more satisfying than that. 


Alison Leiby: I mean, that is like it’s not like, oh, I heard this crazy story about people you don’t know. It’s like, oh no, you know, the players. 


Halle Kiefer: You know, the players of the game, my friend. So they get drinks and they they have like a vape. And they go around and she tells them all about it is like, and he’s like, Oh my God. He says the same thing he’s like, Wow, I could see Kyle doing that. But Katie did? And she’s like, I know. And I was like, that’s just a fun I just like a funny, realistic problem. I think like within. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: Like a real long term relationship of like, yes, well, we’ve flown close to the sun. What are we going to do? [laughter] So they’re smoking and drinking, and Margo turns to bed and was like, Well, while we’re on the topic, do you want to have kids? And they fucking just get into it. 


Alison Leiby: Okay. 


Halle Kiefer: And he’s like, basically, I feel like if I don’t want to pressure to have children, if you do not want to have children, which is what you communicated to me, I’m happy. Like I enjoy our life. I’m happy with where things are. And she says, I don’t want to. I don’t want to feel like it’s mine to figure out. And he says, well, what do you mean? And Margo says, Never mind. And Ben says, Okay. And that to me, I’m like, okay, if that’s the end of that conversation. Then you’re not ready to have a kid yet. 


Alison Leiby: No, no, you’re not. 


Halle Kiefer: Like if both of you were like, I can’t really have it out with you. About, like, what’s going on. And it’s obviously connected to the stuff with Ben that we’re going to find out later. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: Like, it’s like they, there’s something in their relationship that they can’t talk about, and unfortunately, it’s not as far as a botched foursome. You know, and Margo’s like, take’s a hit of the vape, and she’s like, I feel so connected. Like when I’m in nature, I just I love traveling so much and I don’t know in the city, I just feel so disconnected. And he says, you know, I think it’s also because you’re super high. She’s like, Wow, I really have a one hit wonder. And he tells her you took like six hits. You were out of your fucking mind, man. As the night goes on, they go to sleep. We see the wind sweep in and then just a ton of bugs start hitting the bug light. Bug after bug after bug in the morning, Ben makes pancakes and Margo staggers out. All the adults are hung over and she’s like, I need coffee and some Advil. And Margo gets a text from Ellie next door and says it worked like old times. Not even like our regular. It was like we were back in college. Like, this was a great idea. 


Alison Leiby: Oh good. 


Halle Kiefer: And Margo was like, okay, we’re back in business, you know? And she, Margo also texts. Do you mind if we come over later? We’re both hungover like, would you give the kids breakfast? Like is that okay? And Margo says, That’s totally fine. However, then Margo asks, Oh, have the kids woken up because it’s kind of late? And Ben says, Oh, I haven’t checked. I just assume they’re still asleep. Alison. Margo goes into the guestroom. 


Alison Leiby: Uh oh. 


Halle Kiefer: And the kids are gone. 


Alison Leiby: Nope. 


Halle Kiefer: I do think at this point my immediate assumption is, well, they went to the hole and they fell in. 


Alison Leiby: Obviously, they have gone to the hole. 


Halle Kiefer: They’ve gone to the hole and they are both dead. And I think, again, this movie does, as someone who enjoys these moments of realism. I really enjoyed both of them trying not to freak out and assume, oh, no, we’ve lost and potentially inadvertently killed—


Alison Leiby: Killed. 


Halle Kiefer: —our best friend’s kids. And so, again, like she’s checking the bathroom, you know Ben’s like they possibly went to play outside. They check out they go outside. I would have been calling 911. Like I. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: I lost my friend’s children. 


Alison Leiby: I would absolutely panic. 


Halle Kiefer: I think I’ve said this before about my father. One time we were at the mall. It was just me and him. I was like five. And I, like, pulled away from him. I was looking at like, do you remember when it was like Earth, remember where people cared about Earth Day, they probably care for their kids, but it was like an Earth Day thing with a big and bouncy earth ball. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: And I ran away to go back there and my father couldn’t find me and he—


Alison Leiby: Oh my God. 


Halle Kiefer: You remember he said he was like, Well, I guess I can’t go home again. Like you can’t you kids like. [laughter]


Alison Leiby: Yeah, you can’t—


Halle Kiefer: Oh, you can’t, like, go to my friend’s cabin and tell them we lost the children. You know—


Alison Leiby: No you got to just—


Halle Kiefer: Luckily he found me. It was all worked out. Yeah. And then Ben says, she runs back and says they’re not in the backyard. He says check and see if they’re playing over near the pond. This is why I can’t probably have children because it’s like I would be like, okay, so we will have to dredge the pond for their—


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: —little tiny dead corpses. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. Because now the pond and the pit are in play. 


Halle Kiefer: There are too many places for a child to fall—


Alison Leiby: And die. 


Halle Kiefer: It is like both Ben and Margo try to stay calm while freaking out and trying to be like. It’s like, Yeah. And losing your friend’s kids is way worse than losing your own. 


Alison Leiby: No, because that, like. No, I can’t. I can’t imagine. 


Halle Kiefer: I mean, if you’re, not that you’d be thrilled to lose your kids, but it’s like, well, at least they’re your kids. Not only did you lose kids, they’re somebody else’s kids. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: And they’re going to be as upset as you would be if they were your children. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. It’s so I feel bad when I, like, break like a plate. 


Halle Kiefer: Right. And imagine—


Alison Leiby: At someone else’s house. 


Halle Kiefer: Those, there are two plates and they’re both children. Margo realizes that the kids shoes are gone, so they definitely put on their shoes and set out. And Ben’s like, Oh, no, they wouldn’t. He’s piecing it together. And Margo says we wouldn’t what? He says, I. I’m just going to go. I’m afraid they went hiking down that path, so I’m going to just go check it out. And he’s like, okay, I’ll I’ll stay here and look for them. As soon as Ben makes it over the tree line, he’s literally just fucking sprinting because he knows. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: And he is running and he finds on the ground we saw the day before Lucy picks them yellow. I think they’re like pansies. These yellow flowers, was holding them. And he sees like a yellow flower kind of crumpled on the on the path. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: So he’s like, Oh fuck. So he’s running down the path, and he’s screaming their names, looking for them. And he makes it to the abandoned military fort. He crawls in the window. Of course he knew they’re standing over the fucking hole. 


Alison Leiby: Of course. There are. They love that hole.


Halle Kiefer: They love these kids love this hole. He starts chewing them out and they finally turn around and Lucy tells him, Es brillante. It’s brilliant, Alison. They turn back to the hole and they both fucking jump in. Alison, what would you do? 


[voice over]: What would you do? 


Alison Leiby: I mean, I’m just turning around and starting my life over somewhere else. I’m not going back to the cabin. 


Halle Kiefer: Yeah. 


Alison Leiby: I’m not going back to my wife or a partner or whatever. Like, I’m not I’m I’m fleeing and getting a new identity, and that’s it. There’s nothing you can do. 


Halle Kiefer: Yeah, I definitely feel like. Yeah, you have to completely abandon your old life. You have to give up everything from yourself, and you have to create a person who didn’t just watch this because, like, it’s not simply—


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: —the children are gone. It’s that you saw them both jump into a hole. 


Alison Leiby: You watched them jump into a hole. 


Halle Kiefer: Ben does basically what we’re saying, which is he collapses into the fetal position in absolute horror. 


Alison Leiby: I mean. Yeah, that’s kind of the first move. 


Halle Kiefer: What else would you do? And his phone rings. It’s Margo. He doesn’t pick up because he can’t tell her. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah, I mean, I wouldn’t. 


Halle Kiefer: And he peers over the whole. But it’s so deep, so it’s not like he can’t even climb down. You know what I mean. 


Alison Leiby: Right, right, right. 


Halle Kiefer: Now, that you want to come back to camp with both of your friends kids, dead bodies. But, you know what I mean.


Alison Leiby: At least it’s something. 


Halle Kiefer: It’s something.


Alison Leiby: It’s something. 


Halle Kiefer: Back at the house. Of course, Margo was just calling him over and over again, panicking. And we see Ben just sort of slowly walk back the path to in a fugue state. And finally, right as he’s getting to the tree line about to see the cabin Margo calls again he picks up and he’s about to tell her. And just then she looks over and Ellie walks out of her cabin waving, and Lucy and Spencer just burst out of that cabin playing tag. 


Alison Leiby: Okay. 


Halle Kiefer: So Ben again saw them jump into the hole, and now Lucy and Spencer are seemingly totally fine and emerging from their parents cabin. So Margo, who doesn’t know about the hole thing, says, Oh, thank God. Oh, she says, I thought we were going to find their little bodies floating in the lake. Yeah, that equally could have happened. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: That’s a different movie, but absolutely could have happened. Unfortunately, this puts Ben in a bit of a predicament. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: And Ben doesn’t really know, he emerges from the woods, and sees the kids. And of course, the question in his mind is how’d the hole do that, how’d that happen? 


Alison Leiby: How hole do?


Halle Kiefer: But Margo is so relieved and Ellie and Thomas are so just happy, happy to have had sex again. That they sort of dismiss Ben’s, like, weird. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: Disassociated state as, like, oh he’s hungover? Whatever. 


Alison Leiby: Sure. Tired. 


Halle Kiefer: And Margo doesn’t want to tell Ellie and Thomas that the kids went missing. They’re, like, we’re not gonna. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah, don’t. 


Halle Kiefer: No. Which is, unfortunately, probably how I would play it as well. No, I probably tell them I’d be honest.


Alison Leiby: Yeah I’d be like, Oh, my God, I did, like, again, this is why we’re not ready. You know? We just kind of like—


Halle Kiefer: Exactly. Ben, of course, does the classic movie move of going to the sink and splashing his face with water. And Ben goes to say hi to the kids who are sitting in the lawn and they’re just smashing bugs with a rock. And he’s trying to ask them like, okay, so do you guys go for a walk this morning? Like, did you walk back to the fort? Alison, they turn to each other and they whisper, It sounds like this, like clicking hissing insect like language. 


Alison Leiby: Don’t like that. 


Halle Kiefer: Ben say’s what are you doing? And she says.


[clip Briella Guiza]: A secret language. You want to know what he said to me? 


Halle Kiefer: And she hands on one of the yellow flowers that we saw her pick up earlier, and she says, Do you ever do this with buttercups? She says, Hold it under your chin. If it glows yellow, you have a secret. And I remember doing that. 


Alison Leiby: I remember doing that as well. 


Halle Kiefer: And Ben says, Did you go to the hole? I won’t be mad. I just really need you to tell me. And Lucy says, We both have a secret, Ben. You better play nice, or we might run away and join the circus. So, again, Ben’s secret is related to, you know, what his, what is going to emerge about him.


Alison Leiby: Okay. 


Halle Kiefer: Alison, both kids noses start bleeding, and Ben backs away, horrified and runs into the cabin. 


Alison Leiby: Tells someone that their noses are bleeding. 


Halle Kiefer: Well, he goes a step further. And Margo, because Margo follows him to be like, Are you okay? And he says, What I want to tell you sounds impossible. I saw both Lucy and Spencer jump into the pit, and I don’t think that’s really the kids out there. And Margo says, Okay, how are you feeling in general? 


Alison Leiby: A great question. 


Halle Kiefer: And Ben says, No, that’s not it’s not the same thing that was different. The thing they have in the past was different. This is different from that. I’m telling you what I saw and it’s different. And Margo’s like, you know what we had? They disappeared. It was really stressful. Why don’t you take a nap? The kids are fine. We’ve got them. Everyone’s safe. So just relax, take a minute, and then, you know, we’ll sort of meet up and we’ll talk about this. So again. He has had. As we find out, he has had moments of mental health crisis before. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: And so Margo was talking to him in an empathetic way of like, okay, I hear what you’re saying. Why don’t we take a beat? You can relax a minute and we’ll cycle back. But of course, now Margo’s like, okay, so he’s that’s what’s happening. He’s becoming manic or he’s having some kind of psychotic experience. So now she’s worried about that. And we see him go to the bathroom and take lithium. 


Alison Leiby: Okay. 


Halle Kiefer: So obviously, he’s medicated. He’s, you know, getting treatment for it. And suddenly Lucy is behind him and tells him, Ben, I want to play a game with you. 


Alison Leiby: No. 


Halle Kiefer: And outside the bathroom window, Spencer breathes on the glass and then draws a smiley face with two crossed out eyes. 


Alison Leiby: I didn’t like that in the trailer. 


Halle Kiefer: Unfortunately, Ben is not able. He’s not doesn’t have that much of a poker face. Not a poker face guy. Ben comes out and he says to Thomas, Do your kids ever scare you? And Thomas is like, Oh, constantly. Kids are extremely weird. Like they are like they are like, did you see when they—


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: —were playing with those dead birds? I was like, What the fuck? And Spencer, like, jumps up behind, then scares the beer out of his hand to sort of like punctuate it. But again, they’re scary in a kid way. Right. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: As they’re all sitting on the picnic table around the bonfire, Lucy comes up behind Margo and lifts a fireplace poker and says, Hey, look at this and brings it down on Margo’s head. But before she she can connect, Ben leaps up and screams at her. But because nobody else saw it. He just looks like he’s screaming at a child. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. For nothing. 


Halle Kiefer: Yeah. At the same time, Spencer offers him some chips from their table, and when Ben looks at it, it’s full of bugs and maggots. And then when he blinks, the bugs and maggots are gone. 


Alison Leiby: Okay. 


Halle Kiefer: Meanwhile, Lucy slaps open a beer against a table like her dad was demonstrating and pours a beer into the cup to hand to her dad. Just as Spencer shows Ben, he stole the bottle of lithium and it’s now empty. And it’s kind of how he put together. Like, I guess that’s what we’re taking from this. Ben slaps the beer out of Lucy’s hand and says, They put my lithium in your beer. Don’t drink that. You could overdose on it. 


Alison Leiby: Okay. 


Halle Kiefer: But now all the other adults are like, Wait, what? And he grabs the pill bottle from Spencer, and now it’s full. So again, it’s his medication’s still in there. And and Spencer is sobbing he says Ben hurt my hand when he grabbed the pill bottle and Thomas is pissed. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: And he takes the pill bottle, and he’s like, okay, you’re on mood stabilizers. What is going on? Who cares? To Margo’s horror, Ben tells them about the kids jumping in the pit, and he says, And I saw their little broken bodies at the bottom. Meanwhile, Margo was like, Do not say this. 


Alison Leiby: No, don’t. 


Halle Kiefer: He’s saying it in front of the children too. And immediately Ellie and Thomas were like, What are you talking about? And of course, then assuming again like he’s having a mental health crisis and it’s like, do not say that. And they are Ellie and Thomas send the kids away. But what they’re focusing on is the admission that the kids disappeared. They got lost there really were missing. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: And the idea that they were not immediately told. So it’s like even aside from the pit, they’re already mad, you know, and they’re chewing out Margo and Ben being like, how did you let them out of your sight? Like, this is absurd. Like, why wouldn’t you tell us? And Ellie says, You clearly don’t understand the responsibility. Like, that’s why you don’t really want kids. Like, Oh, because you’re traveling and you’ve a great career. Give me a fucking break. 


Alison Leiby: Right. 


Halle Kiefer: Meanwhile, Ben freaks out and he starts unloading. It’s like, Okay, well, we only have your creepy kids so you can save your shitty marriage after having a foursome. I said it. 


Alison Leiby: Ooh, okay.


Halle Kiefer: And he said, although it just sounded like a two and a half some to me. And Thomas storms away, and Ellie’s like, oh, wow. Okay, so I guess we’re putting it on the table in that case. Ben, I know about your manic episodes. I know how you lost another job. And it’s pretty clear to me that it’s not that Margo doesn’t want kids, is that she doesn’t want to have kids with you. And Margo slaps Ellie across the face. 


Alison Leiby: I mean, fair. 


Halle Kiefer: Ben storms away and is sort of accosted by Lucy and Spencer. And Lucy says, Look, do you want to know what happened this morning? Insectos muertos, dead bugs. 


Alison Leiby: Dead bugs. 


Halle Kiefer: And Ben’s like what the fuck are you talking about? But also, he does want to know what she was like. What happened? 


Alison Leiby: Right. 


Halle Kiefer: How did this happen? How did you jump in the hole? How are you here? What are you? But he can’t get a right answer because Spencer has taken, like the little shovel from the fireplace tools and just fucking swings and hits Ben with it. And in this struggle—


Alison Leiby: Fireplace tools are just weapons. 


Halle Kiefer: Exactly. They’re just there for people to be hit over the head or stabbed with. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: Completely. However, Ben’s, grabs the shovel and he tries to pull it out of Spencer’s grasp, but ends up hitting him hard in the sternum. And Spencer collapses and stops breathing. So I think we’re to think like, oh, he hit his heart or something. Like a freak accident. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. Yeah, yeah.


Halle Kiefer: And so his lips are turning blue. Margo runs in. Ellie and Thomas run in are panicking. They’re trying to do CPR. Alison, Spencer dies. 


Alison Leiby: Whoa. 


Halle Kiefer: And Thomas and Ellie turn on Ben and start screaming, like, Why would you do this? What the fuck happened? And he’s like, No, it was an accident. I didn’t do anything. And Ellie points like, Margo’s trying to calm it down. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: But Ellie basically physically shoves Ben out of the cabin, and Ben runs into the trees. And Margo calls 911, to get in touch with the police and hands Thomas the phone and Thomas is on the phone. My son is dead. Ben Winslow just murdered my son. So as you can imagine, Margo goes to the bathroom and immediately starts vomiting in the toilet. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. Yes. That is the obvious first response. That would be mine.


Halle Kiefer: We thought it was gonna be a fun week at the cabin?


Halle Kiefer: A fun week at the cabin. My long term partner, has inadvertently murdered a child after having some sort of psychotic break things, literally, we woke up and things were fine. And now a kid is dead. 


Alison Leiby: We’re in hell. 


Halle Kiefer: And she goes outside to sort of get some air. And Ben sort of runs around the back of the cabin trying to talk to her, and he’s hiding. He’s like, I did see the kids jump in the hole. I did see this, something took their place. Their bodies must still be down there. I just need to find their bodies. But she’s talking to him. It’s like, Ben, consider the fact that you not experiencing reality, right? 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: But he grabs her wrist and he’s like, No, come with me to the fort. We’ll find it. And he’s like, I will go. But when there’s nothing there, what will we do? What then? And he doesn’t have an answer. Alison, They head back to the airport and they look in the pit. There’s nothing there. 


Alison Leiby: Of course not. 


Halle Kiefer: And she says, like Ben, it didn’t this didn’t happen. And he’s like, No, I know what I saw. I’ll climb down there. An animals must have dragged them away like something must have happened or they fell into, like, a crevasse. Like, once I see it I’ll understand. I’ll find it and then I’ll understand. 


Alison Leiby: No. 


Halle Kiefer: She says to him, Ben. Everything that’s happened is just in your head. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: Spencer has died. Come back with me. I will be here for you. I will stay with you. The police said. Basically, you find out the police said it’s going to be a couple of hours, which does seem like what the police would do, like my child’s been murdered— 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. They’re like, we’ll get to it. 


Halle Kiefer: A child’s been murdered. We’ll be there in a minute. You know, she’s like, I will stand by you. I’ll be there. But there’s nothing here. We have to go back to the cabin. But he can’t leave. So she walks back as night falls. And I thought for sure, 100% thought he was going to jump. And I kind of wish she had because I would be like, oh. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: But night has fallen. When Margo gets back to the cabin, she. There’s a glass of wine that she left there, like, hours ago and just fucking chugs it. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: Suddenly Lucy is behind her and gives her a yellow flower. Margo’s like, Oh, honey, you should be with your parents, okay? And Lucy says, Don’t worry, he’s just playing. But Margo was assuming like, oh, you’re saying it because you’re traumatized as a child. 


Alison Leiby: Right. 


Halle Kiefer: And you’re like, My brother’s not dead. He’s just playing a game. And so she’s trying to comfort her and hug her. And Lucy says, Margo, I want to show you it’s in the woods and starts crying. 


Alison Leiby: No. 


Halle Kiefer: And she starts crying. So of course, Margo feels like, okay, sure, what are they, flowers like? So Margo says to follow her out. 


Alison Leiby: Don’t follow a child into the woods. 


Halle Kiefer: Luckily for Margo at least, Thomas sees them through the window and is in a rage. Like the idea like he because Ben has gone, he’s now, like, moving his rage on to Margo. 


Alison Leiby: To Margo. 


Halle Kiefer: Yeah. 


Alison Leiby: Understandably. 


Halle Kiefer: And he runs to get Lucy away from Margo. Alison, Ellie, who is, like, completely distraught and catatonic, sits next to Spencer’s body on the couch, and she sits and behind her, we see his eyes open and Spencer smiles. Alison, who will survive this film? 


[voice over]: Who will survive? 


Alison Leiby: Well, I guess it’s hard to kind of sus out who is alive. 


Halle Kiefer: Yes. That is the problem. 


Alison Leiby: I’m going to guess. Margo survives. Ben dies. The other guy. What’s his name? 


Halle Kiefer: Thomas. 


Alison Leiby: Thomas, kills him. 


Halle Kiefer: Okay. 


Alison Leiby: And then is killed. 


Halle Kiefer: And how about Ellie? 


Alison Leiby: And Ellie survives. I’m gonna guess the women survive and the men die. 


Halle Kiefer: Okay, great. And the kids, how do you think they’re coming out of this? 


Alison Leiby: I don’t know. I don’t know. Not good. 


Halle Kiefer: Not good. Margo was inside the cabin and outside. We hear Lucy ask Thomas, can I show you something in the woods? And her father follows her into the woods. Inside. Margo looks both Ellie and Spencer’s body are gone. Margo calls Thomas’s cell phone. Now that he’s like gone in the wood with Lucy and she hears his cell phone ringing and sort of goes out to the darkness to try to find him, to be like, Where the fuck is your wife and your son’s body? She hears it ringing the darkness but can’t find it. And we hear Thomas choking and gargling on blood in the dark. As his phone rings and rings. So he’s in the dark, bleeding out. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: Margo hears that like hissing chittering insect language and runs inside to call Ben because it’s like, well, at least—


Alison Leiby: Something. 


Halle Kiefer: Ben’s. Ben’s not right, but Ben’s at least somebody I can call. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: Ben is still standing over the hole. And he sees—


Alison Leiby: Fucking hole. 


Halle Kiefer: Sees Margo’s phone. He sees his phone light up with Margo’s call. But just as he picks it up, he looks down and it’s fine. He finally sees it. The brilliant green light shining out of the pit. 


Alison Leiby: Oh. 


Halle Kiefer: And he’s mesmerized. 


Alison Leiby: It would be mesmerizing to suddenly see a light shining out of a pit that you’ve seen multiple times. And that has had no lights. 


Halle Kiefer: It sure would. Inside the cabin. Margo runs around trying to look at all the rooms for anybody and finds a dying bloody Ellie. Underneath the children’s bed, and she hauls Ellie out only for Ellie to choke to death on her own blood in Margo’s arms. 


Alison Leiby: How? 


Halle Kiefer: Margo looks up to see at the end of the hallway. Spencer bloodied, all scratched up but alive. So I think he’s like, we’re going up pet cemetery with this. 


Alison Leiby: Okay, got it. Yes.


Halle Kiefer: Like he’s alive, but he is not alive. In fact, I would say there is something wrong with the children. 


Alison Leiby: There’s a lot wrong with the children. 


Halle Kiefer: And she says to him, what did you do to your mom, Spencer? And he smiles and his eyes go green. And I’m sorry. The kid who plays Spencer is so fucking cute. 


Alison Leiby: He’s so cute. 


Halle Kiefer: He’s so cute. And there’s a shot where you see him. David Mattle plays Spencer, and Briella Guiza plays Lucy. They’re both great, but he’s so adorable. And there’s a shot of him in the hallway. And it, look, it’s hard to make kids, I think, spooky and have it be authentic. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: But you see him, he looks so little like there’s a shot where he’s, like, menacingly coming down the hallway. 


Alison Leiby: He’s a little guy. 


Halle Kiefer: He’s just a little he’s like a fourth grader. And I was like. 


Alison Leiby: Aw. 


Halle Kiefer: But also, again, you could probably kick him in the head like. 


Alison Leiby: Right. 


Halle Kiefer: It’s like you could physically fight him. But they don’t do that because again. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah—


Halle Kiefer: That’s a problem with having a kid in a movie. So he advances on her and he looks he’s the cutest little bean, but he is out for blood. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah, yeah, yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: And she slams the door. And you hear Spencer starts to attack the door like a rabid animal, and she’s eventually able to get out of the bedroom. And sort of, like, as she leaves, Spencer enters and she runs around and traps him in the bedroom locks, like with a dustpan, which I thought was very smart, like using it to wedge—


Alison Leiby: Very smart. 


Halle Kiefer: —the doors so we can’t open it from the inside. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: Unfortunately, she runs into the living room and finds Lucy. And not only that, Alison, there’s a shadow falling across the window outside. And that shadow, it was a giant human sized praying mantis. 


Alison Leiby: What? 


Halle Kiefer: Which starts beating on the front door? 


Alison Leiby: I didn’t see that coming. 


Halle Kiefer: Me either. There was the talk of the bugs, and finally when the bug shows up, you’re like, okay. 


Alison Leiby: I know like bug stuff. But not human size praying mantis. 


Halle Kiefer: Yes, I completely agree. And Lucy says, You know, I never told you what happens when you play the rabid queen in the game. And Margo, meanwhile, was like, try to grab the car keys and hide as Spencer and Lucy sort of like gain control of the cabin. And they start counting to ten and they yell, ready or not, Margo, here we come. Meanwhile, Margo is hiding in one of the rooms and hears a front door open. We see the praying mantis slink into the room. 


Alison Leiby: No. 


Halle Kiefer: And suddenly Lucy appears next to her and she says we cut off her head. Alison. At this moment, the police, or what appears to be a park ranger finally arrives from the 911 call. Because, again, even when a child is dead, they’re not rushing over. 


Alison Leiby: No. 


Halle Kiefer: We’ll get there when we get there. He’s not going to not be dead when we get there. Wrong. He is not going to not be dead or I guess he’s still dead, he’s undead. Margo is able to get outside, but is again, much like in so many horror movies, is not making a ton of sense? So it’s like he’s not dead? Well, he was dead, but he’s awake, and he killed his mother and you know, she’s panicking. And so the ranger says, How about you wait here? And I’ll go check it out. And we see the ranger go inside and the ranger says, like, there isn’t a dead body of a boy or a dead woman like you just said, either. And we literally hear the ranger get attacked by the giant praying mantis and her corpse explodes through the sliding glass door. [laughter] And which I love, as Margo runs to try to get to Ellie and Thomas’s car so she’s able to get her hands on their keys. 


Alison Leiby: Okay. 


Halle Kiefer: Which presumably they left in their the other cabin. And before she can get in, the kids she has to slide under and hide under the car, and the kids clamber around the car looking for her. And because Margo’s no slouch, she silently takes off out her phone and calls Thomas’s cell phone in the woods. 


Alison Leiby: Okay. 


Halle Kiefer: Which sends the kids running. Finally she’s able to get in the car. Alison. She turns it on. She’s about to escape to freedom. And when the headlights come on, she sees Ben staggering into the yard and into the cabin. Alison. She gets out of the car and runs into the cabin after Ben. 


Alison Leiby: Don’t. Once you’re in the car, stay in the car. 


Halle Kiefer: Don’t go back. And I wrote, love dooms us all. Do you get? Drive away. If you ever see me staggering out of the woods. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. Same. 


Halle Kiefer: Stay in the car. 


Alison Leiby: Stay in the car. Save yourself. Go. 


Halle Kiefer: She runs to him and she apologizes. She’s like, I’m really sorry. I must apologize for not listen to you. The kids are, something is wrong with the children. They are trying to kill us. And also, there is some sort of bug monster afoot. 


Alison Leiby: Mm hmm. 


Halle Kiefer: We have to leave. And then Ben turns and says. 


[clip of Zach Gilford]: Why would we do that? No, no, no it’s beautiful. I didn’t understand why the kids were so drawn to it before. But now I do. I know why they followed it down. 


[clip of Alisha Wainwright]: I don’t know what you’re talking about, but we need to leave. We need to go. Now.


[clip of Zach Gilford]: The place that shines. And you can see it too. 


Halle Kiefer: Which is very Stephen King. Like, I feel like this is like like the idea of the place that shines. And she says, No, I’m not doing that. We have to go. And Ben tells her, I think we should settle down and start a family. 


Alison Leiby: I want to make the little bug babies. 


Halle Kiefer: You decided for us before, but now I’m weighing in. And he started, of course, advancing it on her. In this, in a very satisfying way goes, Margo we’ll make more of them, and we’ll make them together. Alison. She reaches down and grabs Ben’s machete from the initial hike. 


Alison Leiby: Yay. 


Halle Kiefer: And fucking brings it down into the meat of his shoulders, so sort of like the crook between the neck and the shoulder. Slams it into Ben. Drop. He drops. She runs outside only for Spencer to take one of his devil sticks and jam it through. Like the. The patios. Like the slats? 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: She trips over it. She falls and bashes her head on the steps, knocking herself out cold. Alison. When Margo wakes up, it’s nearing dawn and the kids are dragging her. Where else? 


Alison Leiby: The hole.


Halle Kiefer: To the pit. Margo wakes up in the abandoned fort, and she’s lying next to Ellie’s corpse. And she sees the kids standing over the pit, and they’re throwing the ranger’s body into the pit. And as they do, the pit sort of glows green, accepting their offering, processing the body. The bug queen eats it? I’m not exactly sure. We see the pit glowing green just as dawn lights are streaming in the broken roof. And then they drag their mother’s corpse to the pit and they throw it in. And Margo gets up. And you think she’s going to make a break for it? No, no, Alison. She runs up behind the kids and pushes them both in. 


Alison Leiby: Smart. 


Halle Kiefer: And the pit grows green. But the thing is, they already went in the is the pit. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. It’s not like it just, like, gives you a little bit more of an out. 


Halle Kiefer: Exactly. You have, buys some time, because I was like, What if you’ve made them doubly wrong? 


Alison Leiby: Well, they’re very wrong. 


Halle Kiefer: Unfortunately, Margo makes it back to the cabin, only to find Ben alive. And he has pulled the machete out of his own flesh. 


Alison Leiby: Jesus Christ. 


Halle Kiefer: And he advances on her only to be tackled by a deeply injured Thomas who is still alive, and has managed to fucking crawl out of the woods because he is a good man and a good father. 


Alison Leiby: Wow. 


Halle Kiefer: And look, I feel bad that he probably will never have a foursome again. He never got that redo that he deserved. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: He tackles Ben and he screams at Margo, Get out of here. And she does. She gets in the car, she fucking peels away. At that point I was like, Couldn’t you get Thomas into the into the car? 


Alison Leiby: Into the car too, like he just saved your life.


Halle Kiefer: Yes. And he’s literally fighting your undead husband on the fucking lawn. But she does a classic like she drives throughout the country road. Then of course, you start to sob. You know, it’s like, I must be far enough away from the child insect demons to, like, really allow myself to break down. Firstly, Alison, that’s not how these demons work, because when she looks up, she sees the kids and Ben holding hands, sort of hands across the world style. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah, yeah, yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: Across the road, and they are bloody and undead. 


Alison Leiby: Mow them over, run them over. 


Halle Kiefer: And on the dashboard she looks and there’s a bunch of yellow flowers and she holds them and then she fucking guns it Alison and she screams as she runs them down. And of course we, we cut right before she slams into them. There’s something wrong with the children. 


Alison Leiby: The children. The wrong children. 


Halle Kiefer: The children. Colon. Whatever’s wrong with them. Yes. So, Alison, what were some fatal mistakes you think were made? In There’s Something Wrong with the Children?


[voice over]: Fatal mistakes. 


Alison Leiby: Going in that building. 


Halle Kiefer: Yeah. 


Alison Leiby: None of this would have happened. 


Halle Kiefer: Once, they entered, it was all downhill. There’s nothing— [both speaking] Once you enter the abandoned facility.


Alison Leiby: Everything beyond that, like, could not be stopped or helped. It’s going. Don’t go in buildings. 


Halle Kiefer: First of all. 


Alison Leiby: And if buildings have holes in them, don’t hang out at the hole. 


Halle Kiefer: I remember in my hometown there was like an elementary school that was decommissioned but still standing, like in the downtown of like the town next to mine. And kids would break in there all the time and looking back, it’s like, did we all inhale asbestos? 


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: But like you’d break in, people would break in to do graffiti.


Alison Leiby: Oh yeah, for sure. 


Halle Kiefer: And I wasn’t even that kind of kid. It was just like a rural area. So I was like, Well, I’m not going to not go in an abandoned building and, like, walk around a little bit. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah I got to see what’s in there. 


Halle Kiefer: Yeah. 


Alison Leiby: So really, that would be the big one. 


Halle Kiefer: Yeah, 100%. Other than that, like, I’m definitely not going to say don’t have a foursome. Absolutely have a foursome. 


Alison Leiby: No. Have a foursome.


Alison Leiby: But you know, know that it might shift some things in your relationship. 


Halle Kiefer: Exactly. But it could be exciting, you know. 


Alison Leiby: Could be good. 


Halle Kiefer: It could be an interesting shift. 


Alison Leiby: Explore it. 


Halle Kiefer: And then I guess it’s like they did try to talk about having kids, but they couldn’t have the conversation. So at least knowing that they couldn’t have the conversation. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: They weren’t rushing into having children. So I think it’s like, well, they did they are doing the right thing, which is like, if we’re not ready, we’re not ready. 


Alison Leiby: Right. 


Halle Kiefer: So I think it was mostly letting those kids go in that building and be possessed by what do you think is in the pit or what do you think the pit is? 


Alison Leiby: Like mantis demons?


Halle Kiefer: Wait, say it again?


Alison Leiby: Mantis demon. Mantis demons.


Halle Kiefer: A mantis, a mantis demon. That makes the most sense because I was like—


Alison Leiby: That’s the most logical thing here. A mantis demon. 


Halle Kiefer: Because then when they said, it’s like a military thing. It’s like maybe the military inadvertently opened a portal, but then you’d think they’d be like, have more of a like a door—


Alison Leiby: Stay away or like, there it would be. Clearly something bad had happened there. And it’s like, nah, this is just a big hole. 


Halle Kiefer: Yeah, I think it’s just like a nature demon that. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: If you find it. 


Alison Leiby: Lives out there


Halle Kiefer: It, it, it. Replaces your children with some sort of bug entity. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: I agree. And then finally, where would you put There’s Something Wrong with the Children on the spooky scale. 


[voice over]: A spooky scale. 


Alison Leiby: Feels like a five. 


Halle Kiefer: Okay, good. Yeah, I’m going to say I’m going to say three. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: Just because again, I have, the kids of it all, but I thought it was very beautifully shot and I enjoyed it. 


Alison Leiby: Yes. 


Halle Kiefer: So in terms of like enjoyment, I would say a seven. Like I love when you find about the foursome, I’m like, okay, now we’re getting interesting. But then again, I don’t want to see a child really be hurt or terrorized. 


Alison Leiby: No. 


Halle Kiefer: At the same time. They’re simply too cute and you have to go full Esther, you know? 


Alison Leiby: Yeah, yeah yea. 


Halle Kiefer: It’s like that was, you know that there that’s obviously the characters an adult playing a child so that’s complicated too. Kid’s too cute to be scary. 


Alison Leiby: Too cute to be scary. 


Halle Kiefer: But I did enjoy it. And if this is definitely something where I don’t think you could watch it, but someone who can’t handle like gore or I think there’s a lot of people—


Alison Leiby: It seems—


Halle Kiefer: Who could watch this and would be fine. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah, yeah, yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: So if you’re more of like dipping your toe in, I think you could do this one. 


Alison Leiby: I agree. 


Halle Kiefer: Yeah. Well, thank you so much. We hope you’re actually having a vacation as you’re listening to this. 


Alison Leiby: Yeah. 


Halle Kiefer: Or taking some time for yourself. Um, I really wanna go to a cabin now. I’m going to figure out how to do that. 


Alison Leiby: You can do it. 


Halle Kiefer: Thank you. So can you. 


Alison Leiby: Thank you. And I. If you saw the live show. Thank you. If you are still in the window where you can do that and you know, next month, whole new theme, all new movies. 


Halle Kiefer: Hell yeah. 


Alison Leiby: We love you. 


Halle Kiefer: We love you so much. 


Alison Leiby: And if you could do one more thing. 


Halle Kiefer: Please. 


Alison Leiby: Please. Keep it spooky. [music plays] Don’t forget to follow us at Ruined podcasts and Crooked Media for show updates. And if you’re as opinionated as we are, consider dropping us a review. Ruined is a Radio Point and Crooked Media production, we’re your writers and hosts Halle Kiefer and Alison Leiby. The show is executive produced by Alex Bach, Sabrina Fonfeder and Houston Snyder, and recorded and edited by Kat Iossa. From Crooked Media our executive producer is Kendra James with production and promotional support from Ari Schwartz, Kyle Seglin, Julia Beach, Caroline Dunphy, and Ewa Okulate.