The Hunt | Crooked Media
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April 25, 2023
Ruined with Alison Leiby and Halle Kiefer
The Hunt

In This Episode

Halle and Alison will follow Betty Gilpin anywhere to ruin The Hunt.

 

 

TRANSCRIPT

 

[theme music]: If scary movies give you dread. Keep you up late night in bed. Here’s a podcast that will help you ease your mind. We’ll explain the plot real nicely. Then we’ll talk about what’s frightening. So you never have to have a spooky time. It’s Ruined. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Hi, everybody. Welcome to Ruined. I’m Halle. 

 

Alison Leiby: And I’m Alison. 

 

Halle Kiefer: You know, and this is a podcast where we ruin, a horror movie. Just for you. 

 

Alison Leiby: Just for all of you. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Alison, how are you doing? 

 

Alison Leiby: I’m. I’m doing all right. How are. How are you? Any. Any new horrors of the week for you to deal with, aside from the ongoing nightmare that is living in 2023 America? 

 

Halle Kiefer: Oh boy, that’s you’re covering a lot of ground with that. You know I there is a spider in my bathroom and I keep trying to—

 

Alison Leiby: I hate to see it. 

 

Halle Kiefer: —I don’t want to squish it. I don’t it’s too you know, what is it’s so big, it feels like. 

 

Alison Leiby: How big? 

 

Halle Kiefer: And this pathological. Like a nickel?

 

Alison Leiby: Like a quarter? A nickel?

 

Halle Kiefer: Not a quarter, I’d be dead. No, it’s I would say a nickel but—

 

Alison Leiby: Nickel’s pretty big for a bathroom spider. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah. And I presume it’s but then I’m like I don’t know enough about spiders and I do know—

 

Alison Leiby: I don’t know anything about spiders. [laughs]

 

Halle Kiefer: At Crooked our, the CEO’s dog got bit by a brown recluse spider and had to be rushed to the vet. 

 

Alison Leiby: Oh no. 

 

Halle Kiefer: I don’t think it’s a brown recluse because I googled those. I think it’s a wolf spider, but I can’t catch it. And I it feels it’s almost like because it’s so big, it feels like it has a soul. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah, there is like—

 

Halle Kiefer: It’s almost like a little like it’s a fruit fly. I’d kill it. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: It’s like big enough that I’m like, you’re a person of some kind—

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah 

 

Halle Kiefer: —to me there. 

 

Alison Leiby: There is like a bug size that once you’re there, you’re like. Oh, boy, there’s a lot happening inside of you. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah. 

 

Alison Leiby: It’s more than just like, a being that dies every three days anyways. Like that, like, like fruit flies—

 

Halle Kiefer: Right. 

 

Alison Leiby: —only live for a couple of days, so you’re like, I don’t know. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Born to fucking die, you know what I mean? Aren’t we all just fruit flies out here Alison? 

 

Alison Leiby: This is true. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Fucking and dying. But yeah, so it’s sort of become a companion of mine, and then I lost track of it, but I know it’s in there and it has become my foe and my good friend. 

 

Alison Leiby: You don’t need— 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah, other than that. 

 

Alison Leiby: You don’t need an enemy in the bathroom. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Well, I’m my own enemy in the bathroom there Alison [laughter] I’ll tell you that right now. Other than that, I don’t know. I’m just working. I don’t. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: I’m going to take off a week of work at the end of April. I think this—

 

Alison Leiby: Oh that’s fun. 

 

Halle Kiefer: —will be coming out then. 

 

Alison Leiby: Mm hmm. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And I’m just to do a little staycation. 

 

Alison Leiby: Oh I love that. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah. Work on the movie we’re writing. [laughter] And, you know, I just really try to put things together, which I’m excited about. What about you? Anything horrifying happen to you? Anything—

 

Alison Leiby: Kind of. 

 

Halle Kiefer: —dark and macabre? 

 

Alison Leiby: Not kind of just something living in my brain that’s terrorizing me. It’s that I live in a rather big apartment building. Like it’s not a walk up like it’s seven storeys, and we have an elevator and all that. And we get like notices sometimes where it’s like, oh, like, you know, we have to shut off the water, blah, blah, blah. But like, we got one that was like just a reminder to please, like, respect your neighbors from a sound standpoint, that means no loud music. They gave us like, they were like between 9 p.m. and 7 a.m.. Like you really shouldn’t be making loud noises. That includes stomping around and like, dropping weights and like, I do not stomp around. If I’m in here, I’m sitting and I don’t have hand weights in here. But I am a little and I have no idea who is complaining or who’s talking about. Like it’s, you know, it’s hard when you got the building wide email to not be like it’s me. 

 

Halle Kiefer: I would assume. Absolutely.

 

Alison Leiby: In the words of Taylor Swift, I’m the problem. It’s me. But I’m afraid that it’s Rizz because he—

 

Halle Kiefer: No. Oh, because he jumps on the ground.

 

Alison Leiby: Because he like, sprints around and like, jumps on and off, like high surfaces at really annoying hours. And I’m wondering if my downstairs neighbor is hearing, you know, it’s like he’s little, he’s a little cat, but like, it’s still like a thud. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Right? If you were dropping a 5 pound weight. It would still make a noise. 

 

Alison Leiby: Exactly. And like, he’s not as dense as a weight, so it probably wouldn’t be quite it’s probably still different. But like I do, I do have this fear. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Leave him alone. Just post a big, crazy handwritten sign, leave my cat alone. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. I’m like, it’s Rizz. He’s living his life. Do not bother him if he has 4 a.m. zoomies where he has to parkour around the apartment like a maniac. Like I can’t really stop that. [laughter]

 

Halle Kiefer: And why? My God, it’s his only pleasure in life. Let him just run around. 

 

Alison Leiby: Right. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah. I think you got to go on the offense. I think you got to go there with a bunch of crazy signs. I think you, you got to be accusing other people. You got to just—

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: —don’t take it on yourself, you— 

 

Alison Leiby: I got to control this narrative. 

 

Halle Kiefer: 100%. And I want to see, like, it looks like it could be written in blood. Like I want signs, like my cats allowed to run. My cat’s name is Rizz. He has a tuxedo. Like, really like we said, how you were afraid of the birds and the tree outside. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: I think you go full New York. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah just [both speaking] be a psycho in the building. Yeah. Because I just like, yeah, I hope it’s like I’m sure it’s actually somebody playing music and having people over. Like, I’m sure it’s not actually my eight pound cat that’s like ruining somebody’s life. But he. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Right. 

 

Alison Leiby: It might be. And I just, like, don’t want that to be true because like, I actually not even because I like don’t want him to get yelled at I guess is my fear but like I can’t stop it.

 

Halle Kiefer: Right there’s simply nothing you can. 

 

Alison Leiby: Like I’m not going to put him in a cage. I’m not going to like, you know, he’s a cat. He’s free rolling around. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah. And I do like the idea that the super would come and scream at your cat and tell him to knock it off. 

 

Alison Leiby: Like Rizz, knock it off, get in line. But I’m like, I’m like, look, I would love if he would not be running around and jumping on and off things in the middle of the night. [laughs] It would make my life easier. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Well. 

 

Alison Leiby: So, yeah, I’ll update everybody, as you know, as this unfolds. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Thank you. 

 

Alison Leiby: If it becomes a repeated I don’t know if I ever find out that it is me, I will definitely own up to that and Rizz and I will take the necessary measures to right this horrible wrong that he might be causing. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Do you think it’s because we’re women that we both immediately we be like I it was me. I did the bad thing. I have to repent. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Or is it like just like an American thing? Because I know I would do the exact same thing. Like I it was me. I probably I flushed the toilet too hard and the building exploded. Like—

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah right. It’s just—

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah. 

 

Alison Leiby: —I think it’s like I think that there is part of it is being women I think part of it is being American. I think part of it is just like our personalities of being like vaguely like rule following people. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Boo to our personalities. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. So I don’t know. But Rizz is, you know, he’s resting in a circle right now, so. He’s so fuzzy

 

Halle Kiefer: This reminds me of, I think we’ve talked about this on the pod, so I apologize for repeating myself though. If you listen to I listen to Trixie & Katya’s podcast, which is so funny. They tell the same stories over and over again, and I never get tired of hearing them. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: So I’m going to channel that energy. But this is years ago. I am I, I had OCD like symptoms, which I’m not gonna lie, cleared up when I came out. Take that for what it will what you will. And I was obsessed with like leaving the stove on because it was doing a lot of cooking. 

 

Alison Leiby: Oh. 

 

Halle Kiefer: I was living like I had a studio. And so.

 

Alison Leiby: I panic every time I leave the house because of that. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah. And there was one day I was going out to Queens. I was not going. It wasn’t like, I can get home really quickly. 

 

Alison Leiby: Right. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And I was like, fuck, I cooked last night. Did I leave the, like, convinced I left the oven on. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: I get to work and open up my laptop and a building has exploded because of a gas explosion. It was the one that was on Second Avenue years ago.

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah, yeah, I remember that. Horrifying.

 

Halle Kiefer: And that was like, yeah, like the landlord was like basically stealing gas and then, like, reconnected it in a way—

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: —that was like it was a horrible situation. 

 

Alison Leiby: It was bad. 

 

Halle Kiefer: People died. In that moment. Alison I knew it was my building and I knew it was like I was like, well. 

 

Alison Leiby: Well. 

 

Halle Kiefer: I did, it was me. 

 

Alison Leiby: Proven right. 

 

Halle Kiefer: I have to go to prison forever. And then it wasn’t. But the moment of conviction still stays with me of like this was my fault. And I did this. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. It’s I think it’s a very human reaction. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Boy, are we dumb. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. We have another live show coming up. Our online live show is coming up Sunday, April 30th at 7 p.m. Eastern, 4 p.m. Pacific. And we are ruining The Pope’s Exorcist. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Directed by Julius Avery, starring Russell Crowe as Father Gabriele Amorth. Great pope—

 

Alison Leiby: Oh. Great name. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Pope’s exorcist’s name. And I think like the like the the title implies he is that exorcist—

 

Alison Leiby: Mm hmm. 

 

Halle Kiefer: —of the pope and perhaps for the pope. [both speaking] Oh. Fingers crossed. You know, I got to imagine the pope becomes possessed in this. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah—

 

Halle Kiefer: If not, what the fuck are we doing? 

 

Alison Leiby: Seriously? 

 

Halle Kiefer: And we are in a real pope moment, a real nun moment. 

 

Alison Leiby: Sure. 

 

Halle Kiefer: I feel like the Pope’s Balenciaga AI coat, which. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Again. 

 

Alison Leiby: C-nt.

 

Halle Kiefer: C-nt. 

 

Alison Leiby: Get tickets at moment.co/ruined for April 30th at 4 p.m. Pacific. 7 p.m. Eastern. That’s such a backwards, terrible way of saying that for somebody who’s on the East Coast and we’ll have all the fun, all the fun of our regular online live shows, so get tickets for that. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Alison, thank you for keeping us on track. 

 

Alison Leiby: Always. 

 

Halle Kiefer: That was excellent. That was truly exceptional. 

 

Alison Leiby: Also never. [laughs]

 

Halle Kiefer: No I know. That’s why I my jaw fucking dropped. That was incredible—

 

Alison Leiby: —just to do administrative work. 

 

Halle Kiefer: But we did it, and I couldn’t be happier. 

 

Alison Leiby: Did it. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And we couldn’t be happier to have you join us for our live shows, which are always a lot of fun. 

 

Alison Leiby: They’re a blast. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Oh God. And oh The Popes— I as a Catholic. 

 

Alison Leiby: Mm hmm. 

 

Halle Kiefer: When I see the word pope with the word exorcist, you know, I’m signing up for it. 

 

Alison Leiby: I just think that Catholicism is so right for horror like. 

 

Halle Kiefer: It is—

 

Alison Leiby: Judaism isn’t quite it’s like, yeah, there’s like dybbuks like, there’s like stuff. But like, Catholicism is just like, it’s perfect for it. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah, It’s funny. Someone was tweeting something, which is also, I think, part of this. It’s like when someone you find out someone’s raised Catholic, what they’re really telling you is I definitely have a kink and it’s one of the weird ones. [laughter] And there is something about Catholicism because it is so dark and so morbid and it’s so early. You you’re you’re entered into a situation of sin and repentance. 

 

Alison Leiby: Mm hmm. 

 

Halle Kiefer: I just don’t think that’s good for the human brain. Certainly wasn’t for mine. 

 

Alison Leiby: Nope. 

 

Halle Kiefer: That’s why I thought the oven blew up. I was like—

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Well it’s on me. God, God punished me— 

 

Alison Leiby: My fault and I must—

 

Halle Kiefer: For using my oven and yeah. Now people are dead. That’s on me. I’m a I’m a, I’m a monster. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: I am a creature. And I have to go tell a priest about it. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: So come and again, you could tell a priest about it together at on our live show. But the movie we are doing this week is The Hunt, which of course, stars Betty Gilpin. It’s written by Nick Cuse and Damon Lindelof. 

 

Alison Leiby: Mm hmm. 

 

Halle Kiefer: It was directed by Craig Zobel. And if you recall this had a whole sort of like kerfuffle. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah, there was a lot of controversy. And even before we get into it, I would like to plug Betty Gilpin book. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Oh okay. 

 

Alison Leiby: It’s a book of essays called All the Women in My Head. She is not only an incredible actress, she is an absolutely brilliant writer. I read it in—

 

Halle Kiefer: Oh okay. 

 

Alison Leiby: —one day. She’s so, so funny. It’s so like, I think for women. But also like anybody kind of just living in the world, like she just has such great insights about like what it’s like to be alive and what it’s like to be depressed and what it’s like to have a body. And she’s just really great. And like I could not say more good things about that book, so. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Oh, okay, good, thank you for—

 

Alison Leiby: Get it on bookshop.org. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah. Thank you for hyping. I don’t think I ever heard about that. 

 

Alison Leiby: Oh, it’s so good. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Wonderful. Okay. 

 

Alison Leiby: But yeah, this movie, I remember the contro— Because it was supposed to come out earlier and then like I believe the right kind of tried to shut it down. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yes. 

 

Alison Leiby: And I know there were production things and then it ended up coming out like. And she writes about the release of this movie in her book and how like challenging it was and how she feels about it. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah. So if you remember, this was during Trump’s reign of terror. Basically, the issue this was like this is August 2019 is sort of when this first—

 

Alison Leiby: Mm hmm. 

 

Halle Kiefer: —started to become an issue and it lasted for months like. So in the movie they make a reference to deplorables. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And that, of course, was a reference to Hillary Clinton using the term basket of deplorables to describe Trump supporters. I have no problem saying now absolutely that’s what ended up being happening. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: I mean, like if you’re if you’re gonna look me in the fucking face and say that wasn’t fucking deplorable what all these motherfuckers believe? You’re wrong. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. Wrong. 

 

Halle Kiefer: But it is interesting. Yeah. Basically, like right wing, you know, outlets caught up and they’re like, oh my God. So the premise of it is fundamentally like, there are these “deplorables,” quote unquote, you know, people from rural, specifically people from rural America who have written something negative about America’s elite in this movie who is sort of embodied by Hilary Swank and and sort of. But of course, the joke of it is, is that all of these elite, while they may claim to be liberal and have these right minded ideas, are also because of their wealth, complete monsters. 

 

Alison Leiby: Right. 

 

Halle Kiefer: So the deplorables are, of course, the victors. And of course it turns out they are also more complicated. So what the introduction to the idea, much like every fucking horror movie is. Yeah, you get the logline or you see one word. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah word. 

 

Halle Kiefer: That’s not what a fucking movie is. 

 

Alison Leiby: Right. It’s so much. It’s good. It’s 90 minutes. You read one sentence like there’s going to be more going on than just what you, yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah. So, you know, and we all know that now. But yeah, Universal, like, essentially canceled it for a while and like, they just didn’t want to deal with it. And, you know, they did end up releasing it. And I believe it was re— Yeah it was supposed to, it came out in March of 2020. So then it was—

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: —like it got delayed. Then when it did come out, it was like it was like the pandemic—

 

Alison Leiby: It was like to nothing. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Exactly. So there was and this is just funny because I found this article was like Jason Blum, like basically is like, oh, the the controversy tanked the movie. It’s like, well sure, it delayed the movie but what tanked the movie is COVID. 

 

Alison Leiby: The pandemic. 

 

Halle Kiefer: The pandemic. Which tanked so many fucking movies. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: But you know I think much like everything on right wing media, you kind, you do have to consume or interact with content to understand what the fuck we’re talking about. Obviously, it’s not about just hunting Trump supporters—

 

Alison Leiby: Right.

 

Halle Kiefer: You know. Across America, it is also about that. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: But you know, in a way where they are characters, they are embodied and they have to, you know, sort of rise above in their own way. So and Betty Gilpin is our main character. She’s fucking so good in this. 

 

Alison Leiby: She’s so good. 

 

Halle Kiefer: I wanted to see her in because I saw I didn’t conclude, but I watched a little bit of—

 

Alison Leiby: Glow? 

 

Halle Kiefer: Glow. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: I just was not in the mood for it. 

 

Alison Leiby: Sure. 

 

Halle Kiefer: I like wrestling, but it just wasn’t my vibe. And I don’t really watch dramas like I watch horror and I watch comedy. 

 

Alison Leiby: Comedies. I watched Glow and was a big fan. Plenty of missteps and obviously criticisms. But like, she is undeniably a powerhouse actress in it. 

 

Halle Kiefer: A fucking star. And this movie because it is a horror movie, but it is an action horror. 

 

Alison Leiby: Mm hmm. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Made me want to see Betty Gilpin in her taking. You know what I mean? 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: I want to see her fucking kicking ass, you know. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And she does a lot of TV yeah she’s doing Mrs. Davis, but I guess she doesn’t do a lot a ton of oh, she’s in The Tomorrow War, which I haven’t seen. I guess I could watch that and see her kicking ass. Is it worth it? Yeah. I’ll watch The Tomorrow War. And just to see Betty Gilpin. 

 

Alison Leiby: Sure. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And I absolutely will watch Mrs. Davis now that I. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Know that it’s about nuns. But yeah, so the controversy again, looking back [laughs] simpler times. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: You know what I mean, it feels like ah to be like before the pandemic be concerned about that kind of shit like. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Ridiculous. But let us begin. We always I like to have Alison watch the trailer. Alison, what did you think of the trailer of The Hunt? 

 

Alison Leiby: I mean, fun. It’s, like, so nice to see, like, comedy people in. And I know that this is like, satirical and I feel like I’ve seen a lot of, like, clips of this movie just because it was so controversial. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah. 

 

Alison Leiby: There was so much, like, released kind of like to addr— Like I felt I feel like it’s very familiar. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yes. 

 

Alison Leiby: But like Glenn Howerton and I forget the name of the actor who’s in Veep who plays like Selena’s boyfriend for a while. Like, there’s just so many, like, good people in this. 

 

Halle Kiefer: We’ve got yeah, we’ve got Ike Barinholtz, we’ve got Emma Roberts. 

 

Alison Leiby: Ike Barinholtz. Fabulous.

 

Halle Kiefer: Sturgill, Sturgill Simpson. 

 

Alison Leiby: Mm hmm. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Ethan Suplee I think is how you pronounce it. 

 

Alison Leiby: Mm hmm. 

 

Halle Kiefer: He’s been in everything. Wayne Duvall. Yeah, a really fun mix of character actors and. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Amy Madigan. Oh yeah. A cast of thousands. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And people that you’re, whether, whatever your feelings about this movie, you’re glad they’re getting work. That’s what I thought. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah, yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: [both speaking] I’m glad Glenn Howerton’s getting this. Exactly. And then, Alison, how, we also like to take a baseline scary. How scary do you find the concept of hunting humans for sport? 

 

Alison Leiby: I mean, I don’t like it. 

 

Halle Kiefer: I don’t hate it. 

 

Alison Leiby: You don’t hate it. 

 

Halle Kiefer: I would be if someone were like, I would hunt you for sport. And if you escape I would give you—

 

Alison Leiby: There wouldn’t be a lot of sport to hunting me. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah, I guess I’m really giving myself a lot of credit. 

 

Alison Leiby: You block off the whole afternoon. It probably takes 4 minutes. [laughs] Like, it’s just not. I’m not. I’m not running. [laughs]

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah. If I get if I got like, a little bit of lead time, I would just hide under, like, a bush. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Realistically, yeah. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah I’d be a hider. 

 

Halle Kiefer: I would not want to hunt a human. 

 

Alison Leiby: No. 

 

Halle Kiefer: But to be hunted if there was some sort of cash prize. 

 

Alison Leiby: Mm. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Would I do it? I probably would. 

 

Alison Leiby: I mean. It’s giving a little Hunger Games. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yes. And I believe—

 

Alison Leiby: Which is a different, you know, has a whole different take but. Yeah. It’s scary. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah. It’s like I would say Hunger Games is not pro—

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: —hunting people for sport. Oh yeah it reminds me of The Running Man. 

 

Alison Leiby: Mm hmm. 

 

Halle Kiefer: The Stephen King book or I guess it’s Richard Bachman. But yeah, so I think that’s sort of where we’re starting. It’s an oft visited idea, like something that is terrifying. And I think for me or, you know, there’s so many different films and TV shows about this, it does pose a challenge to making it scary, you know. 

 

Alison Leiby: Mm hmm. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Like you really have to step it up in order for it to be anything, whether this film does or not well, we’ll get to it at the end. In the meantime, would you like to guess the twist for 2020’s The Hunt, Alison? 

 

[voice over]: Guess the twist. 

 

Alison Leiby: I mean, from her book, I know that, like she seems like a smaller character and then ends up being kind of like the hero of this movie. So I’m going to guess like that the like the the people who they gathered who are, you know, I would assume, like stand ins for Trump supporters and are good people. And the elite liberals are bad people. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yes, you are correct to think that. I do feel like—

 

Alison Leiby: That might not be like the big twist. 

 

Halle Kiefer: —they sort of bobble a lot of that. Where it’s sort of like if you just got another pass on the script, maybe we could have clarified some of that a little bit. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: But that’s fine. You know what I mean. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: I certainly don’t I don’t demand that much of any films. To be fair, so let’s begin ruining The Hunt. We see Hilary Swank. She’s our, you know, our executive, our CEO. Her name is Athena, and she’s texting her group chat of all coastal elites. 

 

Alison Leiby: Hmm. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And they talk about like, oh, do you see what the rat fucker in chief, Donald Trump, you know, what he was doing today like, oh, my God, day ruined, hate it, you know, and everyone’s like, texting, whatever. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And finally, Athena says, at least the hunt is coming up. Nothing better than going out to the manor and slaughtering a dozen deplorables. And we see another character. We see like a list of names one of them Miranda, Miranda says we talked about not discussing the hunt on text and everyone’s like, viva la hunt, you know, replying whatever. Cut to a, an amount of months later, we see Richard, played by Glenn Howerton, wake up on a plane to imm— Like waking up to immediately be rude to a flight attendant. 

 

Alison Leiby: I mean, perfect. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Like there’s not a moment where he is not awake and not being rude to a flight attendant. 

 

Alison Leiby: He’s so great. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Perfect for that. He’s so funny. And she offers him caviar. But he’s like, you know, I just had fish. I had that last, I actually had caviar last night. Do you have like a Mediterranean plate with some grilled vegetables, or like maybe small fish. And she says well again no, we’re in an airplane so we don’t have a full kitchen. 

 

Alison Leiby: [laughs] Kind of just whatever’s here. 

 

Halle Kiefer: So, yeah, absolutely not. And she said, I can get you a glass of champagne. And he’s like, oh, my God, is that champagne the 1907 Heidsieck? And she says, oh, I don’t think so. He’s like— 

 

[clip of Glenn Howerton]: A German sub sank a ship on the way to Czar Nicholas II a couple of years back they found the wreck and a case of the 1907 Heidsieck. Athena bought three bottles at 250 K per. And no one even knows what the stuff tastes like. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And again, the flight is like, no, it’s just regular champagne. I’m not giving— 

 

Alison Leiby: Whatever’s—

 

Halle Kiefer: —you whatever the fuck you’re talking about. [laughter] Like no it’s not this.

 

Alison Leiby: No. It’s not that. 

 

Halle Kiefer: However, she starts to pour him and in the classic movie moment over pours and he’s like you’re over pouring. But then he looks up and she’s staring at the back of the plane. Everyone turns and we see everyone who’s seated there is one of the coastal elites from the text chain. 

 

Alison Leiby: Mm hmm. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And we see a bearded man in a flannel shirt. Again, one of our our are real Americans. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Our regular fucking Americans, staggering, still half drugged out of like a closet in the back of the plane, shouting and like confused. And they all jump up. And so we’ve got Ted, Liberty, Martin, the flight attendant, and Richard and they go, Ted, who is a doctor, goes over to the man and he’s like, what’s your name? And then the guy says I’m Randy, doesn’t even know where he is, doesn’t know so he says, why am I here? Ted said, don’t worry, we’re on an airplane. I think you’re having some sort of episode. He gets a towel and lays him down. Is like, I’m going to have you lie down in the aisle. And he says, to the flight attendant, can you hear me a pen? And he tells Randy, I’m going to put you back to sleep now because you got up a little too early. And he takes the pen and I thought I was going to ram it in his eye. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Alison he stabs it in Randy’s throat, which doesn’t immediately kill him. But then it just starts like it starts sending—

 

Alison Leiby: Spurting blood. 

 

Halle Kiefer: —a geyser of blood across—

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah, obviously you’re a doctor. 

 

Halle Kiefer: I was like—

 

Alison Leiby: You should know that that’s what’s going to happen. 

 

Halle Kiefer: I was like, I’ve never killed someone. I absolutely know you stab it in the eye. 

 

Alison Leiby: Of course. 

 

Halle Kiefer: What are you stabbing in his throat, also the force you need to get through the neck. 

 

Alison Leiby: The thr— Yeah, the eye is easier. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Come on, come on Ted. 

 

Alison Leiby: Use your brain. 

 

Halle Kiefer: The first time you killed somebody or something. 

 

Alison Leiby: Work smarter, not harder. 

 

Halle Kiefer: So obviously Randy doesn’t immediately die. He’s able to. He grabs, the flight attendant has dropped the champagne bottle, he grabs it, bashes Ted in the face with it, shattering it and then has is enraged, drugged, bleeding and has a broken champagne bottle. So he’s like going after everyone. He turns around. And Athena has arrived from another compartment in the plane and jams her stiletto heel into Randy’s eye. Incapacitating him. And everyone’s kind of shocked and covered in blood. But we see Ted drag Randy to the back and throw him back in the closet and says fucking redneck. And before he dies, we see Randy whispering, help me. But the other woman in the closet with him is already knocked out, right? That woman who is well, most of the characters as they won’t be around for that long, are just giving monikers. So the woman who wakes up next to him, her name is Yoga Pants. 

 

Alison Leiby: Mm hmm. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Is played by Emma Roberts. She wakes up in a field and she has sort of a like a gag—

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: —padlocked to her head, which yeah you saw in the trailer. That to me, that is such a potent horror moment that I was kind of thrilled. I was like, ooh, to wake up in a field with a gag padlocked to your head. Fucking terrifying. 

 

Alison Leiby: That’s pretty scary. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And you’re also just dressed for yoga, you know, like, you—

 

Alison Leiby: Right. 

 

Halle Kiefer: —clearly were not planning to be out here. And she looks over and she sees across the stream another woman, Betty Gilpin, whose name is Crystal, also trying to get her gag off. She sort of shouts to Crystal but Crystal, walks off on her own. Just then Yoga Pants sees another guy on the top of the hill, and she kind of runs up and she sees in a clearing all these different captives, all with gags, walking out of different areas of the forest towards the middle of the clearing, which has a gigantic box. 

 

Alison Leiby: Mm. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Like a box big enough to put a car in. 

 

Alison Leiby: Okay. 

 

Halle Kiefer: With a crowbar leaned up against it.

 

Alison Leiby: A big ol mystery box. 

 

Halle Kiefer: A big mystery box. So everyone sort of walks over to it. One of the captives go to pry it open. But there’s this other guy. Later, we find out his name is Don. Says, is a trick. It’s probably a trap. And he’s trying to talk with his gag in and he’s shouting, it is trap. It’s a trap. Finally, everyone sort of like decides we’re either going to stand here or are we going to run and everyone else runs through the underbrush just in case it explodes. 

 

Alison Leiby: Hmm, fair. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And one captive pries it open and something walks out. Alison, what is inside the box that walks out? 

 

Alison Leiby: Is it a pig? 

 

Halle Kiefer: It’s a little pig in a dress. 

 

Alison Leiby: A little piggy. It’s in the trailer.

 

Halle Kiefer: Dang it. Okay. I was. I didn’t. I didn’t watch the trailer. So I was like, oh. 

 

Alison Leiby: Little piggy, little pigs are so cute. [laughs]

 

Halle Kiefer: And the pig is an outfit. And they never really address why the pig has an outfit. Except it is—

 

Alison Leiby: What’s it dressed—

 

Halle Kiefer: It is an allusion to Animal Farm. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: But it’s sort of like, again, what what is the allusion like? What are we? It’s sort of like, you know, you know we— 

 

Alison Leiby: Right, you’re referencing it but why?

 

Halle Kiefer: To what end? And the pig scampers away in the woods. 

 

Alison Leiby: Aw. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And the captive reaches inside and pulls out this gigantic rolling rack covered in weapons. So mostly guns, but also machetes. And all the captives run over because everyone instinctively knows, uh oh, we’re all going to need a weapon for what’s about to happen. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. If the weapons are there, like. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah. 

 

Alison Leiby: You best grab one. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And Yoga Pants runs over. She’s kind of the last one, but she sees a little envelope taped to the back of the door or like the or the side they wrenched off. And inside it is the keys to the gags. So everyone passes them around and helps each other take their gags off. And of course, everyone runs over and she refuses to take a gun at first. But there’s another captive. His name is Don says, you just fucking take it if you can go like if you could if you have a trigger finger, you could use a gun, you don’t have to know. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And another captain who’s referred to as Trucker teaches her to take the safety off. So at least they’re all working together. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Trying to figure out like, okay, fuck this. 

 

Alison Leiby: And just like, it’s like, oh, we’re all safe, like. No suspicions that anybody among them is like, who got them there? 

 

Halle Kiefer: Right. And unfortunately, they’re going to be dealing with another problem in mere seconds, Alison, which is in the distance, they hear a shot and a bullet hits the box and Yoga Pants sort of gasps like, oh, my God, that almost hit me. Alison. The next bullet rips through her fucking skull. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Woah. 

 

Alison Leiby: And her head explodes open like a balloon full of blood and sprays the Trucker’s face while he’s standing there looking at her. Fortunately, he’s able to duck down. And again, everyone has to decide. Are we going try to hide behind the box while somebody, a sniper is shooting at us, or are we going to make a run for it? Unfortunately, some, at least two of them make a run for it. They’re gunned down. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: We see a woman with a shirt that says, dead sexy, run and sort of fall into a ditch. And the Trucker is like, fuck. And he runs over to try to help her. She’s actually fallen into a pit full of spikes in in a way that in. 

 

Alison Leiby: Ugh. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Reality you would just die. There’s a spike basically through her torso. You wouldn’t be able to get out after like I thought he was going to pull her up, but her organs are falling out. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: But he pulls her up. He’s able to get her out. They take two steps Alison, they step on a landmine. [laughs] It explodes. And Ike Barinholtz, who is referred to as Staten Island, as someone from Staten Island runs over to see if either of them are alive and then sees Dead Sexy’s torso like her legs have been blown off. And she says, shoot me in the head. And he says, I just met you. I can’t do that. And she grabs his gun out of his hand and says, don’t be a snowflake and shoots herself in the head. Right. We’re off to. We’re off to the races here, Alison. So Staten Island runs to this fence, along with three other captives, beyond which there is just what looks like a regular country road. And he says to them, this is fucking ManorGate. They’re hunting us for sport. And they say, ManorGate. Is that real? We’re already getting the idea of like this is a conspiracy online. This is an online. 

 

Alison Leiby: Okay. 

 

Halle Kiefer: You know, this is something that has been circulating in the months after, you know, under Trump’s presidency. And they say, oh, my God, it’s like, is that real? It’s like it’s seems pretty fucking real— 

 

Alison Leiby: You’re all literally getting hunted right now—

 

Halle Kiefer: Somebody’s trying to shoot you—

 

Alison Leiby: —who cares who’s doing it. You are getting hunted. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Exactly. Right. Yeah. The where and where are you doesn’t really matter. 

 

Alison Leiby: No. 

 

Halle Kiefer: So they got to climb the fence only for one of the captives to get shot by an arrow. And he says, fuck this. So while the other three escape over the fence, he turns and he starts shooting down his assailant. It’s all forest. You can’t see where this is coming from. 

 

Alison Leiby: Right. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Finally, he’s shot with two arrows and he collapses. And then we see a grenade roll up to his head. And we sort of hear some some of the elites voices like Liberty and Martin, are chatting off camera, like, did you even pull the pin? She’s oh, the pin. We see a second grenade roll up to his face and it winces while it explodes. So we have our three captors who escape this initial onslaught. 

 

Alison Leiby: Okay. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Ike Barinholtz so Staten Island, a woman named Big Red and Vanilla Nice. A Vanilla Ice wannabe, I suppose. 

 

Alison Leiby: Vanilla Nice. I wish more people had nice than in their name. [laughs]

 

Halle Kiefer: I know. Especially as a nickname. 

 

Alison Leiby: Nice Cube. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Um, Nice Cube. 

 

Alison Leiby: Nice Tea. 

 

Halle Kiefer: So they run into a little mom and pop gas station with their guns. And there is a literal mom and pop standing there, horrified behind the counter and Staten Island screams at them. Where the fuck are we? And he’s like, you, you’re outside Elain. He’s like, Elaine, where? And they tell him, you’re outside Elaine Arkansas. 

 

Alison Leiby: Oh, God. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And he says, I need a phone. We need to call 911 to report a murder spree. It’s ManorGate. And they say, what’s ManorGate? He says, just Google it. And he calls the 911 and tells the operator, we you know, basically we find out like all three of them are from a different state and all of them have experience they went out for drinks, they were out, and all of them were drugged and kidnaped and brought here. So they were targeted, specifically brought from, you know, Big Red’s from Wyoming, he’s from Staten Island, and he’s screaming at the 911 operator, just please help us and said and they said, what’s the address there? And I’m like just ask the mom and pop what the address is. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: But Staten Island says, can’t you just trace us? And the operator says, oh, that’s a great idea. And that’s that first, like you see, Staten Island’s face. 

 

Alison Leiby: Mm. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And he’s like that’s not what you, that’s not what a normal 911, 901, 911—

 

Alison Leiby: [laughs] Quick call 9/11. There’s been an emergency. 

 

Halle Kiefer: That’s how I remember it. It’s hard to remember. 901. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And of course the pop behind the counter says, can you please stop waving your gun around? And Staten Island says, it’s fine, I own seven guns, you’re not in any danger. And Ma says, can I ask you why? Why you have seven guns? He’s like, well, because my constitutional right also, obviously I needed to know how to shoot a gun I, we’re in this situation. 

 

Alison Leiby: I mean not wrong. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And Ma says well yeah but if you think about it isn’t aren’t the people hunting you also exercising their constitutional right? And he goes excuse me just then he turns and we see Big Red has opened up a package of powdered donuts which looks so fucking good. 

 

Alison Leiby: What’s the last time you had a powdered donut? I can’t think of it. It’s been years and years and years and years. 

 

Halle Kiefer: I was gonna say, I’ve definitely had donuts. I don’t think I’ve had a powder donut—

 

Alison Leiby: I haven’t had a powdered donut in a long time.

 

Halle Kiefer: Damn. High school?

 

Alison Leiby: With coffee. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Fuck, I. Yeah. Say what you will about Catholicism after mass you would have donuts and coffee and that really—

 

Alison Leiby: It is the thing—

 

Halle Kiefer: And it kind of made it all worth it. 

 

Alison Leiby: —that Catholicism and Judaism have in common donuts [laughter] feature pretty large in our cultural history. [laughter]

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah, I know the shame and the guilt and all that. That too, probably. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: But he turns and we see Big Red is choking on a powdered donut, it is poisoned Alison. 

 

Alison Leiby: Oh, okay. Now I don’t want one.

 

Halle Kiefer: It turns out this gas station is all a part of it as well. This is a fictional gas station that is set up for people who, when they escape the initial onslaught, they will immediately be delivered to the gas station. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. I love a plan, I love when it’s this thought out where it’s like— 

 

Halle Kiefer: I agree. It’s very fun.

 

Alison Leiby: There is a gas station. The donuts in the gas station are poised like it’s perfect. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And when Staten Island turns around, he sees that Ma, Ma and Pop are wearing gas masks, and they hurl a container canister of poison gas. 

 

Alison Leiby: Oh. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And Vanilla Nice. There’s just total melee at this point. And a certain point, Pop is standing over Vanilla Nice on the ground. And Vanilla Nice tells him you’re going to hell and Pop’s snarls at Vanilla Nice. I don’t believe in hell. I’m just like, you tweet about me, I’m a godless coastal elite. And just for the record, climate change is real. Vanilla Nice killed by gas. They dispatched Staten Island with a shotgun. And then they start cleaning up. And while they’re cleaning up, Ma, they drag the bodies in the back and Ma notices that Staten Island has a wedding ring. So it’s like, oh, he was married. But look, Pop reassures her I’m sure it’s fine. I’m sure he used the N word and not even privately, probably on Twitter. His ancestors probably enslaved Black people. And they have an argument like, well, we don’t call them Black people. They call them African-American. Actually, we do call them Black people. This is what is like this is what these characters are having, this level of conversation. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: You know, I mean, I think there is a lot to be said of like well-meaning liberals who do wield power and do unscrupulous things, obviously. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes, yes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: But this kind of like NPR like semantic argument, I’ll be honest, it gets a little old. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah.

 

Halle Kiefer: A little fast. If you ask me. 

 

Alison Leiby: I agree. 

 

Halle Kiefer: But, you know, they’re, they do have some funny moments. And he’s like, well, you know, they said on NPR that you call them Black people. It’s like, well, who works at NPR? He goes mostly white people, God damn it. You know, the idea of like trying to be woke in this, like—

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: —very specific way while you’re— 

 

Alison Leiby: Getting caught up in, you know, tiny words—

 

Halle Kiefer: Language. 

 

Alison Leiby: —not that it’s tiny to how you refer to yourself or to other people but like not the you know, focusing on the words and not the greater systemic problems. [laughs]

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah so and that’s of course the joke of it is like to care about this kind of things while you’re literally—

 

Alison Leiby: Murdering people. 

 

Halle Kiefer: —poisoning people. Exactly. Right then they get a call on their walkie talkie from Athena, letting them know that Crystal is almost there and is unarmed. And we see Crystal who is Betty Gilpin come in. She was the woman that Yoga Pants saw across the creek who didn’t she didn’t come to the she knew when she saw the box. Don’t go near the box. So she’s been off on her own and that is why she is probably still alive, you know? 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: She comes in and unlike the other ones who who arrived in a panic. She doesn’t beg for help. She says, I would like to get a pack of smokes and she pays. She doesn’t have her wallet, but she has pays she has a $20 in her sock because she’s like, I always keep it in my sock. And finally she says, where am I? They say, you’re in Arkansas. It’s pretty crazy. You don’t know where you are. Ma goes to hand Crystal her change for the pack of cigarettes. And we see Pop like in that moment, we see Crystal consider the amount of money that’s being handed to her. And Pop puts his hand on the shotgun underneath the counter, only for Crystal to just reach over and fucking slam Ma’s head on the counter, snaps the—

 

Alison Leiby: She’s so good. 

 

Halle Kiefer: —shotgun out of the pop’s hand and fucking blows him away, and then turns to Ma, who’s on the ground screaming and Crystal screams. This is like, I’m sorry, like it is for Betty Gilpin. This movie is is what it is, Betty Gilpin is a fucking star. 

 

Alison Leiby: She’s a star. 

 

Halle Kiefer: She. She, she screams. Cigarettes are only $6 in Arkansas you fucked up bitch. And then just fucking shoots [laughter] Ma in the, Ma in the face. And I’m like—

 

Alison Leiby: I love that. [laughs]

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah. So those moments I think are like, that’s why you’re watching this movie. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah, that’s fun. 

 

Halle Kiefer: She then pops open the soft pack. There’s not even a cigarette in there. And that’s kind of a running theme of like her constantly trying to get a cigarette from somebody. Um, she, she sort of stakes out the gas station. She finds the other captives dead bodies in the back. She takes a shotgun and the couple’s walkie talkie so now she can listen in on what the elites are saying about them. 

 

Alison Leiby: Huge. 

 

Halle Kiefer: She goes to approach a a couple’s truck which has an Arkansas license plate, but then she pulls it off and there is what is clearly a license plate from a European country. So it’s not immediately obvious, but it is not an American license plate. They’re not in America. 

 

Alison Leiby: Okay. Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: She goes to open the driver’s side door—

 

Alison Leiby: This does seem like the kind of thing we would make legal, though. [laughs] Like.

 

Halle Kiefer: Kind of. I mean, it’s Purge adjacent and I—

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: —absolutely think the logic of why they’re doing this, it’s like, yeah, this I could see somebody being like, but I. But I’m rich. I’m allowed to do this. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. Yes.

 

Halle Kiefer: Look at my but I have power. Let me hunt people. You know, she’s about to open the driver’s side door when again, she’s incredibly perceptive. See’s a extremely thin hair size wire connecting the front door driver’s side door to an explosive device. 

 

Alison Leiby: Mmm. 

 

Halle Kiefer: So, again, narrowly avoiding catastrophe at every chance. Athena calls the walkie talkie and Crystal hides in the underbrush as the leads have a conversation on the walkie talkies, like oh is you know, Crystal was walking towards the gas station does anyone have eyes on her? Did she actually go in? I you know, we’re trying to get Ma and Pa to reply, but they haven’t done it. And Crystal watches a drone hovering over the gas station. So basically trying to get footage. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Just then the drone explodes and another captive, Gary, has shot it out of the air. Crystal on the recording finds out the elites have nicknamed her Snowball. She pops up and she’s like, hey Gary, don’t open the fucking door of that car. And he says, how do I know that you’re not one of them? It’s like, because I just told you not to open the door of the car. So you want to find out? Open it bitch. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. Test it. See what happens. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah. When you’re blown to a million fucking pieces. She also yells at him for shooting the drone because now they know exactly where they are, so they have to head out together. 

 

Alison Leiby: Very smart. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah. And we find they find train tracks. And she again is a very resourceful person, says we’re going to follow these train tracks to civilization so we’ve got to fucking start walking, you know? 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: He’s then the one who tells her about ManorGate. So basically, it’s this online conspiracy theory that there is a manor in Vermont that is a site where elites go to hunt human beings for sport. He’s like, I didn’t believe it was true, but now I’m starting is like, do you believe it? She goes, I would, but we ain’t we ain’t in fucking Vermont, dude? 

 

Alison Leiby: No. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Like, if anything, I’m like, there’s definitely something going on. I don’t know if it’s that specific or what it is just then a train comes by and they sprint to grab onto it. And I wrote in my notes here. Do you think you’d be able to leap onto a moving train Alison? 

 

Alison Leiby: No. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Please be realistic, okay good.

 

Alison Leiby: No. Of course not.

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah me either. 

 

Alison Leiby: If it was going five miles an hour. It would be a struggle for me to catch up with it. 

 

Halle Kiefer: I think I would grab on and I immediately fall under the wheels. 

 

Alison Leiby: Just be dragged. And die.

 

Halle Kiefer: And be I think I’d just be— 

 

Alison Leiby: Split in half. 

 

Halle Kiefer: —severed in half. Absolutely. There’s no conceivable way. So Crystal gets on but Gary’s dragging, dragging on the ground, and then luckily she’s able to haul him up. Just then, they turn and realize that they are not alone in this train car. They find a group of Arabic speaking refugees or immigrants that have that are taking refuge into whatever country they’re in. Gary starts screaming, these are crisis actors. This is all part of it, because he is reasonably enough paranoid. But of course, we’re also mimicking, you know, like people don’t believe in Sandy Hook—

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: —or the QAnon of it all the age of like crisis actors. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Crystal’s like I don’t know they have a baby with them. We see a young woman with a baby. It’s like, okay, so they have a crisis baby. Like you cannot m—

 

Alison Leiby: All babies are crisis babies. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And he’s like yelling at them. I know. Exactly. [laughter] Is that baby SAG? And he’s screaming, you know, they can’t manipulate me into rethinking my concept of immigration. Like how like, fuck you guys. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Just then the train stops and it’s a military stop. So the soldiers are pulling everyone out, ostensibly to take these refugees and make sure they don’t go into whatever country they’re entering, you know, and soldiers force everyone off the train. They do not speak English. And Crystal tells Gary, we have to leave our guns here or we are going to go to whatever jail of whatever country this is. So leave your fucking gun. And he’s like, we can’t do that. I can’t do that. Like we’re going to be arre—

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: like I am not being put in like pri— 

 

Alison Leiby: Whatever country prison. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah, like surviving only be put into an international prison is not a solution.

 

Alison Leiby: That’s not the answer. 

 

Halle Kiefer: But so they leave it behind. And the soldiers are being really rough with the refugees. And Gary tries to pull like a can I speak to your manager? None of these people speak English. Like, what are you talking about? 

 

Alison Leiby: Manager?

 

Halle Kiefer: And he’s like, I, you know, I have a podcast where I uncovered this exact kind of conspiracy, like,. 

 

Alison Leiby: Of course he does. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Oh my God, they’re targeting me. These aren’t even real immigrants. This is ManorGate. And, you know, but of course, the soldiers are like, okay, so there’s two crazy Americans [laughs] like on this train and they sort of walk away to discuss them. And one of the refugees turns and says to them in an American accent, I don’t think they believe you, Gary. Alison, I got to ask you right now, what would you do? 

 

[voice over]: What would you do? 

 

Alison Leiby: Oh, God. I mean, I guess just turning around, like, running. See how far I can get with—

 

Halle Kiefer: Running into the underbrush. 

 

Alison Leiby: I would just, like, keep my gun and run. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah, I feel like I guess you could be gunned down. I guess you probably would be gunned down by the soldiers. 

 

Alison Leiby: But it just seems like. No matter, like continuing on this trajectory, it’s clearly part of whatever is happening. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah. 

 

Alison Leiby: So may as well like, try and make a run for it because either way it’s kind of like lights out. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah, unless you are Crystal, who is someone who has—

 

Alison Leiby: A badass. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah. A fucking badass. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Has the fortitude, these skills, which we do not have.

 

Alison Leiby: Intelligence, yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: So someone’s like, this is a moot question because we would have been dead ten times over before we hit the ground—

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah me and Yoga Pants would of been in the same boat. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah, I would be half of my body. I would still be alive. I’d be lying at the bottom of the fucking pit. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

[AD BREAK]

 

Halle Kiefer: Gary, of course, flips out and starts screaming. But the crisis actor who we find out whose name is Mike, he’s like, look, I’m fake, but the rest of these refugees are real and the soldiers are real, too. The train wasn’t supposed to stop. So, look, I want to give you guys a head start before I let them know that you’re here. Just [?] like as a courtesy to you. Is that okay, buddy? And Gary screams, I’m not your buddy. And he grabs a grenade. There’s so many grenades in this movie. He grabs a grenade off of Mike’s bag and crams and pulls up and crams it on Mike’s pants. Everyone else sees this and runs screaming. And Crystal grabs a refugee woman with the baby, sort of like throws herself on top of her, and Mike explodes. So a bloody explosion sending them everywhere. Needless to say, she is put on a military truck. So in the melee, we don’t know what exactly happened to Gary. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: She was taken to a refugee camp, which is it is sad. They have built a full refugee camp and it does. It’s like it gave you kind of wish, like, well, if we’re going to go there, we should actually do a movie about this. But. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: You know, we’re just there for a minute and we’re going to—

 

Alison Leiby: Right. 

 

Halle Kiefer: —follow this white woman, obviously, and she’s taken in front of these officials. She finds out for sure that they are in Croatia. 

 

Alison Leiby: Mm. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And she tries to deduce it. She’s she’s like Serbia. And finally she gets to Croatia. They say, we need your papers. She says, I was abducted from America. I do not have my papers. 

 

Alison Leiby: I didn’t bring my license. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Please take me, please take me to the American embassy. And they say, you know, and she also they’re smoking a cigarette and she’s like, please let me have a cigarette. And they’re like, oh, no, no. But I guess they’re like, we basically we have to believe you because we have another American captive who also claims that he he’s being hunted, Don, who was the guy who basically told Yoga Pants, you have to take a gun. 

 

Alison Leiby: Okay. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Who’s like an older bearded, you know, American guy. And they bring out Don. He’s like, ha ha, well, well, well. I was telling the truth motherfuckers. Like see backing me up. And she’s like, yeah, I know. I saw Don. I was hunted like him. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: So just then an American named Oliver rolls up in car to take them to the American embassy. So the Croatian officials are like, get the fuck out of here. You know, like, we don’t we’re not dealing with—

 

Alison Leiby: I’m not dealing with this. 

 

Halle Kiefer: —whatever the hell you’re talking about with this. Get out of here. 

 

Alison Leiby: Get out of here. 

 

Halle Kiefer: So we get in the car, and Oliver is like, oh, my God, this is insane. Once you get to the embassy, you can call your families. I’m so sorry this happened to you. But then, Alison, he sort of tips his hand. He says, I mean, like, why do they think they they targeted you specifically? Like there has to be, like, some reason it’s you guys. And of course, Crystal is no fucking dummy. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. She knows. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah. He’s like again, he’s revealing, pulling away the veil as he talks Crystal, like, grabs the bar of the door and pulls her legs up to her chest while he’s prattling on turns and then kicks him so hard he flies out of the car. [laughter] She, like, rolls over into the driver’s side while Don’s in the back seat screaming. He’s like, why the fuck did you do that? 

 

Alison Leiby: Because he’s gonna kill us. [laughter] Like.

 

Halle Kiefer: She throws the car into reverse and drives back over Oliver’s head, crushing it. 

 

Alison Leiby: Amazing. 

 

Halle Kiefer: While Don is screaming, what are you doing? Why did you kill the guy from the embassy? [laughs] He just still doesn’t get it. She stops the car when Don’s practically puking. But when she gets out, she throws over the trunk. We see Gary’s murdered body. So Gary has a knife in his forehead just in this trunk. He’s been murdered. And then, Alison, there’s something else in the trunk that really just dropped my jaw. And it is a plastic box of cash. And on the top, it says bribe money. And look, okay. I think we probably could have put two and two together box of cash, figure out we’re doing something nefarious with it. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: So I did appreciate it. I just maybe. Maybe not at that moment. Maybe even a little later, in the movie.

 

Alison Leiby: It’s a bit on the nose. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Right. [laughs] Like we’re still in a moment where like, it is sort of like what is happening? Whatever and then to see the bribe money. Like, I just want I just I want to be a fly on the wall during that conversation with the props department. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. They’re like no, no. 

 

Halle Kiefer: We need another piece of tape. 

 

Alison Leiby: Write this. 

 

Halle Kiefer: That says bribe money. 

 

Alison Leiby: Money. 

 

Halle Kiefer: So they’re going through it and they find a map, basically lists all the 11 captives and they’re already dead. So the only two captives that are alive are Crystal and Don. 

 

Alison Leiby: Okay. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And they also realize the map is a map to the compound where the elite are staying. Right. 

 

Alison Leiby: Okay. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Essentially, the manor from ManorGate is just in Croatia, you know. And Don says, doesn’t that seem like too easy? Like they obviously want us to go there and find them. 

 

Alison Leiby: Mm hmm. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And Crystal says, well, depends on whether they’re smart, pretending to be idiots or idiots pretending to be smart. [laughs] And Don says—

 

Alison Leiby: Very good distinction. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah. He’s like, okay, well, I’ll tell you what I think we should do. Take the car. Just fucking drive over the border. Let’s just drive as far—

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. As it’ll go.

 

Halle Kiefer: —west. And just end up wherever and then we’ll figure it out, you know? But then Crystal tells this story where it’s the jack rabbit and the box turtle. And again, a kudos to Betty Gilpin. It is essentially the story of the rabbit and the hare, right? 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Famously, the rabbit is oh, so cocky. I’m going to beat this—

 

Alison Leiby: I’m fast. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah. The jackrabbit is like I’m so much faster than the box turtle. I can actually take a nap in the middle of this race. Takes a nap, wakes up, realized, blew it, and then the box turtle wins the race. Slow and steady wins the race. The jackrabbit got too full of itself. In this version she said her mother would tell her the jackrabbit shows up the night of the race where the box turtle and his wife and children are having dinner and murders all the turtles with a hammer. 

 

[clip of Betty Gilpin]: Once the whole families broken into little pieces. [laughs] He sits down and eats their dinner. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And I’m imagining those turtle’s those dinners are, lettuce?

 

Alison Leiby: Lettuce. They like salads. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And she says, the reason that that happened is because the jackrabbit always wins. And then she turns as she pulls the knife out of Gary’s forehead. And Don says, your mom told you that story? [laughter] Which I did think was fun. But then he asks okay, so which one are we? Are we the box turtle? Or are we the jackrabbit? [laughter] Like what the fuck are you talking about? 

 

Alison Leiby: Right. What is this metaphor? [laughs]

 

Halle Kiefer: Before she can answer Alison, that little pig in the dress from the box. 

 

Alison Leiby: Oh. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Who the elites we hear refer to as Orwell. Again, another reference to George Orwell. 

 

Alison Leiby: Okay. We get it. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Over the walkie talkies. Runs out of the woods, squealing. And at this point, Alison, I would like to ask you the question, who will survive? 

 

[voice over]: Who will survive?

 

Alison Leiby: Crystal is going to survive. I think Don’s going to die. I think Crystal’s going to just from the trailer and I think she’s going to kill Hilary Swank. 

 

Halle Kiefer: It’s a pretty safe bet. I’m going to be honest. Do you think Don is going to die? 

 

Alison Leiby: I think Don’s going to die. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Okay, great. 

 

Alison Leiby: I think she’ll be kind of like a last man standing. 

 

[AD BREAK]

 

Halle Kiefer: Over in the compound where they have decided to go. We see the elites are waiting for Oliver to bring Don and Crystal, and they are, of course, engaging in white liberal chatter. One of them was like, oh my God, Ava DuVernay liked my tweet. I met her like, no big deal. Like, oh, you’re friends with her? I actually hung out with her. 

 

Alison Leiby: Oh my God. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And one of the guys starts talking to like, oh, you know, he’s like, yeah, I was in Haiti. You know, I’m like, working for an AIDS nonprofit. They’re like, oh, yeah, we all know you got that girl pregnant down there. 

 

Alison Leiby: Oh, my God. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And he’s like, listen, I fell in love. And they’re sort of arguing. It’s like, well, I hope you figured out, like asked if she was pro-choice before, you know, you got her pregnant, like they’re having, again, like, a very not particularly thought out bit of dialogue. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah, yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And that’s fine. But it’s sort of like we’re just seeing like these are liberals who again, like they they’re right thinking or they believe certain things but then are unscrupulous in their real lives. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: As we see from the fact that they are hunting humans for sport. 

 

Alison Leiby: That’s kind of all you need to know.

 

Halle Kiefer: Right. Yeah. It’s like you can we can talk about NPR all damn day. They’re hunting human beings. Like they’re pieces of shit. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. That’s that. 

 

Halle Kiefer: But they’re being aided by their consultant, Sergeant Dale, who is someone who’s actually from the military. And it’s like, everyone shut the fuck up. Like this is a military operation. Just don’t be gabbing like, yeah, but they’re saying like, well, they’re going to be in a car. Like, we’re going to hear the car. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And Athena’s at a separate location. She calls them and tells them to shut up as well. And Richard says, okay, well, they’ll be here soon. I’m going to go out and take a piss. He has a helmet light on and he goes outside to pee. Again. If you’re an elite, I just kind of think there’s a bathroom for you, right? 

 

Alison Leiby: Right they’re in a manner. 

 

Halle Kiefer: He decides he’s peeing against a tree, it’s dark, it’s pitch dark outside. And when he hears a sound he turns and in the in his lamplight, we see Don holding Orwell the pig, and Don asks, hey, is this your pig? And in the moment, we’re Richards a surprise. Crystal steps out of the darkness and slits Richard’s throat. 

 

Alison Leiby: Oh boy. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And he dies gagging on his blood. 

 

Alison Leiby: Oh, my God. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Inside, everyone hears a sound and sort of gets in position. And as soon as a creature enters the sort of bunker they have built, it is Orwell the pig. 

 

Alison Leiby: Of course. 

 

Halle Kiefer: So they unload all of this ammunition on the pig. 

 

Alison Leiby: Oh, RIP Orwell.

 

Halle Kiefer: RIP, RI-Pig Orwell. 

 

Alison Leiby: RI-Pig. 

 

Halle Kiefer: It is. Is of course total mayhem. They’re like, oh, my God. Then we see a bullet rip through one of the guys. Peter’s skull, killing him. And Crystal has popped out in under the doorway. And again, like, in a moment of an action moment that I want, she says, hey, bitch. That’s it. I feel like I’m—

 

Alison Leiby: That’s great. She’s, I mean, I’m obsessed with her. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Worth watching, worth fucking watching. She, of course, decimates them. She has the skills. She’s fighting them. She ends up firing a bow and arrow into one of the female leads, chest like she is fist fighting Sergeant Dale—

 

Alison Leiby: She’s a badass. 

 

Halle Kiefer: —who is huge. And then eventually she reaches up and rips a pipe out of the ceiling and then is just beating him in the head with it, until he falls unconscious. [laughter] It is excellent. 

 

Alison Leiby: That sounds so hard. [laughs]

 

Halle Kiefer: Liberty, the woman who has the arrow in her chest calls her a fucking hick. And right then Don pops out. It was like, oh, sorry. Thanks for handling this. And she’s like, thank you for just hiding. You dumb motherfucker. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Jesus. She’s about to dispatch Liberty. And Don’s like, you don’t have to just kill her. It’s like, why? I killed everyone else. It’s like, well cause she’s a girl, she’s a woman. We should at least ask her questions. You didn’t even we didn’t even get a chance to ask that guy, Oliver, before you murdered him. Like, let’s ask her what’s going on. 

 

Alison Leiby: I am with Don in the questions. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah. 

 

Alison Leiby: It’s like, well, before. Like, if you’re going to kill her either way, why don’t we at least get some information out of her before? 

 

Halle Kiefer: And he said, and she says, okay, go ahead. You’re right. I didn’t let you ask Oliver, but I will give you this opportunity. And so Don turns to Liberty and says, why are you doing this? And Liberty says, because Jesus told me to. And Crystal again raises her gun and Don says do not shoot her. Again she’s a woman. It just doesn’t seem right. And Crystal says again in a moment of white feminism. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: She says to Liberty. Do you think you should be afforded the mercy of being alive just because you’re a girl? And Liberty says, well, no. And so Crystal shoots her in the head. 

 

Alison Leiby: Great. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And that is equality. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes.

 

Halle Kiefer: Equality in being killed during this movie. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. Being murdered.

 

Halle Kiefer: Alison just then, we hear Athena call in on one of the walkie talkies and she says, Don, is she dead yet? 

 

Alison Leiby: [gasps]

 

Halle Kiefer: And Don and Crystal immediately both pull guns on each other. And I’m like, if Don’s a bad guy, he would just shoot you. So, you know what I mean? 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: So they’re pulling guns, Don, saying, I don’t know what she’s talking about. I don’t know her. I am not a plant, I swear to you. But in the end, there is a moment of tension and release. Crystal just shoots him. 

 

Alison Leiby: Great. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And Athena says again, Don is she dead? And Crystal applies to the walkie talkie no, no, Don’s dead. I did it. And Athena says, well, then you better come find me, huh? Before she does, we see that Sergeant Dale is barely alive, and Crystal then pumps him for information about, like, what he’s like what are you doing? He’s like, I was a consultant. I’ve been training Athena for eight months. Be very careful. She is insane. And I. She’s very talented. And she’s like so they hired you? Are you a military guy? And he’s like, yeah, I work for National the National Guard. She’s like, I was in Afghanistan. I actually was in the shit and you weren’t? 

 

Alison Leiby: Right. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And meanwhile he’s laying there bleeding out and he goes, I’m in the shit now. She’s like, you know, that’s a great way to look at that. 

 

Alison Leiby: That’s very true. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And he’s saying he makes the point. It’s like, you should just fucking leave. Like, just go be alive like you won. Don’t go find Athena and risk death again. 

 

Alison Leiby: Right. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And she has this. This is again Betty Gilpin. She’s like, the problem is, is that I’m like this by which and she does this like, incredible, like bug eyed fucking like Roddy Piper. Like I am a killing machine. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Like I am here shooting a gun. You know, it’s like I’m like this and I work at a car rental place. There’s not a lot of room for that. So I feel like [laughter] oh, well, this is my opportunity to be and she goes like this and kind of like bugs her eyes out like points like this part of me there’s no outlet for. So now I’m going to release it. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And Dale’s like I guess I understand that. And then she fucking shoots Dale in the head. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. I mean—

 

Halle Kiefer: She’s dispatching people. 

 

Alison Leiby: —she’s on a journey.

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah. Cut to Alison one year ago and we see Athena is meeting with her council at work. Paul and Nicole. It turns out that Martin, who was on the elite chat group chat, got hacked, and their texts about ManorGate were leaked. The thing is, Alison, they were joking. At the time. 

 

Alison Leiby: Oh. 

 

Halle Kiefer: It was a joke. They’re like, oh, we’re the elites, you know? 

 

Alison Leiby: Right. What if we—

 

Halle Kiefer: People, I can’t wait to hunt these deplorables. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Exactly. But it then created this huge, vast online conspiracy theory—

 

Alison Leiby: As people do. 

 

Halle Kiefer: As it would. [laughter] And so everyone on the chat except for Athena has had to step down because of this joke. It’s just the climate. And that’s true it was a heated climate. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And they’re like, well, you know, people think you have a manor because you bought that manor in Vermont. She’s like, it’s not a manor it’s a three, three bedroom home. I don’t know what’s how you can’t use the manor, you know what I mean?

 

Alison Leiby: It’s a house on some land. Like.

 

Halle Kiefer: She’s laughing, like, that’s ridiculous. And he’s like, well, you’re not joking. You should not have used the word deplorables. Everyone’s on tenterhooks right now, you know, and basically find everyone else in the tech side has had to resign from their company, their position, their, you know. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Their posi— Any any, public life essentially. And they’re telling her you have to resign, too, or you’re going to take down this whole fucking company and we refuse to do it and legal’s behind us. So don’t even try to fight us. 

 

Alison Leiby: Mm hmm. 

 

Halle Kiefer: But of course she you know tries to defend herself. It’s like who, who, who actually believes this? Who’s actually online seeing this. They’re like a lot of people, a lot of people believe this. And she gets up and screams what people actually believe I’m hunting people at my Vermont manor? Cut to eight months ago so four months later, all the elites, including Mike who is playing one of the refugees, are in Athena’s home. And also Hilary Swank is like because she’s already jacked, is literally lifting weights like furious. [laughter] And they are looking up particular posts of people who are propagating this conspiracy theory. 

 

Alison Leiby: Okay. 

 

Halle Kiefer: All of them are, of course, the people. They’re going to end up kidnaping. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes, of course. This is why you shouldn’t say things online. [laughs]

 

Halle Kiefer: Yes, exactly. And but to be fair, like, you know, Dale tells them because they’ve already hired Sergeant Dale, like, I’ll be honest, you really can’t get more than 12. We can’t have everybody who’s left a comment. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. So pick your faves.

 

Halle Kiefer: It’s untenable. And then they get to they’re going through and they get to they almost pick a Black person and they’re like, we can’t like, come on you know what I mean. Like they’re still having like, they’re trying to be appropriate—

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. The white guilt of it all. 

 

Halle Kiefer: —like we can’t. Yeah, exactly. And they’re like having these, you know, sort of a woke argument about who they’re going to murder, basically. And they start to read Crystal’s post which she wrote under the username “Justice for Y’all.” And it starts, Fuck this bitch like this woman is killing innocent men and women and going out. Athena says, no, no, I’ve seen enough. She is our Snowball. Back in the present, we see Crystal’s arriving at Athena’s manor and is armed. And through the intercom, Athena says, leave the gun in the mailbox. Crystal says, why would I do that? That’s insane. I’m not going to come in there without a gun. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And Athena says you can if you try, if you choose to in there, I will detonate the charge that you’re standing over right now. Put the gun in the mailbox or I will blow you up immediately. So she puts it in and she’s, oh, the gate is open. She walks inside. We see again, it’s not a manor. It’s a beautiful home. It is a Nancy Meyers level house. You know what I mean? 

 

Alison Leiby: From the trailer, it looks great. 

 

Halle Kiefer: I mean, a manor for us. 

 

Alison Leiby: A manor, of course.

 

Halle Kiefer: For a rich person, a nice house to own in Croatia. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Even if it’s just like I have property in Croatia. I’m going to go there you know what I mean?

 

Alison Leiby: It’s going to have an open kitchen. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And we end up in the fucking kitchen. But as we were walking towards the kitchen, we see basically they have all the photos of all of the captives that they abducted. And I think again, like it is kind of muddled we see like Gary with his podcast, but there was like Big Red with like an anti-gay sign and I’m sorry, I’m like, yeah, bitch bye. 

 

Alison Leiby: Kill em. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Like it’s like it’s different it’s like, okay, you posted one thing, whatever.

 

Alison Leiby: Right. 

 

Halle Kiefer: If you’re at rallies I don’t know man like, that’s. 

 

Alison Leiby: That’s a very—

 

Halle Kiefer: Not that you should be abducted and kidnaped but I’m just sort of like, oh, you are a piece of shit. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Like, that’s a different conversation. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. That’s a very different thing than, like, being a little conspiracy theory about, like, how certain political things work. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah. And also in your in her defense, it does seem like you guys do this, so. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: You know what I mean, like, was she wrong to propagate what at the time was a conspiracy theory?

 

Alison Leiby: Right but turned real. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And so she walks into, again, beautiful, open concept and Hilary Swank gets her moment. I don’t know if she’s the villain. I think, like Hilary Swank is born to be a hero. Like, I want to see her lift weights. And then much like Betty Gilpin, I want to see them like brawl. 

 

Alison Leiby: Just kick ass. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And they will. But Hilary Swank is is a to me, a hero energy. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: She is not. 

 

Alison Leiby: She’s not villain. 

 

Halle Kiefer: I wasn’t buying it. 

 

Alison Leiby: She’s again she’s too earnest, you know. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And but she gets like a series of lovely little monologues where she’s saying, like, she’s a she’s popped open one of the bottles of incredibly expensive champagne. 

 

Alison Leiby: I mean, I want to try it. 

 

Halle Kiefer: It’s sounds incredible. She’s like, you know, people don’t say this enough, but the way to cut a tomato, the best way is really with a bread knife. And she’s like getting a bread knife and cutting a beautiful tomato. 

 

Alison Leiby: Correct. 

 

Halle Kiefer: People don’t talk about that. Crystal, of course, is thinking what the fuck is going on? But of course, Athena, Athena is sort of putting her back, you know, on on her heels, you know, sort of disarming her. And Athena says, wow, so you killed Don because I convinced you he was with us, huh? Wow. You really are easily, easily manipulated. But of course, Crystal doesn’t want to believe that and says, Don was with you. I believe that he was with you. Athena’s like, well, you’ll never know, will you? But you did kill him, you know, and Athena sort of just like talks to her and is like basically talks down to her. It’s like, look. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: You’re an American. The country belongs to the uneducated, ignorant as much as me, the educated, and elite. Okay, it’s your country. But I think this is a good example of like you wanted it to be true. So you decided to make it true. You wanted Don to be on our side. So you killed him. And that made him on our side. You wanted the conspiracy theory to be true. So you decided to make it true. Here’s the thing, though, Crystal’s like, yeah, but you are doing it. 

 

Alison Leiby: Right. 

 

Halle Kiefer: So I think we’re also playing with the idea of like, oh, and there are these people there where if you attacked online, you’re going to double down and then become you’re going to become racist, you’re going to become a terf, you’re going to become like, well, I had to do they made me do this, you know. 

 

Alison Leiby: Right. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Which we all understand is horseshit, but that’s why Athena’s like. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: I never would have done this if you guys had attacked us. You know, it’s like. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Like, again, like. 

 

Alison Leiby: Not a defense. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah, you guys victimize us, you know, rather than well, maybe it wasn’t true, but you all did this, so you are horrible people. 

 

Alison Leiby: Right. You also. You’re as persuadable as—

 

Halle Kiefer: Exactly. 

 

Alison Leiby: —the people you’re hunting because it’s like all they had to do was like, they’re like, this must be true. And it’s like, fine, let’s do it. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Right like, how weak you must be. 

 

Alison Leiby: Right. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Mentally, right? So Crystal’s like, they’re having this sort of tete a tete, obviously. And Crystal says, here’s the thing, though, Athena. You actually got the wrong Crystal May Creasey. And Athena’s like no, I know your father died in a meth lab explosion. Your mother was an addict. You dropped out of school at 12. You enlisted. Your life is shit. You work. You know, like, I know everything about you. It’s like, no, no. There’s actually someone that’s almost exact same name who lives in my town. My father never did drugs, and my mother is still alive. I never left that comment. I’m not “Justice for Y’all.” I didn’t say any of that. You fucked up. So now, course, Athena’s like, no, no, we didn’t. We couldn’t have made that mistake. 

 

Alison Leiby: They don’t make mistakes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And they’re standing, you know, across from each other. And Crystal says now, and of course, there’s Beethoven. Like again, this they have this, like, stare off. And she said, do I have to keep listening to Beethoven or can we get on with it? And she fucking grabs a knife out of the butcher block, and then it is just hardcore fucking fist fighting. 

 

Alison Leiby: Oh. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And that’s what we are watching. I mean, like, it was all worth it. 

 

Alison Leiby: That’s worth, it’s like that’s what you want at the end of this. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Betty—

 

Alison Leiby: Betty Gilpin. 

 

Halle Kiefer: —Gilpin. Hilary Swank. Fucking hand to hand— 

 

Alison Leiby: Hand to hand, knife, knives. 

 

Halle Kiefer: We’re talking like throwed over the kitchen island knives stab through Crystal’s hand. Fucking frying pans, though, of course there’s a gun, gets a shotgun, gets pulled into it. 

 

Alison Leiby: Of course. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And they are brawling to the point that they throw each other through the sliding glass door and they’re Crystal is about to throw Athena through another door. She says not not more glass. I can’t do more glass. So she, like, throws her the other way. It’s great. 

 

Alison Leiby: Amazing. 

 

Halle Kiefer: It’s exactly what it it it is. It’s just perfect. Like, again, broken glass. They are cut to hell and they finally make it back into the kitchen where they’re brawling. And Athena grabs like a blender has been shattered on the ground, grabs—

 

Alison Leiby: Jesus. 

 

Halle Kiefer: —the blade from inside a blender. 

 

Alison Leiby: Oh, my God. So sharp.

 

Halle Kiefer: Which is so scary. Yes.

 

Alison Leiby: That’s so sharp. Ah.

 

Halle Kiefer: And grabs it and rams it into Crystal’s torso. 

 

Alison Leiby: Oh. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Before kicking her ass to the ground. But then Crystal rears up and grabs Athena and basically, like, slams her torso so that the other side of the blade stabs itself into Athena’s torso. 

 

Alison Leiby: Oh, my God. 

 

Halle Kiefer: So they are both stabbed and hooked onto these curved blades and make collapse and fall to the ground. And they’re both profusely bleeding out at this point. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And they’re there. And Crystal says, so why did you call me Snowball? And, you know, and Athena says, it’s a it’s a pig from George Orwell’s Animal Farm. It’s like, yeah, I know. 

 

[clip of Betty Gilpin]: But why am I Snowball? Snowball is an idealist who wants to make the world a better place, that’s why the other pigs make up lies about him. Turn them into the enemy. I think you should be Snowball. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And Athena says you’ve read George Orwell’s Animal Farm? And I will say, as someone who went to public school, everyone has to read Animal Farm. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: That is like the number one book. They did like, oh my God, you’ve read this book? The book you read in—

 

Alison Leiby: It’s assigned in school.

 

Halle Kiefer: —ninth grade.

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Like everyone has read Animal Farm. 

 

Alison Leiby: Part of like English and government and social studies curriculum everywhere. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And also I don’t think they necessarily properly answer like why? Why her? I guess it’s just like Athena was so like immediately saw her comment and was like, you are this character and I’m going to sort of like imbue you with meaning, but then it ends up it wasn’t her to begin with. So. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And then, you know, in turn Athena asks her a question like, just be honest with me. We’re both going to die here. Are you really the correct “Justice for Y’all” or were you lying? And Crystal says, no, I’m really not that woman. And Athena dies. 

 

Alison Leiby: Wow. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And we see the doors open and Crystal sees a little rabbit running up to the door. And I think it’s like a rabbit of hope. And she gets up and I don’t know if you should do this, so obviously, please don’t do this. And if you’re a doctor, I’m assuming you’d say, not to do this in order to survive. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Crystal gets up and grabs a brûlée torch and cauterizes the wound and her torso to close it, I suppose. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Which I guess you have to do. 

 

Alison Leiby: I guess. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Thus surprise, thus surviving. And we, as we conclude, we sort of see her put on like this incredible black dress. I mean, Betty Gilpin kill me and she takes Athena’s dog—

 

Alison Leiby: She’s so hot. 

 

Halle Kiefer: She doesn’t want to leave the dog and she grabs the rest of the expensive champagne and goes to there’s a private jet. There’s a private field behind the house. 

 

Alison Leiby: Mm hmm. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And the pilot, the flight attendant see her walk in and they’re like, oh, no. 

 

Alison Leiby: [laughter] Such a scary thing to see walking towards you. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And of course, she’s all bloody. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Like she’s all fucked up. She looks great, but she’s all fucked up. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: But she’s like, I your boss’s hired your boss just tried to kill me. And I killed all of them. So now I want you to fly me back home. And if you do that, I won’t kill you. And she, of course has a gun in her hand. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And the flight attendant and the pilot goes, okay, that seems fair. And the pilot goes to take off and the flight attendant says, do you want me to pour that champagne for you? And we also have caviar. And Crystal says, yeah, come eat the caviar with me. Have you ever had any? Flight attendant says, no, I’ve never, never got to try it. So they sit down and as she watches, Crystal just starts chugging this insanely expensive champagne. As the flight attendant watches her do it, she says, well, how is it? And Crystal says, Honestly, It’s fucking great. The Hunt.

 

Alison Leiby: Oh. Great. 

 

Halle Kiefer: A blast. Again, not scary. 

 

Alison Leiby: Fun. 

 

Halle Kiefer: What. Betty Gilpin. 

 

Alison Leiby: Betty Gilpin. 

 

Halle Kiefer: A star. And so I just wanted to reference something that happened. Again. We’re recording. This is Friday, April 7th. What a fucking week in news. But I just felt like watching The Hunt, of course, would have brought to mind is the fact that Supreme Court Justice Clarence Thomas. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Has been jet setting around the world on lavish fucking gift vacations. 

 

Alison Leiby: Cigars, jackets, Thailand like. [laughs] 

 

Halle Kiefer: Insane. And the person sponsoring it is named Harlan Crow, which we made a joke on Lovett or Leave it, my joke, and it was true, which is if you meet somebody named Harlan Crow and they and he shakes your hand and says, I’m going to take you someplace nice, that is the devil and you have made a deal with him. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yup. Absolutely. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And you’re thinking me and Ginni are going to have the time or fucking lives. In reality. It’s it’s going to be a Monkey’s Paw situation. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes absolutely. 

 

Halle Kiefer: You know what I mean like you can go anywhere. But then when you die, you have to wander the earth. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Your soul is trapped or something like that. 

 

Alison Leiby: Something. 

 

Halle Kiefer: You know what I mean? And also, I just want to say, please read it. Let me there’s, let me find the article where it sort of lays out everything that and again, I guess there’s just because you’re elected [laughter] you are put on the Supreme Court for your life. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: There doesn’t seem to be what I would describe as a appropriate process. 

 

Alison Leiby: No. 

 

Halle Kiefer: For for dealing with this. ProPublica did this incredible report. This is for from April 5th. If you haven’t read it, it’s definitely worth it. But yeah a billionaire Republican took one of our Supreme Court justices on fucking the most—

 

Alison Leiby: Lavish. 

 

Halle Kiefer: —incredible vacations over the last fucking 20 years. So this isn’t even like this is just one vacation, one time. 

 

Alison Leiby: Right one trip to get one thing. It’s like, oh, this is a long—

 

Halle Kiefer: Which wouldn’t be good obviously. 

 

Alison Leiby: No. That would be awful. But like. The more the worse. I guess. [laughs]

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah. And again, like, as if we’re not to believe the the fact that he is flying him and his wife, all expenses paid to Indonesia. Like, I’m sure the shit that they have seen, the places they get to go. 

 

Alison Leiby: It’s unfair. 

 

Halle Kiefer: I’m certain we could not understand it. And then today there is a New York Times article where basically Clarence Thomas is saying, and I guess he has to say is like, well, I was told that I didn’t have to report that kind of stuff. [laughter] It’s like actually someone told me that I don’t I didn’t have to do it.

 

Alison Leiby: In what world [both speaking] just in what would would that be true?

 

Halle Kiefer: Oh, here he says early in, early in, so, you know, one time 20 years ago in my tenure at the court this Clarence Thomas sorry in The New York Times, the article is Justice Thomas Says He Was Advised Lavish Gifts Did Not Need to be Reported. And this was published by Abbie VanSickle and, on April 7th. And he says early in my tenure in the court, I sought guidance from my colleagues and others in the judiciary, and was advised that this sort of personal hospitality from close personal friends who did not have business before the court was not reportable. 

 

Alison Leiby: Mm nope. 

 

Halle Kiefer: It’s like so you asked the other judges who now I’m like, well, they gave you bad advice. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yep. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And others in the judiciary. Then they’re all corrupt. And I was advised we are. The fact your close personal friends has nothing to fucking do with it. You can be—

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: —close personal friends with Adolf Hitler. It doesn’t mean like. 

 

Alison Leiby: It’s not— 

 

Halle Kiefer: —oh you’re friends. Okay, this makes it okay. And you to say to be a billionaire for 20 years and a Republican and say that you have not touched something that came before the Supreme Court. I don’t believe that for a God damned second. 

 

Alison Leiby: Absolutely not. Not one.

 

Halle Kiefer: You are not taking Clarence Thomas on all expenses paid vacations if you do not want to influence him. I’m sorry.

 

Alison Leiby: You’re not like he’s just such a good hang. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Exactly. 

 

Alison Leiby: No, you wanted something. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Party, yeah he’s a party guy. 

 

Alison Leiby: Whatever that was. You wanted something. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Oh, and the reason that I wanted to connect to this movie is that he one of the places they went, which again, was reported in ProPublica, New York Times, they went to Bohemian Grove, which is an exclusive, all male retreat nestled in the redwoods of Northern California. And what’s interesting about Bohemian Grove is like people connect it to all of these conspiracy theories. 

 

Alison Leiby: Mm. I can see that. 

 

Halle Kiefer: So it’s sort of seen as like, this is a bastion of the Illuminati. Like these are where rich people will go to sort of collude. And here’s the thing, and I think you’ve said this before about the Illuminati. The Illuminati is just an unnecessary layer to the fact that rich people control everything. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: So they idea of like, oh my God, like, what do they get up to there? They talk about how they control society. But that’s not the Illuminati. It’s not some mystery. It’s not a conspiracy theory. 

 

Alison Leiby: Right. 

 

Halle Kiefer: That’s literally what they’re doing. 

 

Alison Leiby: Right. 

 

Halle Kiefer: He had to say that he agreed that he went there. I mean, like. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: It’s like we don’t need the trappings. I don’t know whether it’s like, as humans, we think it’s more fun or like, I don’t know what it is, but it’s like, no, that’s they’re just hanging out to be like, how do we control society. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Especially Republicans? Like they even talk about like, well, how do we get rid of Roe versus Wade? 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: That’s what they’re talking about there. 

 

Alison Leiby: For years. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Anyways. Alison, what were some fatal mistakes that people made in the movie The Hunt? 

 

[voice over]: Fatal mistakes. 

 

Alison Leiby: I mean, them getting the wrong Crystal. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah. 

 

Alison Leiby: Is the reason they’re all dead. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah. 

 

Alison Leiby: Because I don’t know that another Crystal, like, even if she also had milit— Like, you just don’t. I mean, Betty Gilpin is just such a badass. And it, it’s like, oh, someone might have stopped someone else, but you weren’t going to stop her. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah. And I think, again, I do like the idea of like her life is so small. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: That she’s like, now that I’m here, I absolutely have to go fucking Rambo on the, like, I can’t. I can’t not have my moment. 

 

Alison Leiby: Right. 

 

Halle Kiefer: I work at a car rental place. Please let me fucking kick ass. 

 

Alison Leiby: Fuck some people up. 

 

Halle Kiefer: It reminds me of You’re Next where we find out our protagonist was raised in a survivalist cult and there’s just like a compound, and there’s no way they could have known that. And she just has all of these incredible skills. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Which is fun. 

 

Alison Leiby: That’s fun. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And then other than that, I mean, yeah, being blaming other people for your actions. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Being like people are mean to me online so, like, I had to [both speaking] double down and become a horrible person. 

 

Alison Leiby: Kill everyone. Yeah.

 

Halle Kiefer: And we’re not doing that anymore. Nobody believes, no. No. Like it is transparent when people do that, like you’re a bad person. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And similarly, I, you know, it’s like as someone who until recently I would consider myself a liberal. There are absolutely people where it’s like I believe the right things, but also I absolutely have done horrible things and I rationalize it to myself, you know. 

 

Alison Leiby: Mm hmm. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And so those people do exist is seriously a parody there of. But yeah, I feel like other than that, Crystal did the best she could. I mean, she really stepped up. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah Crystal did a great job. 

 

Halle Kiefer: There’s not, she made no mistakes basically. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And then finally, where would you place The Hunt on the spooky scale, Alison? 

 

[voice over]: A spooky scale. 

 

Alison Leiby: I think because the body count is so high and the violence is so intense. Even though this isn’t scary, I want to give it a two instead of anything lower because, like, it is a bloody movie. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah, I think for me, I’m going to give it a zero. I think the only moment where it’s like, oh, this could be good is when you see Emma Roberts with a gag in her mouth, waking up in a clearing. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. That’s a scary moment. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah. But other than that, I think because it’s kind of goofy and. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah. 

 

Halle Kiefer: You know, we have these moments of levity, it always brings down the number. I enjoyed it. I really want to see Betty Gilpin fucking kick ass. 

 

Alison Leiby: Me too. 

 

Halle Kiefer: In another setting. 

 

Alison Leiby: Go get her book. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Yeah. So I’d say it’s worth a gander, but definitely not scary in any conventional sense. 

 

Alison Leiby: Mm hmm. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And that’s fine. I also want to say I wanted, the name of that ProPublica article is Clarence Thomas and The Billionaire, and it’s by Joshua Kaplan, Justin Elliott and Alex Mierjeski and it’s published April 6th, in case you wanted to read it. And it’s worth a read, my friend. And thank you, everyone, for listening. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: We hope you enjoyed this as we’ve continued political month. But of course, every horror movie is political because and I hate to say this. 

 

Alison Leiby: Everything is. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Everything is everything is everything is everything. Everything is important. That’s the problem—

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: —with everything else. That is. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yeah, it’s all important. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Everything is important. It’s all important. But thank you for listening to this podcast and listening to us and we think that you are important as well. 

 

Alison Leiby: Yes. 

 

Halle Kiefer: And until next time, please keep it spooky. 

 

Alison Leiby: Keep it hunt. [laughs]

 

Halle Kiefer: Keep it hunt. 

 

Alison Leiby: Keep it hunt. 

 

Halle Kiefer: Serving hunt. 

 

Alison Leiby: Serving hunt. Ruined is a Radio Point and Crooked Media production. We’re your writers and hosts Halle Kiefe and Alison Leiby. The show is executive produced by Alex Bach, Sabrina Fonfeder and Houston Snyder, and recorded and edited by Kat Iossa. From Crooked Media our executive producer is Kendra James with production and promotional support from Ari Schwartz, Kyle Seglin, Julia Beach, Caroline Dunphy and Ewa Okulate. Follow @ruinedpodcast on Instagram and Twitter for show updates and @theradiopoint and @crookedmedia for more original content. [music plays]