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Jane Coaston: It’s Monday, October 13th. I’m Jane Coaston, and this is What a Day, the show that says Canada is a pretty cool place that, unlike President Donald Trump, I have no weird beef with. But I might, if Canada does action its plan to put a nuclear reactor on the moon. Now I know that this is not a new idea, and that Canada isn’t even alone in its desire to put a nuclear reactor on the moon. But as a big fan of the moon, and as a non-fan of space-centered horror films, I feel like Nuclear Reactor on the Moon ends poorly. [music break] On today’s show, Trump reignites his favorite hobby, threatening China with 100% tariffs, tanking the stock market, and then insisting everything’s fine. And the Trump administration plans to gouge a Pentagon program to pay the U.S. Military during the government shutdown. Is it legal? No. Does it matter to them? Same answer. But let’s start with our nation’s state attorneys general. Last week, the Department of Justice indicted New York Attorney General Letitia James on one count of bank fraud and one count of making a false statement in relation to allegations James lied on a mortgage application. Charges that came only after Trump replaced the previous U.S. Attorney for the Eastern District of Virginia, who had said that there wasn’t enough evidence to charge James with his former personal attorney, Lindsey Halligan. Weird. In response, Attorney General James released a video saying that the charges amounted to pure lawfare aimed at Trump’s enemies. 

[clip of Letitia James] This is nothing more than a continuation of the president’s desperate weaponization of our justice system. He is forcing federal law enforcement agencies to do his bidding. All because I did my job as the New York State Attorney General. These charges are baseless, and the president’s own public statements make clear that his only goal is political retribution at any cost. 

Jane Coaston: And uh she has a point. See, James gained national attention after winning a state civil case against Trump back in 2023. But if you forgot about that, Trump didn’t. On September 20th, Trump posted on Truth Social what was, according to the Wall Street Journal, supposed to be a direct message to Attorney General Pam Bondi. The message read in part quote, “Pam, I have reviewed over thirty statements and posts saying that essentially same old story as last time. All talk, no action, nothing is being done. What about Comey? Adam Shifty Schiff, Letitia, they’re all guilty as hell, but nothing is going to be done.” Two of the three people Trump mentioned, former FBI Director James Comey and Attorney General James, were charged with crimes within three weeks of that post. Which is not at all terrifying. So to talk more about lawfare aimed at Trump’s political enemies, I spoke to Rhode Island Attorney General Peter Neronha. Attorney General Peter Neronha, welcome to What a Day. 

Peter Neronha: Great to be with you. 

Jane Coaston: Let’s start with what’s been happening to one of your peers, New York Attorney General Letitia James, the very same Letitia James who won a state civil case against Trump back in 2023. She’s accused of applying for a loan to buy a private home for herself, but then renting it out to others, saving interest on the loan. As a fellow attorney general, on a personal level, is this scary for you just to see a someone else in your same position being gone after by the federal government clearly for retaliation for something that happened a couple of years ago? 

Peter Neronha: Well, I don’t know if it’s scary because I think all of us as attorneys general, including Letitia James, Tish, to those of us who know her well, aren’t afraid of Trump. But it’s clearly outrageous for the president uh to target the people who he feels aggrieved by. And whether it’s Attorney General James or James Comey, the former FBI director, that’s not the way our Justice Department is supposed to work. And it’s certainly not the way it worked when I served both Republican and Democratic presidents when I was in the Department of Justice myself for almost fifteen years. 

Jane Coaston: What are you hearing from fellow attorneys general about this case? 

Peter Neronha: When the president uh directed the Department of Justice to go after Attorney General James, the US Attorney for the Eastern District of Virginia, which was the US Attorney’s Office looking at the case at the president’s direction, when he wouldn’t do it, the president fired that U.S. Attorney. And then when the career prosecutors in the office wouldn’t do it, the president then went out and plucked um an interim or acting U.S. Attorney off the street and had her do it. His former personal attorney, who has no prosecutorial experience. The whole thing is outrageous. And not only as a colleague of of Attorney General James as an attorney general now, but as someone who served in the Justice Department, I can’t tell you how outrageous the whole thing is. It just flies in the face of how the department is supposed to and has always operated for hundreds of years, and it’s not the way to do justice. It’s alarming, frankly. 

Jane Coaston: Yeah, you you’ve mentioned your experience. You were a federal prosecutor under the Obama administration. And this strikes me as another example of lawfare. We’re seeing the prosecutions of Letitia James, former FBI director James Comey, as you mentioned, and other opponents of Trump for political reasons. Trump was in office in 2017, and I’m sure he had a host of people who he would have wanted to go after or he would wanted to direct people to go after. And perhaps with regard to the Russia investigation. I mean, that’s kind of where the Comey thing comes in. 

Peter Neronha: Right. 

Jane Coaston: What changed so that this became a horrifying new normal? 

Peter Neronha: Yeah, what changed is he has enablers about around him. And so Pam Bondi, Attorney Attorney General Bondi, is a far cry from former Attorney General William Barr, who, look, from some perspectives, was no great [?] himself, but there are things he wouldn’t do. And this is the kind of thing he wouldn’t do. I met Attorney General Barr during President Trump’s first term. And, you know, he was a conservative guy, no question. Very different from Attorney General Bondi, who has, first of all, has never been in the Justice Department before. She was the Attorney General of Florida. That doesn’t mean she has any federal experience, and she doesn’t. But beyond that, she’s willing to use the Department of Justice as a tool of the administration. And look, I served President George Bush too. And it wasn’t like that under him either. So this is a sea change in the way the Department of Justice is being run. And any notion that Pam Bondi was surprised by this indictment is just ludicrous. I mean, the Department of Justice policy, as you push things to the front office, what that means is the Attorney General herself, she’s as responsible as anyone else, including the president. 

Jane Coaston: You’ve been working with a lot of other states attorneys general to fight against Trump policies on a lot of fronts, from DOGE spending cuts to education funding clawbacks, research grant restrictions, freezes on wind energy development. And in a lot of cases, you’ve either initiated or joined multi state lawsuits. What have been some of your wins so far? 

Peter Neronha: Yeah, look, we filed I think 12 lawsuits in the district of Rhode Island alone out of the 40 or so. So my district, my office has been very active here along with my colleagues. And so in Rhode Island, for example, we have saved for Rhode Islanders, a state of a million people, $650 million at least that the president was trying to take away from us in congressionally authorized funds, from everything from education to infrastructure, bridge building, highway building, healthcare, and beyond. So it’s in many instances it’s been about money. And we’ve won every single case we’ve brought in the district of Rhode Island, both at the district court level and at the first circuit level. There are a couple of cases that are still pending, but we expect to be successful in those two. And the reason is is because we are right on the law, and the president is wrong on the law. And so where we have an opportunity to fight for our citizens, we’re doing that, and we’re winning. 

Jane Coaston: But in a lot of those multi state cases against Trump’s policies, you’re getting, say, maybe half of the US State’s attorneys general to join you because of–

Peter Neronha: Yes. 

Jane Coaston: –the political divides that we have. 

Peter Neronha: Right. 

Jane Coaston: So what good do these coalitions do when it’s reflecting the divides we already see in Congress? Where it just is like Republicans say he can do whatever he wants and Democrats stand up? 

Peter Neronha: Yeah, look, I think it’s putting pressure on attorneys general in those non-democratic attorneys general states. So in the red states, let’s use that as opposed to blue states, which are the Democratic states, they’re not hanging on to that funding that I just mentioned. So compare New Hampshire to Rhode Island, if we’re going to stay just in New England. Another state of about a million people, maybe a little bit more. That’s $650 million that we saved for Rhode Islanders, their attorney general didn’t save for the people of New Hampshire. And that has been a pressure point for him and the governor there. And that’s been going to be a pressure point for Americans in those red states as they lose the healthcare funding, the research funding, the infrastructure funding that the president has taken from them, and their Republican attorneys general haven’t fought for on their behalf. So that’s money that the Congress has allocated them for disaster relief, for example. And you know, winter is coming, but I’m not just referring to, you know, the game of thrones here. Winter’s coming across the United States. There are going to be natural disasters. And the president has cut that money for red states as well as blue states. The difference is by going to court as a coalition of blue states, many times in Rhode Island, that’s when we file these cases, we’ve been successful for all of the blue states. So the blue states have come up winners, the red states have come up losers. And as that continues to play itself out, I believe, over the course of the Trump administration, people in those states are going to wake up and realize, I hope at least, that they elected the wrong guy. And they elected members of Congress and attorneys general that won’t stand up for them. 

Jane Coaston: Attorney General Neronha, thank you so much for joining me. 

Peter Neronha: Oh, it’s been great. Thank you for having me on. 

Jane Coaston: That was my conversation with Rhode Island Attorney General Peter Neronha. We’ll get to more of the news in a moment, but if you like the show, make sure to subscribe, leave a five-star review on Apple podcasts, watch us on YouTube, and share with your friends. More to come after some ads. [music break]

[AD BREAK]

Jane Coaston: Here’s what else we’re following today. 

[sung] Headlines.

[clip of Vice President J.D. Vance] Yes, I believe that we are on the cusp of peace in Gaza for the first time, not just in a couple of years, but really in a very long time, because the President of the United States has done something that no other world leader has been able to do. 

Jane Coaston: Vice President J.D. Vance went on Meet the Press Sunday morning to discuss the ceasefire between Israel and Hamas. But he also made clear everybody knows this is all thanks to our fearless and totally competent leader, President Donald J. Trump. At the time of this recording Sunday evening, all twenty living Israeli hostages held by Hamas are expected to be released soon. 

[clip of Vice President J.D. Vance] So you can’t say exactly the moment they will be released, but we have every expectation, and that’s why the president is going, that he will be greeting the hostages early next week. 

Jane Coaston: After the hostages are freed, Israel will be ready to receive the remains of 28 dead hostages. The country will also release about 2,000 Palestinian detainees. The timing of the release for the Palestinian prisoners has not been announced, but the group includes 1,700 people taken from Gaza during the war and held without charge. After the prisoner exchange, Israel will allow more humanitarian aid into famine-stricken Gaza, which the UN has called, quote, “a wasteland.” Aerial footage shows much of the territory reduced to rubble. Trump plans to greet the hostages in Israel upon the release Monday. The historic ceasefire deal marks the end of two years of war, with tens of thousands killed and nearly 90% of Gaza’s population displaced. The next phase of the deal, which would determine Gaza’s post-war government, remains shaky as negotiations continue. Trump announced via Truth Social Saturday that during the ongoing government shutdown, Secretary of Defense Pete Hegseth can quote, “use all available funds to get our troops paid on October 15th.” The funds will be taken from the Pentagon’s research and development budget, which is um not legal. Will that stop them? Who knows? Should the troops not get paid, it would be the first time in modern US history that military members outside the Coast Guard would miss a paycheck due to a government shutdown. Meanwhile, as the government shutdown approaches its third week, the Smithsonian Institute’s 19 museums and the National Zoo have temporarily closed their doors, and the congressional stalemate is as bitter as ever. Democrats are holding their ground. Here’s Connecticut Senator Chris Murphy on CBS’s Face the Nation Sunday. 

[clip of Senator Chris Murphy] J.D. Vance and Donald Trump’s number one priority is protecting billionaires, protecting corporations, and raising premiums, raising health care costs by 75% on American citizens. So yes, I I think that Democrats should say if you want our votes for the for a budget, it can’t be a corrupt budget. It can’t be a budget that is gonna devastate the lives of middle class families in this country in order to protect and reward billionaires. That’s a pretty reasonable request. 

Jane Coaston: For his part, South Carolina Republican Senator Lindsey Graham would have none of it. On Sunday, he told NBC’s Meet the Press that he’s so sorry that thousands of Americans are going to suffer, but there’s nothing to be done when Democrats insist on unreasonably affordable health care. 

[clip of Senator Lindsey Graham] I don’t want anybody to lose their job because of a shutdown. I hate it when people get furloughed. I hate that the military can’t can’t get paid. The FBI. I hate all that. I’m willing to vote to open the government up tomorrow to my Democratic friends. I am not gonna vote to extend these subsidies. 

Jane Coaston: The government shutdown is expected to hit the economy this week as agencies begin to withhold billions in federal paychecks and government services. Health and Human Services Secretary Robert F. Kennedy Jr. took the same approach to public health on Friday that he once took to a dead whale in 1994. Which is to say, he made a huge mess by severing over a thousand centers for disease control and prevention staffers from their jobs. The dismissals were among the more than 4,000 the Trump administration issued in response to the ongoing shutdown. The initial cuts even targeted leaders of the CDC’s measles response in the middle of a measles outbreak, along with officials who have managed Ebola and MPOX outbreaks abroad. After details about the firings became public, a federal health official said Saturday that some layoff notices had been sent in error and would be reversed. Now the administration is quietly walking a lot of this back, scrambling to rehire many of the same experts they let go, after realizing the cuts had crippled outbreak surveillance and response efforts. The mistakes rocked an agency already in tumult. The CDC lost about a third of its staff in April, when Elon Musk’s DOGE took its proverbial chainsaw to the agency, only for many to be rehired weeks later. The former director of the CDC’s National Center on Immunization and Respiratory Diseases, Dr. Demetre Daskalakis, said, quote, “the CDC is over. It was killed. This administration only knows how to break things. They have made America at risk for outbreaks and attacks by nefarious players. People should be scared.” I, for one, am following doctors’ orders. We do not want a tariff war, but we are not afraid of one. That’s from a statement China’s Commerce Ministry issued Sunday in response to Trump’s 100% tariff threat. Trump threatened Friday, in a Truth Social post, of course, to jack up the tax on imports from China by November 1st. Why? Because of new Chinese restrictions on the export of rare earths, which are vital to a wide range of consumer and military products. Mind you, after Trump’s threat, the broad S&P 500 stock market index plunged 2.7%, its worst day in about six months. In its post Sunday, China’s Commerce Ministry said, quote, “frequently resorting to the threat of high tariffs is not the correct way to get along with China.” Trump took to Truth Social again, saying, quote, “Don’t worry about China, it will all be fine. Highly respected President Xi just had a bad moment. He doesn’t want depression for his country, and neither do I. The USA wants to help China, not hurt it.” The back and forth threatens to derail a planned meeting between Trump and Chinese President Xi Jinping later this month, and upend the fragile truce in a trade war that reached new heights in April. Vice President J.D. Vance on Sunday spoke to Fox News’ Maria Bartaromo, calling it a quote, “delicate dance.” 

[clip of Vice President J.D. Vance] And a lot of it is gonna depend on how the Chinese respond. If they respond in a highly aggressive manner, I guarantee you the president of the United States has far more cards than the than the People’s Republic of China. If, however, they’re willing to be reasonable, then Donald Trump is always to be is always willing to be a reasonable negotiator. We’re gonna find out a lot in the weeks to come about whether China wants to start a trade war with us or whether they actually want to be reasonable. I hope they choose the path of reason. 

Jane Coaston: You know, reasonable, like Trump. Trump has raised taxes on imports from many US trading partners since taking office in January, seeking to win concessions. But China has been one of the few countries that hasn’t backed down, relying on its economic clout. And that’s the news. [music break]

[AD BREAK]

Jane Coaston: That’s all for today. If you like the show, make sure you subscribe, leave a review, enjoy another episode of the continuing series, wow, the friends of convicted sex offender Jeffrey Epstein sure were enthusiastic about Jeffrey Epstein and tell your friends to listen. And if you’re into reading, and not just about how on Sunday, the Daily Mail published an email sent by Prince Andrew to Epstein in 2011, after Epstein had pled guilty to charges of solicitation of prostitution with a minor, which reads, quote, “It would seem we are in this together and we’ll have to rise above it. Otherwise, keep in close touch and we’ll play some more soon.” Like me, What a Day is also a nightly newsletter. Check it out and subscribe at Crooked.com/subscribe. I’m Jane Coaston, and the worst part of that email is the word play, right? Like worse than we are in this together. Like, yeah. [music break] What a Day is a production of Crooked Media. It’s recorded and mixed by Desmond Taylor. Our associate producers are Emily Fohr and Chris Allport. Our video editor is Joseph Dutra. Our video producer is Johanna Case. We had production help today from Greg Walters, Matt Berg, Sean Allee, Gina Pollack, and Caitlin Plummer. Our senior producer is Erica Morrison, and our senior vice president of News and Politics is Adriene Hill. We had help today from the Associated Press. Our theme music is by Colin Gilliard and Kashaka. Our production staff is proudly unionized with the Writers Guild of America East. [music break] [AD BREAK]