The Best of ISOM in 2022 | Crooked Media
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December 30, 2022
The Best of ISOM in 2022

In This Episode

Before we ring in the new year, the ladies of Imani State of Mind want to take a look back at the best highlights of 2022!




Dr. Imani Walker: Hey, everybody. Welcome to Imani State of Mind. I’m Dr. Imani. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: And I am Meg Scoop. Look at that. I mean, the year’s over. The year’s over Imani. 


Dr. Imani Walker: It’s over. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: What are we going to do? 


Dr. Imani Walker: It’s over. I know. It’s so crazy. It’s crazy because you and I met this year and I’m like–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yes. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –And look at us. Look. Look at us. Who would’ve thought? Who would have thought? Right? 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Who would have thought Girl? 


Dr. Imani Walker: Who would have thought? So here we are. It’s the end of the year. Um. I just want to give myself a little shout out, because today is my birthday. Um.


Meg Scoop Thomas: [singing] Happy birthday to ya. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yay. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: I just had to throw that in there. Happy birthday. You so cute girl.


Dr. Imani Walker: Thanks, thanks today’s my birthday. So I’m obviously kind of excited about that. But, you know, I’m going to I’m kind of laying low because I’m actually having like a bigger blowout um in a couple of weeks. So. Um.


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yes. 


Dr. Imani Walker: You know, if y’all want to see how the party was, you can check in a couple of weeks on the grams. Anyway, anyway. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: How what are you doing anything special for your birthday? I need to know. 


Dr. Imani Walker: You, honestly– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Like today. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Uh no. Like what I usually do on my birthday is I go and get what um my boyfriend Peter calls all my favorite slimy foods. Um. So–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Like eew. Like what? 


Dr. Imani Walker: Oysters, caviar–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Oh yes. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –Stuff like that. Yeah, like, I just. I just kind of go on like a gastronomic, like, orgy. Um. And he’s just like, eew eew, how can you eat that? 


Meg Scoop Thomas: I love it. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Eew, eew. I’m like–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Hater, hater, hater Peter. 


Dr. Imani Walker: I know. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Hater. 


Dr. Imani Walker: I’m like, just because you want to eat, like, chicken strips all day, you know what I’m saying? And not have like a cultured palate does not mean that you have to diss my um fine array of um slimy foods. So that’s pretty much what I do. And then I’ll probably, you know, keep watching Law and Order SVU because it’s my favorite show. I’ll probably just watch– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Okay. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –A bunch of autopsy, like just just get into the really gross shit that I like to do that he always chastises– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Okay. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –me for. Um. Go to my parents house like, you know, say, what’s up to my parents. Like, thank you for making me and raising me. Thank you for paying for medical school. That was really awesome. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Thank you. Okay. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Thank you. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: That’s good. 


Dr. Imani Walker: I don’t have any like any med school loans like for real. Um. And um. Yeah. And then I’ll just go to sleep. I mean, I’ll probably, you know, smoke out, dance around– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Okay I like it. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –in my backyard um. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: I like it.


Dr. Imani Walker: And then I’ll probably go to sleep. And then it’ll be New Year’s Eve, and then it’ll be you know, then, then maybe, I don’t know, New Year’s Eve. Maybe I’ll take some mushrooms. I don’t know. Probably. [laughter] And then–


Meg Scoop Thomas: I love this, all of these– 


Dr. Imani Walker: –And then. You know, just I’m just kind of just kind of kickback because it’s a it’s I mean, this time of the year is very reflective. It’s very um. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right.


Dr. Imani Walker: What word am I looking for? I guess what I’m trying to say is this time of the year is really like it’s kind of personal. Like it’s kind it’s introspective. That’s what I’m trying to say. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: There you go. Okay.


Dr. Imani Walker: Um. And so a lot of people you know are looking forward to like, oh, what am I going to do next year? What am I going to do, you know, as far as like resolutions and stuff like that um, you know? Well, we’ll we’ll get to that in a little bit. But in any case, I wanted to let everybody know who’s listening, all you listeners out there that today’s show is going to be a highlight of some of our favorite moments from the show this year. So I’m so excited, as I said earlier, to have met Meg, who is obviously the co-host of Imani State of Mind. And I’m just so thankful– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Don’t have me cry girl, don’t have me cry.


Dr. Imani Walker: No. I’m just so thankful and grateful that we were able to meet, although, I mean, because we didn’t know each other like we met through basically like people put us together. Um. The–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right, right.


Dr. Imani Walker: –Crooked Media production put us together. And um I’m so glad that we got to meet and we got to, you know, just Kiki and just do this every week. And I’m really thankful and I’m really grateful that, you know, we were able to like, you know, have a blossoming friendship, even though it’s even though it’s like through–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –Work. Yeah, yeah. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yes girl! This show has been like therapy for me in so many ways, not just because it’s a mental health podcast, but because, like, you know, just the hustle and bustle of life, us being able to talk about real issues, talk about current events, diagnose, you know, talk about our favorite shows and diagnose characters like it’s been so fun and I’m so grateful that, you know, we’ve gotten to do this this year. That I’ve– 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: –Been a part of this wonderful show. And and one word for this year is like one actually let me think about that. Do you have one word that you would describe 2022 for you? 


Dr. Imani Walker: Um. Yeah. I don’t know. I’m trying to think of one word, but I think like resolving, resolving. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Mmmm. 


Dr. Imani Walker: So, you know, 2020 for everybody around the world was just I mean, unless you live in a remote part of the world and you don’t have any type of interaction with anybody else who’s not like in your crew. 2020 was just completely I mean, I can’t, it was the words to describe 2020 were just out of control. Politically. We had a horrible president. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Everybody got sick. People died. 2021 was like kind of like, are we done yet? And then we weren’t. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right. 


Dr. Imani Walker: 2022 saw, you know, like a return to normalcy. Like I finally felt comfortable going out to concerts and stuff. Um. But I think personally, like for me it was just a matter of resolving a lot of the like, unnecessary drama that I had to deal with over the past, like maybe 4 t 5 years before um this year. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Okay. 


Dr. Imani Walker: So yeah, I just feel like I’m in a better place. I have a lot of plants. Um. They make me really happy. Um. I was definitely able to, you know, issue some pink slips to people that did not need to be in my life. Um. [laugh] 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yes. 


Dr. Imani Walker: So, yeah, I mean, I it’s it was it was basically kind of like a resolution of just things that I really– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Resolving. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –didn’t need in my life. So yeah, I would say– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: That’s dope. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –I would say resolving or yeah. What’s what’s your word? 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Resolving. I will say growth. I felt like I was, [?] I was. I’ve grown a lot in a lot of different ways. I’ve been stretched to my limit physically, mentally, emotionally, um in just different aspects of my life from my family. You know, I had a new baby. From you know–


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah. You had a whole baby. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yes girl. From that plus, like, career wise and and personal, like growth, just about myself. I’ve learned so much about myself, um you know, that I needed to, like, accept and needed to change right. And to me, that’s important because that to undo a lot of the things that you’ve learned–


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: It’s a lot of work. 


Dr. Imani Walker: It’s a lot.


Meg Scoop Thomas: But the other side of that is beautiful. And so I would say this year has definitely been growth for me. I’m in a growth phase. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah. Yeah. You know what? It’s so funny that that you mentioned growth because speaking of growth, so this week’s episode is actually going to be the last episode of Imani State of Mind on the Crooked Media network. But but listen, the show is not ending, okay? We’re still going to be here. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: No, no no. We’re going to take a short break and figure out the next steps. But our episodes are going to be available for you to enjoy. So don’t worry about that. We’ll make sure to share updates on what’s to come through our social media. So follow us on Instagram @ImaniStateofMind. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Follow me at @doctor.Imani. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: And follow me at @MegScoop. Enjoy your holidays and have a happy new year. Woo! 


Dr. Imani Walker: Woo! Yay! Yay! Okay, so resolutions, do you have any resolutions? Are you I think I asked you this like a couple– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: I already well– 


Dr. Imani Walker: –Podcasts ago, like like are you a resolution person? 


Meg Scoop Thomas: We did. I am not, which is why I’ve already started on, like I said, growth, I’ve already started. Okay. I started two weeks ago um with just like fitness because, you know– 


Dr. Imani Walker: Nice. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: –Your girl had a baby and I’ve just been staring at these uh plastic surgeon like Instagram sites for way too long. Instagram pages. And I’m like, Megan get your ass up and go work. Like, for real. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: So I’ve already started two weeks ago and I’ve changed my eating. So– 


Dr. Imani Walker: Nice. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: You know, I don’t I didn’t want it to be just for 2023. It’s like, Megan, you need to start today. Like, you should have been started a month ago, so let’s just start and that’s what I’m doing. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Nice. That’s awesome. I mean, now look– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yes. What about you?


Dr. Imani Walker: As somebody who–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Oh. 


Dr. Imani Walker: No, what I’m saying is as somebody who, you know, definitely works out a lot. I just want to say. Don’t. Like, have fun with it. Like, that’s–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right, right right right. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –the main thing. Like if– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: 100%. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –You see it as like, okay, I got to fit into this, I got to do into that instead of like being present in the moment and being like, Oh, this is tough right now, but like maybe in two weeks, this particular like exercise won’t, you know, won’t be tough like that those are really the milestones that that um that allow you to and and anybody else. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Including myself, that allow you to be like, oh, my God. Like, it’s time to work out like, yay. This is fun. So–


Meg Scoop Thomas: No and you know what, it’s different because I’ve always struggled with my weight, but this time it feels different, like working out. It doesn’t feel like a chore. And actually I have been laughing during my workouts, because–


Dr. Imani Walker: Nice. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Let me tell you, girl, I got this cute these, like, cute workout clothes, right? But the way that they like– 


Dr. Imani Walker: Okay. That’s half the battle. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: That’s half the battle, right? Cause I be looking at the mirror like I’m cute, but the problem is where they, like, suck me in on my stomach. The pooch part is still, like, there. 


Dr. Imani Walker: It’s there. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: So when I try to lift my leg. Am I? I be like, oh, my gosh. I got like a tire around my waist trying to do this. And it’s so funny because I’m looking in the mirror like Megan now, you know, good and well, good and damn well you can do a push up. Stop. Like–


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah. No, that’s– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: So it’s it’s been funny for me. Just to– 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: –Like, see, like. Girl, this is sad. Let’s go. Come on. Keep going. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah. No, I’m with you because that’s that’s me all day. I’m just like, oh, my God. I’m like, well, I’m like, I can drop it. I’m like, I can do this squat. Now whether I can– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: — [?] Pick it back up. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –Get back up. Right, I don’t know. I don’t know. I can sweep the floor, but then can I get the broom up off the ground. I don’t know, I don’t know. Like we gonna see. So, yeah. So no, I mean– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –That’s that, that’s really what I wanted to just, you know, stress to you and everybody else out there that um–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah don’t like just have fun with it. And then you’ll really be like, you’ll you’ll just kind of, like, look and like, you won’t even be tripping. And then, like, you’ll look in the mirror– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –One day and be like, oh, shit, oh, shit. Oh, shit, oh, shit. And then like, you’ll be on like on a high from that for like a week. So. Um.


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yes. 


Dr. Imani Walker: But, look, good for you. Go for you. Now–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yes girl. What about you? Any resolutions?


Dr. Imani Walker: I’m not a resolution person. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right. 


Dr. Imani Walker: I’m I’m more of an intention person. Um. And honestly, my intention this year is to just kind of keep doing what I’ve been doing. Um. I’ve been kind of laying the groundwork as far as like business, like business wise, as far as like my medical business. Um. So things are going to come to fruition probably like within the next month or so. And also just laying the groundwork for this podcast, um I’m really happy that people have been listening and enjoying it, and so it’s kind of time to take it to the next level, which is also why I’m so happy that I met you, because we’re really going to just like, take this to like a whole other level. So I’m really, really excited–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –um for, for 2023 and what that, what that’s going to mean. And outside of that, honestly, like they’re not really it’s not really an intention. I’ve just been kind of saving my money because I want to like do some home improvements. So I want to like, I want to build like two– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Oh yeah that’s dope.


Dr. Imani Walker: –of those ADUs. Yeah, I want to build two ADUs in my backyard. So I want like a little studio– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Wait what is that? 


Dr. Imani Walker: An ADU. It’s called, I think this stands for accessory like dwelling unit or something like that. But you can, you know, like you can build like a little. Like a little house, not a not a mini house, not them little tiny baby houses that people be. You can build that if you want to. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: [laugh] Okay wait. 


Dr. Imani Walker: But it’s kind of like–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Like a shed?


Dr. Imani Walker: Not a shed. They call them out here, like grandparents, grandparents suites or something. It’s like a completely different– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Like a guest house?


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah, like a like a little guest house. But it doesn’t have to be like a bed and a kitchen. So I want, like, I have an area– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Oh. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –Of my backyard right now that basically is like a little um. I don’t know, like a little palapa thing. Um. That you can sit in– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Okay. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –and like, you know, you just kind of vibe out. But I’m like, Yo, I actually really want to build a two-storey um ADU. So like, the bottom part will be like a studio. And then I want–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Okay. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –The top part to be like, um, to be a um like a little like a little rooftop like like, you know, like chill out garden spot. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Oh! 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: That’s cool. 


Dr. Imani Walker: And then across from that I want to build like a craft, like a, like maybe a two-storey, like crafting um not a shed, but like a– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Oh my gosh wow. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –Craft area because me and Peter be we be making shit up in here so [laughter] we need room like, like our kitchen is–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: It’s like, like we have all kinds of, there’s plants and there’s like I got like tomato plants growing and spinach growing and we’re like, making, like liquor, and we need space to, like, do stuff. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: And he can make shirts with, like, the cricket thing. And um so we need space. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Okay. 


Dr. Imani Walker: So I’m like, yeah, like that’s I want to, I want to do that for next year. So that’s, I mean– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Oh, that’s cool. 


Dr. Imani Walker: That’s it. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: That sounds good. 


Dr. Imani Walker: That’s it. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: That sounds really good. 


Dr. Imani Walker: I mean aside from that. Yeah, just, just do me keep doing just keep doing me. That’s about it. Um.


Meg Scoop Thomas: Keep doing you. That’s it.


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah. So that’s about it. But this year we have to, we would be remiss if we didn’t talk about some of the crazy things, some of the interesting–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –things that happened this year. Now, okay, almost a year ago there was the slap, right? We all know– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Heard around the world. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –what the slap is. We all know what the slap is. Slap was rather. Um. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: And the funny part is I usually, I usually don’t watch the Academy Awards because I’m just because they girl, they be naming movies. I’m like, I’ve never heard of that shit before in my life. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Ever. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: And then I’m watch and then I like, oh, let me go watch that. And I’d be like with my now why did this get nominated? 


Dr. Imani Walker: Right? I’m like, this was wack. They had I remember– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Who voted for this? 


Dr. Imani Walker: I remember they had a movie out a few years ago that won the Academy Award and it was called Brooklyn, but it was all white people in it. And I was like I don’t know what this is. I don’t I’m like, I don’t know what’s happening here. This is–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Oh. What is that like? Wi– is it Williamsburg. That part that’s like really white? Of Brooklyn? 


Dr. Imani Walker: I think it was about like Irish people or something, I don’t know. But I was like–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Oh. 


Dr. Imani Walker: I was like, I don’t know what part of Brooklyn y’all–


Meg Scoop Thomas: What year? 


Dr. Imani Walker: Girl. It was a long time ago. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Now, I was bout to say I was like when Brooklyn look like that? Okay. 


Dr. Imani Walker: I mean, Brooklyn has a lot of different ki– types of people, don’t get me wrong. But I guess–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –Like my Brooklyn, like the Brooklyn that I’m used to being in, I was like, I don’t, who were the what. So anyway, I was like, I don’t know or care. Um. But the slap. Okay, so here’s the thing. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: The slap.


Dr. Imani Walker: Black people largely and this is, you know, I could be wrong, but as a as a Black person and I’ll just say a self-appointed member of the Black delegation, I when I saw when I saw what happened, I was like, huh. What was most interesting to me at the time was that now let me tell you something. If even if my child walk walks up on me like too close, I’m I’m a step back, like, I’m like, okay, all right, like, what’s what’s up with you? Right. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: What tripped me out was. I was like, what? I’m like, why did why did Chris Rock like, here comes Will Smith stomping up the steps. Onto the stage. Here comes Chris. And then here’s Chris Rock. Like, hey, like smiling. Like, hey, how you doing? 


Dr. Imani Walker: And got slapped right? So I was like [laughter] I was like– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Slapped. 


Dr. Imani Walker: I don’t understand. So so the reaction that I heard from like most Black people I spoke too was and it, also as far as social media, I was like, we were all kind of like, why wouldn’t you just like, you knew something was about to happen. Like you could see his face, like you could see his body language. Like, why didn’t you just like back up or something? So then a few days later, let’s say a week later, I start hearing about how Chris Rock has a learning disorder, right? And I was like– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Uh Okay.


Dr. Imani Walker: I don’t know, I was like, I don’t know. I don’t know. But but apparently I read an article a while ago where he, Chris Rock, had stated that he’d he’s been seeing a therapist and this particular therapist diagnosed him with something called NVLD. Which is short for. Hold on. Sorry. I just had it. My bad. [pause] It is. Can y’all just tell me what this is. Y’all gonna say and nonverbal. Oh. Okay. Okay. Sorry, sorry. So apparently, Chris Rock has been seeing this therapist and he said that his this therapist, his therapist diagnosed him with something called Non-verbal Learning Disorder, which is uh also shortened to NVLD. So I was kind of confused. I looked it up. Um. It’s not in the DSM five or what’s known as like the psychology psychiatry Bible. Um. It says that it’s it’s it varies from person to person, but it says. So this says that NVLD is characterized by verbal strengths, but also there are visual, spatial, motor and social skills difficulties. So to quote Chris Rock, he said, all I understand are the words. Now, I was again a little bit confused, like, look at Meg’s face. I was a little confused because I was like, how would you be in movies– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right like– 


Dr. Imani Walker: –and you’ve been a comedian and you hosted like awards shows like out the ass like forever. I’m like you you’re like, you’re you’re a performer. So, like– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right. 


Dr. Imani Walker: How do you not understand nonverbal cues? Like, also, I’m like ain’t you from Brooklyn. Like, ain’t nobody run up on you weird. Like, I’m just confused. But apparently this is what Chris Rock has been diagnosed with. Um. It’s so apparently it’s it’s it’s not ADHD. It’s not dyslexia. But it can be the symptoms can manifest like in late elementary school or middle school. Um. One of his one of Chris Rock’s friends said something to him about like, oh, maybe you have Asperger’s. Now, when his friend said that to Chris Rock, he was 55 years old. Right. So. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Oh wow okay.


Dr. Imani Walker: Right. So Chris Rock says, you know, basically that like he’s always been viewed as like an oddball or just quirky. And so this is what he’s been diagnosed with. Chris Rock is not my patient. I’ve never you know, I’ve never treated anybody I never diagnosed anybody with this condition. It’s still a little confusing to me. But, you know, at the end of the day, I’m like, hey, Chris Rock, if this is what you say you have, this is what you say you have. Something else that I read apparently um had also um basically reinforced the fact that it’s not that people who have nonverbal learning disorder, it’s not that they can’t understand social cues or they can’t like they can. But there are certain social cues that they just don’t understand. I guess, so. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Okay. 


Dr. Imani Walker: So I was like, alright, I mean, I hear you. I just, you know, maybe it was confusing because he wasn’t in the street. And so, you know, Will Smith didn’t just run up on him like he was going to slap him. Maybe he was confusing–


Meg Scoop Thomas: That’s I mean, that’s what I thought. Yeah. I thought. Well, I think he because he’s, like, we’re in this professional white setting, like– 


Dr. Imani Walker: Right. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: My my street guard is down because I know. I know the Black people in here and they don’t act like that in front of the, like that’s not usually what happens, right? So I feel like there was to me, I thought it was because his defenses was down. He was like, oh we in like a, you know, we act different in front of these these white people. That’s what I thought it was. 


Dr. Imani Walker: I mean, yes, totally. Like I wasn’t there. It didn’t happen to me. I can completely understand that, I guess, because Chris Rock is a performer and he is able to kind of switch things up on a dime. Like if somebody ran up on me like that on stage, I would be like, okay. And then there’s a way I guess there there’s a way to play it off, again it didn’t happen to me. Hindsight is 20/20. He got slapped. We all seen it. Um. It was it was a lot. Will Smith now can’t go to the Academy Awards for ten years um and also honestly–


Meg Scoop Thomas: He don’t, he don’t care. 


Dr. Imani Walker: He don’t care. And the messed up thing about it is that all like I remember afterwards, everybody was like this Jada Pinkett fault, this Jada Pinkett fault. Da da da da da. This Jada Pinkett fault.  And I’m like well– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: She ain’t make that man go up there. He did that. 


Dr. Imani Walker: I’m like, Please, Will Smith is his own person. And quite honestly– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yup. 


Dr. Imani Walker: I mean. Chris Rock kept talking shit about Jada Pinkett being bald, and I was like, I thought, I mean, obviously because I’m bald too but I was like, she looks beautiful tonight. Like she looked beautiful– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –At the Oscars. So I think all around. I think everybody pretty much fucked up. But Will Smith just, you know, he went too far. These white people are not they they can’t handle that because to me, I was like, this just look like some Thanksgiving shit. Like you be around– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –up some family and somebody gets slapped and then, you know– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: You, you know, you all have a conversation about it and then everything is cool and you eat some more macaroni and cheese–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –and sweet potato pie, and then you’re done. But it just it wasn’t it wasn’t that. It was everybody seen it. So it just became, every you know–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –And and then, of course, because of that, then the white gaze comes in and things get murky. And anyway, so that was that was definitely that all happened almost a year ago. And we’ve been you know. Basically–


Meg Scoop Thomas: I can’t beli– yeah it’s like–


Dr. Imani Walker: –Talking about it since then.


Meg Scoop Thomas: It seems like it just happened. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: It seems like it just happened. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah yeah yeah. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: You know, one other story to highlight that happened this year is the overturning of Roe v Wade. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Girl. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: I think that’s for women. I feel like every woman was just like, what?


Dr. Imani Walker: Well yeah.


Meg Scoop Thomas: You know even women. And there’s, you know, there’s people who didn’t who are like, yes, finally. But I think for the most part, most people were like, this just doesn’t make sense. We’ve had this since the seventies. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: You know, and [clears throat] while we do now have Ketanji Brown Jackson as the first Black female justice on Supreme Court, it was a little too late to help us, I guess, with that. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah. Yeah. I mean, don’t get me wrong. I, I saw the news stories leading up to the overturning of Roe v Wade, and I was fully prepared that it was going to be overturned. Um. I live all the way out here in California, so I knew that California was not trying to hear that shit. So I was just like, okay–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right. 


Dr. Imani Walker: That’s fine. But. We I know we talked about this before in the podcast, but it’s it’s really just like the fallout and the repercussions are just so crazy because there, you know, there are people who have been trained to be, you know, obstetricians and gynecologists. And depending upon where they practice, you know, it’s like, well, I’m trained to give abortions. Like this is a medical procedure, but like legally I can’t do it. Like, it’s just it’s wild, so. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: I don’t know. I mean. It’s the one thing that has been really, really, I guess reaffirming, reaffirming my, you know, my, my love of humanity [laughing] is the fact that when it came to when it came to like certain states voting to code to codify it in their constitution, they were like, Oh yeah, even people that were like on the real I don’t I’m not I don’t agree with abortion, but it doesn’t mean that, like, I should have the right to dictate someone’s choice or lack thereof. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: So that was– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Because we’ve I mean, the majority of us who are alive, we it’s never been it’s never been an issue like, oh, you want to get an abortion. Okay, great. It’s more it mostly was– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Well. Who’s going to pay for it? Or how much does it cost? 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right right. 


Dr. Imani Walker: As opposed to like, can I actually have one? So– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah. 2022 just keeps on 2020-ing out here. So–


Meg Scoop Thomas: [laughing] 2022-ing.


Dr. Imani Walker: Right. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: And now– 


Dr. Imani Walker: 2022-ing. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: But that’s okay. That’s behind us. Nothing but new adventures, new opportunities in 2023. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yes. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: So excited. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yes, I’m so excited. So in two days we get a brand new year to go through some more crazy craziness. But before I forget, everybody listening, if you are loving the show, please let us know by rating the show on your favorite podcast app. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: And we’ve had so many great moments this season. I don’t know how we’re going to just pick a few, but let’s get this show started. [music break]


Dr. Imani Walker: Okay. So, of course, we love hearing from all you guys, when we asked you to tell us what’s on your mind. You all did not hold back. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: That’s right. It’s time for Ask Dr. Imani anything. And one of our favorite letters came from our girl, London Nicole. And she writes, Hey, ladies. Hey, girl. It’s your very single listener here. Or should I say Little Miss Forever single? I think I’m broken. I tell all my friends I have no problem getting a man, but every problem keeping them. Whenever things start going good, I find some way to sabotage it. I don’t know how to not bring my past insecurities or relationship problems into the new relationship. I overthink every text exchange, every call and interaction to the point I will wake up in the middle of the night overthinking. My friends say I put all my eggs in one basket way too fast, but I have a fear of being alone. It’s almost an obsession daily on figuring out how not to be alone. Diagnose me, please, so I can start working on my problems and stop running these men away. [laughter]


Dr. Imani Walker: Okay. Um. London Nicole.First of all, this letter is hilarious. And this also sounds like me back– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –When I was very, very single. I mean, I, you know, I joke on here–


Meg Scoop Thomas: I think every woman has like had a like, everybody can identify with this at some point in their life, right? For the most part.


Dr. Imani Walker: Oh, yeah. Yeah, for sure. Like when I when I was living in New York and I always joke on here that like, I was running these streets, but I was, for the most part, running these streets. I was the same way. Like, I like I like being alone. But there’s a difference between, like, being alone in the summertime and being alone when it’s, like, snowing outside. [laughter]


Meg Scoop Thomas: And this was back when I was living in New York. And so, you know, you really like winter boo season is real. And it’s like, oooh, it’s the fall, I got to find somebody, like, I need to grab somebody quick because I do not like sleeping in this big ass bed that it will get cold. Like, I remember legit. Like I had male friends, like we were just friends. Like there was nothing romantic going on and there would be times where like they would come over or I’d go to their house in the dead of winter in New York just so that we could be warm together like nothing happened. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Where was y’all’s heaters? Why did y’all need to have bodies? 


Dr. Imani Walker: Because it’s like we definitely had heat. I had heat in my house, but it’s just like, okay, it’s like I’d be in a bed and let’s say it’s like February in New York and where I’m sleeping, like it’s warm. But then when I go to stretch my legs out, it’d be cold. That shit be aw that shit is depressing. I’d be like, damn I’m all alone, [laughter] all alone up in this bed. So sometimes, like me, me and my male friends, like my  uh platonic male friends, we would do that every so often. Like, bitch it’s cold. Like you wanna come over? Cause this is like, I do not feel like this shit is terrible. So anyway, back to you, London Nicole. So here’s the thing. Like Meg said, I think we all go through a similar type of, you know, season, if you will, in our lives. Honestly, I can’t diagnose you because it just kind of sounds like you may be going through any number of things and you may just need to talk to somebody about it. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: I’m a I’m a diagnose her. London. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Okay Oh! Okay.


Meg Scoop Thomas: I’m a diagnosis you as being– 


Dr. Imani Walker: My bad. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: –Bored. As being bored.


Dr. Imani Walker: I was going to say that. [laughing]I was going to say that. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: London you’re bored girl, it’s that simple. I’m reading there like–


Dr. Imani Walker: You need to go volunteer girl. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: –you have too much time on your hands. If you have, every text exchange, every call, every interaction, waking up in the middle of the night, girl you don’t have enough going on of like personally, because if you did, you’d be like, I don’t have time to think about that, I got to go to bed. Like I am tired. I have stuff to do. There’s there’s got to be you’re not focusing on you enough. 


Dr. Imani Walker: You know what? Remember how. Okay, we do a last episode I was like, Well, I’m trying to be you be like I’m trying to be nice about it. I was like, uh uh I was like, this is stupid. This is what this sounds like. I was trying to be nice about it. Like, maybe you need therapy. Meg was like, you sound bored. Ugh. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: That’s what it is! 


Dr. Imani Walker: Um. I was going to kind of say that later. I was going to say cause cause legit. If you’re overthinking every text exchange and call and you be waking up in the middle of the night. Like, Oh, my God, like, girl, you need. You need something to do. So, like–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Volunteer, go join a gym. Uh. I don’t know, like but–


Meg Scoop Thomas: What do you like? What do you– 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: –like to do? 


Dr. Imani Walker: That might be it too. Like, you got to focus on you first, and then whoever is worthy enough to be with you will come, you know, like, yeah, but don’t be out here chasing, you know, tail because is you not gonna get nowhere. You might have some–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right and–


Dr. Imani Walker: –really nice dinners, but no. [laughter] So. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: And I mean I’m telling you, I remember this–


Dr. Imani Walker: I can’t diagnose you girl, I’m sorry. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: You got my diagnosis girl, bored. So, I mean, like I said I encourage you to find something that you like to do because that will fill up some of your time. You’re still probably going to feel that, you know, like–


Dr. Imani Walker: Emptiness. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: –What’s wrong with me, because you know, because we always think about that. I remember when I when I first moved to L.A., I was super single for like years because I was working four jobs, hustling and trying to make my dreams come true. So I didn’t have a lot of time to be with anybody. But it didn’t take away the feeling of like, why am I by myself? I’m, you know, I see other people flourishing in their relationships and I got nothing. And I just remember crying in my bed like, why I got to be so lonely. Why can’t like, where’s my happy ending? You know, I remember thinking all these things, but then you know what happened? Like how it actually, I guess my singleness ended, it ended when I started getting so busy and my life started getting so full. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Mm hmm. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: When I started really concentrating on me and what I wanted to do, then it was just like everything just kind of falls into place. But if you’re waiting for that, you going to get every sorry– 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: –dude that was not meant for you. You’re going to have a whole lot of issues with men that you’re going to have to talk about years from now with your homegirls. Like you don’t want those stories. So– 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: –just do you, live your life, focus on what you want to do, find a hobby, find someone to help. I mean, whatever you can do, girl, and then your boo will come. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah, exactly. I can attest to that. Because after I separated from my husband, I was just doing me. And I mean, I knew the person that I’m with now for longer than I actually knew my ex husband. But um. But that really was when I think I was ready. And I was I mean, I was filming a show. I was working out all the time. I was working full time. Like I was just doing me like I had my whole day planned um and I really wasn’t thinking about a relationship like that. So, yeah, I would, you know, I would honestly, you know, just like Meg said, like, like, do you girl, like find some hobbies because because thinking about this, it sounds like to me, London Nicole it’s kind of like a hobby in and of itself for you and you need to find a more productive hobby. So that’s what I would that’s the advice I’d give. I can’t diagnose you, but I mean, Megan said you bored. [laughter] 


Meg Scoop Thomas: That’s just so why you’re afraid of being alone. That is important– 


Dr. Imani Walker: Right. Yeah that is.


Meg Scoop Thomas: Because you said you put you move way too fast. Why are you so afraid of being alone? What about aloneness is scary to you? 


Dr. Imani Walker: Right. Because there’s aloneness and there’s loneliness. And they are two separate things. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah, I like being alone. Like, I’m like, ooh, yay. Now I get to just, like, chill and spread out and, you know, play with my plants and whatever. Um. So so London Nicole, thank you so much for your letter. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Our producers reached back out to London Nicole and we’re excited to say our girl found her a hobby and turned it into a new career change. She opened up a juice bar in her city and she says that business has been booming and she’s enjoying her new cash flow. She said for the first time in her life, she’s just enjoying her own company as she’s building a juice company. 


Dr. Imani Walker: That is so awesome. Like I that that’s I’m like, I’m so I’m so I’m so, so happy for you London Nicole. I love I love, love love this update. So the on the other hand. Meg, remember our listener, Dani? Who was addicted to cheating? That was legit, one of the wildest letters we’ve ever received. So let’s listen to what Dani had to say. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Our first letter is from Dani, and she writes, Dr. Imani and Meg, don’t judge me when I say this, but I am addicted to cheating. I have been in a relationship for the past 14 years, ten out of the 14 years I haven’t been faithful to my man. And don’t get me wrong, my man is a good man and does everything he’s supposed to physically and mentally. But there’s a certain thrill I get from cheating. I’m obsessed with the high I get from getting away with something I know is wrong. Lately my man has been talking about us getting married, so the guilt of my cheating obsession is finally getting to me. My best friend thinks asking him to be in a polyamorous relationship will fix the desires to cheat. And I think it’ll only have me cheating on multiple partners instead of one. What do you think I should do? Could I have a deeper problem than just being addicted to the rush of cheating? Any advice you can offer to help me stop cheating would be greatly appreciated. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Oh, my God. Okay. All right, Dani, listen. Um. Let me tell you something. [sigh] Whether you’re in a “monogamous” and I’m using this in quotations or polyamorous relationship like you just trife. Okay? And I’m and I’m just saying this listen, I’m saying this as somebody who for quite a long spell of my adulthood was trife as well. I’m not going to say that I was, like, addicted to cheating. I just how do I put this? I didn’t have a really good example of a father figure, and my dad cheated on my mom. And as much as I would say to myself, like, oh, my God, I would never do that. I would never do that. It’s it’s I mean, like you said, you like the thrill. You like the thrill of like deceiving people. You like the thrill of basically having to cover up your tracks. And if that’s the case, honestly, I suggest that you, I don’t know, like go play a board game. Like go play clue or something. Like go like play a video game where you got to bob and weave and dodge. Like, you know what I’m saying like this is unfortunately it’s just trifling behavior. And I’m only saying that well I’m saying that because it is. But but I’m saying that also because even if you’re in a polyamorous relationship, polyamorous relationships have rules. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right. 


Dr. Imani Walker: So. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: And it’s like that’s the part that she doesn’t like is the rules. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Right. And if you don’t like the rules. Then you need to not be in a relationship and you just need to go and be in these streets and live your life. But I understand. Here’s what I’ll say. I do understand the fact that you do like having someone to go home to. The issue is that if you want that in your life, then you’re going to have to learn how to respect and honor relationships and respect and honor the person you are with, and respect and honor the love that the person is giving to you. And if you can’t do that, then you can’t be in a relationship, whether it’s one person or two people or five people. There are people who are in polyamorous relationships, and it’s not about just going out and like, you know, acting a god damn fool. It’s about we’re together. But I’m going to notify you if I like somebody, we’re going to discuss it. Like being in a polyamorous relationship oftentimes takes even more trust and communication and discussion than a monogamous relationship. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: There’s no thrill in that because there’s– 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: –multiple people that you now have to check into and be honest with. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Exactly. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: You know. She’s right, when she’s like, oh, I probably just cheat on all them too. Yes, you will. 


Dr. Imani Walker: You will. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: You are going to cheat on all of them, Dani. No, don’t do polyamory. It ain’t for you. 


Dr. Imani Walker: It’s not. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Cause what you need to do is honesty. And I and this is what I this is what I truly believe. Dani, you need to go ahead and tell your man that this is what you’ve been doing. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Right. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: I have a strong feeling that he has– 


Dr. Imani Walker: He doing the same thing girl. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Either that or he knew. Because for you to have–


Dr. Imani Walker: Right. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: –done this, ten out of the 14 years– 


Dr. Imani Walker: Right. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: That y’all have been together. I’m pretty sure you ain’t been. You’ve been sloppy at least once. During that–


Dr. Imani Walker: Listen. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: –14 Years. He knows some– he knows something. So I feel like when you tell him there’s a high possibility– 


Dr. Imani Walker: He gonna be like I already know. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: –He will just be like. I already know. And I’m okay with it, actually. Right?


Dr. Imani Walker: You know he probably he probably push send on this letter. I’m just kidding. [laughter]


Meg Scoop Thomas: But he. But the issue is what’s going to happen is Dani’s no longer going to find the thrill of cheating because now he knows. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Right. Exactly. And so it’s– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: And the thrill is gone. 


Dr. Imani Walker: -not fun, right? It’s not fun to be like, okay, I’m a go um I’m a go fuck with um um Earl. He going to be like, I know. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: And that’s what I’m saying so I think– 


Dr. Imani Walker: And she gonna be like well forget it. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: I think you need to be hone– [laughing] 


Dr. Imani Walker: Forget it then I’m a just stay home with you. Right.


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Right. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: So you should try that, Dani. Try being honest with him, because I think you might be pleasantly surprised and it may take the thrill away. So now you’re like, well what’s the point of cheating anyway? He knows. No, I don’t want to do this this anymore. But that could be one option. The other option is that he leaves your ass. And that is actually what I hope he does, because that is trifling for you to be doing this behind this man’s back for fourteen years. 


Dr. Imani Walker: For fourteen years!


Meg Scoop Thomas: And you said he’s a good man. If he’s a bad dude, I’m maybe I could understand. But you said he was a good dude. So like for you to do–


Dr. Imani Walker: If he a bad dude. Don’t be with him. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: That’s what I’m saying. Like it just so you’ve done this to a very good person, as you’ve described him to be. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah. You should feel terrible.


Meg Scoop Thomas: I hope he says I’m done. I don’t want to do. And then what happens is once he’s gone, you will then realize the ramifications of your actions. And that may prompt you to stop being a cheater. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Exactly. Yeah. Yeah.


Meg Scoop Thomas: Hopefully. I don’t–


Dr. Imani Walker: And I yeah. And I’m just saying, as somebody who legit was like just on some ho-ish behavior like, I mean, basically caused the breakup myself because I was just out in these streets and even though like I was like, oh, my heart is broken, what am I going to do? It was like, Imani, that’s your fault. Like you did it. Like you played yourself. And it was like, Okay, let me I’m a get with somebody else. And then I’m gonna do the thing and then like, Oh God, why. And it’s like, why? Because you trife. Like, Imani, you trife. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Wait. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Like stop. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: So what made you stop being like that then? 


Dr. Imani Walker: Um I just honestly, I think I just got older and I just had okay first, first and foremost, it’s not necessarily age, but I. But I did get older and I think with age comes experience and they’re just like it. Like, I just was like, I don’t want to be trife no more like this is wack. Like if somebody did the same thing, like because I was like ooh if somebody does the same thing to me, I don’t even care. And then I met somebody where if I knew that if that person did the same thing to me, I’d be completely devastated. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Mmm okay. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Like, I would just be like. How could you? And ahh like. It would. It would just be terrible. And I just. You know, and I just. I didn’t want to put I didn’t want to put him through that. But also what changed that is therapy. Dani, also you need to go to therapy, girl. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Mmhmm. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Like you got issues. Just like I have issues. Had issues you need to like there’s, there’s so much going on that you’re not admitting or accepting and this is why you’re doing that same behavior. I, I want to actually, like, put my money on like you were, you saw your parents do this or you saw something, but like something very close to you. Basically, you saw somebody as a young age, like just acting an entire fool. And that’s why you do the same thing. So um yeah–


Meg Scoop Thomas: And this is this is like some a case of narcissism, too, as well. Right? 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah. I mean. Well, yeah. Yeah. I mean, definitely. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah cause she has– 


Dr. Imani Walker: Traits. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: –of Narcissism? 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah. There’s some traits, you know, it’s it’s like, I mean, essentially that. Well, we’ll get into it a little bit later because we are talking discussing narcissism today. But I get the sense, Dani, that you don’t have a lot of empathy for your partner. Doesn’t mean that you are a narcissist, but there’s clearly not um. I mean, you do. You do. It’s that you did say that you have some guilt about your cheating obsession, especially since your man’s been talking about y’all getting married. But, like, do not pleae. Seriously, do not pass go. Do not get married. Like– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: No. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Just get out of this relationship and, you know, or at the very least, tell him and then go to go to couples therapy. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah.


Dr. Imani Walker: But there needs to be a therapist up in your life. So. Thank you, Dani. Um. I’m sorry I called you trife. But your behavior is trife.


Meg Scoop Thomas: We heard from Dani, she didn’t tell her man. She did not tell her man y’all. Dani’s man actually popped the question during Thanksgiving break and she said yes. Now, she also said that she started therapy to heal from her trauma to figure out why she loves to cheat but has no plans to tell her man she cheated. So think of that what you will. She’s proud to say she’s busy playing the, She’s proud to say she’s planning the wedding. So she hasn’t had any time to even think about cheating. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yet. I’m just kidding. I mean hoo– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: We wish you well. We wish you well Dani. Okay.


Dr. Imani Walker: We wish you well. We wish you well. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Stay [?].


Dr. Imani Walker: I just, you know. Great for you, Dani. Congratulations. Um. I hope that your husband or your soon to be husband does not listen to this show. So, anyway. [laughing] Congrats to you. Thank you for all the listeners throughout this year for submitting your questions. We love your letters, so please keep them coming. And I hope our advice has been helpful. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yes. Now let’s switch gears. I’ve learned so much from working on this show seriously, like it’s been such a blessing to me. So the deep dive topics have helped me get my mind right and learn a few things along the way. [music break]


Dr. Imani Walker: Let’s look back at our most popular deep dive this year. And that was our show on grief. So obviously, grief is never easy. And from the response we got from you guys. Grief, of course, is never easy. And from the response we received from all you listeners, from this deep dive, many of you are trying to work through your grief. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: And, you know, for for this episode, it allowed me just to acknowledge my grief. And I hope it did that for you as well. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Grief is one of those things that we all will experience at one point in our lives. It’s multifaceted, and in a perfect world, we would be able to move through the stages of grief in an orderly and timely fashion, and at some point just be done. However, this is not the reality of grief. Grief is complicated. It’s hard and unpredictable. And unfortunately, it’s something that we can never truly prepare ourselves for. [sigh] Okay, grief. Now, I will tell a really quick story about let me see, when what year did I get pregnant, 2006. So in 2006, three of my four grandparents all died in like within a three month period. It was like January. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Wow. 


Dr. Imani Walker: I think it was March and then April. And I was like, I’m not someone who really had ever gone. I think I’d been to one funeral in my life, and at that point in 2006, I think I was like 29. I was twe– I was I was 29. I was about to be 30 and or I was 30, something like that. Anyway, I can’t I can’t do math today. But in any case, going to that many funerals and going to the funerals of my grandparents and even though I mean, they were old, like, it’s not like, you know, they died because like an anvil fell on their head. Or you know like–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right, right yeah.


Dr. Imani Walker: –any big anything unexpected. They they were old and they they passed away. But I think for me, as someone who I didn’t realize at the time that I was already depressed, all of that grief completely upended me. And um I just was I was just in a really just like low period for the first time I actually like like it’s like this was really unheard of for me. But I called my job and I was like, Yo, I need like a couple of days, like a week or something because I just I was like, I can’t I can’t push through this. I can’t do this. And it was funny because I remember my supervisor was like, Well, yeah, girl, like go take some time. And I was like, Oh, you’re not tripping. Like, Oh my God. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right, right. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Like, because I’m just so hard on myself about just like, work and stuff like that. But um, but, you know, it was um, I will say this, do not do what I did, which was to. I ended up getting pregnant like pretty much like if my grandmother’s funeral was in April, I got pregnant that month. I didn’t know I was pregnant at the time. So don’t do that. [laugh] Don’t–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Hold on. You got pregnant like right after her funeral or–


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: –you were already pregnant? 


Dr. Imani Walker: No, no, I got pregnant. I think like I think it was like the day before her funeral. And–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Wait, so was this like like this is like grief then you’re like ahh. Sex with you dude. 


Dr. Imani Walker: I didn’t. No, no, it wasn’t like it really wasn’t– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Okay. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –Planned out like that. Like, there was– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Okay. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –There was protection. Like, every, like, like I had covered all my bases before for whatever reason. Um. I got pregnant. My mom was like, this is your grandmother trying to come back. And I was like, Well, I don’t know about all that, but um. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: I mean, that’s what they say now. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: That’s what they say.


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah. I mean, I guess because people will also say, like death occurs in threes. So I think, you know, my grandmother was the my mother’s mother was the last person to um whose funeral I attended that year. And I was just like, ugh, so I got pregnant. And I’m sure, you know, that grief and my longstanding depression at that time fed into me having uh pre partum depression uh that I had– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Okay. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –During my pregnancy. But, you know, don’t go out and get pregnant. You know. Don’t, don’t, don’t take a plane and go, you know, go have sex with somebody and get pregnant like I did um what you [laugh] what you can do. What you can do are you know, basically a multitude of things. You know, you can definitely, you know, go out and, you know, talk to a friend, journal like get it out of your body. Like, don’t do what I did and just not speak on it, not talk about it, push it down–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Because it will pop up at the most unexpected times. And for me personally, it pops up but with anxiety like that, that’s what happens with me. But, you know, just just to give like a, you know, a quick kind of like a quick primer, like, you know, grief we all know what grief is. It’s it’s an emotional response to loss. And, you know, even though I’m someone who can be a bit morbid at times and I have been probably planning my funerals for the past like ten years, I just I just you know– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: What! 


Dr. Imani Walker: I just I don’t know, like–


Meg Scoop Thomas: For real? 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah, like I’m like, okay, this is this is how I want it. Okay, so, so it’s going to be like this. Like, I’m basically I’m going to have, like, a little like a funeral where like, you know, if people want to cry. They can cry. But then I’m a have a afterparty also. So I–


Meg Scoop Thomas: You know, I mean that’s not a bad idea. That does take some of the grief away for people because they don’t have to like they know you and they know what you wanted. So it’s like, okay, I don’t have to worry about that part. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah, yeah. And also– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: That’s good. That is good actually.


Dr. Imani Walker: I, yeah, I’m like, y’all I’m flying through the cosmos like I’m on a comet. Like, I’m not even tripping right now, like– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right, right. Earth is ghetto you left girl. You good. Like–


Dr. Imani Walker: [laughing] Like Earth is like–


Meg Scoop Thomas: You got up out of here. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Listen, I’m like, I’m. I’m like, sailing past black holes. I’m out here doing things. I’m visiting other planets bitch. Like I’m out here, um but but I also know that funerals are for the living. So I just wanted I mean, I legit want a afterparty like I literally have on Spotify, I have a playlist like it’s my funeral playlist. Um–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Stop. You already. You–


Dr. Imani Walker: No I’m for real. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: You already have that. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah. Cause I really like I really want it. I’m like, listen, you can come to, like, the first part if you want and, you know, pay your respects. Like, because I want to be respectful of the fact that other people are used to going to funerals and being sad because first I was like–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right, right. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Nobody can cry, nobody. But now I’m like, okay, Imani like– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: That’s stupid. Like, you people are going to be kind of sad, you know? I hope. [laughing] 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: That I’m that I’m gone but also people know my personality, which is a very goofy, you know, just–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –Like giggly person. So I’m just like, yeah, like lets like lets party. Like, we finna party, like, let’s, let’s do this. So my funeral planning aside, you know, I know that not everybody [laughing] is into that. But I one of the things I do want to touch on um is that when it comes to grief, there are various stages. Um. I always remember it again with the mnemonic uh DABDA, which is uh like D-A-B-D-A. So it’s denial then anger, bargaining, depression and acceptance. Now.


Meg Scoop Thomas: I want, wait before you go on, I was going to say this girl, you better learn how to spell your mnemonics because you put an extra B or extra D somewhere. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Did I? 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Like. Wait. 


Dr. Imani Walker: D-A– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: No no not you. I’m saying. I’m saying I would like I got to like I wouldn’t– 


Dr. Imani Walker: Oh. Oh.


Meg Scoop Thomas: I would mess this up girl I’d be like, wait, what is how do you spell the pneumonic. Is it– 


Dr. Imani Walker: D-D– [laughing]


Meg Scoop Thomas: –two B’s or one? [?]


Dr. Imani Walker: D-A-B as in boy and then D as in dog and then A. [laughing] So DABDA. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Alright girl. Good okay DABDA because I didn’t I probably spelt that wrong. Okay.


Dr. Imani Walker: Like Dab Duh. That’s, that’s how I remembered it. But, but um, but it’s denial, anger, bargaining, depression and acceptance. Now they these do not have to go in in a in in successive order. So you can be in denial. You can get to bargaining and then go back to denial. You can even–. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Okay. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –Go to acceptance and go back to anger like it doesn’t it doesn’t flow in a linear fashion. So– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Okay. 


Dr. Imani Walker: There are stages of grief. You know, we generally all go through with them. Listen, some people some people just stay in denial. And, you know, that means they have a lot of work to do. But, you know, at the other end, at the on the other side of grief is acceptance, which really, you know, I’m a big nerd. I watch a lot of Marvel. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Same. 


Dr. Imani Walker: I watch a lot of Marvel things, and there was something that Vision said to to Wanda in the, did you watch um did you watch uh Wandavision? 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yes, I did. I loved it. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Okay. So there was something that Vision said to Wanda, and it just touched me. I was just like, Oh, my God. That is like whoever wrote that line, like, you are killing it as a writer. So, you know, this is very short. Wandavision is the story of Wanda, who is uh Wanda Maximoff. She is the Red Witch in the Marvel Comics. And she goes through some grief because her her beau Vision, who’s like half Android, half human, he ends up dying. Um. This is at the end of– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Well one of the Avengers movies. And so she just she’s just completely beset with grief. And he tells her at one point and girl, okay, this is when remember when they were making those memes about Vision and he had like a little mock neck and they was– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah uh uh. 


Dr. Imani Walker: They was putting little chains on him and stuff because I was like, ooh–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: I was like, Ooh Vision do kind of look like Tommy from Martin though. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: He’s cute [?]. [banter]


Dr. Imani Walker: Okay. [laughing] So. So anyway, something that Vision said in his little Tommy um from Martin outfit is he said to her, what is grief if not love persevering. And I was like, Aww. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: That oh that’s true. 


Dr. Imani Walker: I was like, that’s true. I was like, that’s true. I was like I was like look at you, uh Black Vision. And I was like, you. I was like, you just be coming with the you coming with the fireworks today. So so [laghter] so I would say, you know, when we talked a little bit about funerals and I said that funerals are really for the living. And honestly, you know, one of the ways to cope with grief is to, you know, have take some time and honor the person that you’re missing, honor the person that passed away. It can be very difficult, especially if you have you know, especially if it’s somebody, you know, listen, even if it’s somebody you don’t know, like– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Let me tell like when Prince died, girl, I lost my entire mind. I don’t even really talk about it anymore. I was just so. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Aww. 


Dr. Imani Walker: I was so sad. I was so sad. I was just like, oh, my God. Like, what is like to the point– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: That’s how I was with Kobe. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: When Kobe died. Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: A lot of people were really upset when Kobe Bryant died, um especially the way that he died. When Chadwick Boseman passed away. I definitely–. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Like because it was I mean, it was just so noble. Like he strategically placed himself in movies knowing that these were going to be the testament of, you know, to his career and also to him as a person. And the fact that–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –He chose to play like, you know, James Brown and he chose to play T’Challa and did all that with with Colon cancer. I was like, oh, my God. Like– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right. 


Dr. Imani Walker: I mean, it was I mean, I was like, listen, if I if I can pull this this um epic um funeral playlist off, I mean, that’s a quarter of what Chadwick Boseman was able to do. Like he really strategically thought out, like, okay, I know that I’m dying, you know, let me let me do it like this. Um. So, you know, there’s there definitely is grief that you can experience if it’s somebody that you yourself know personally, but also, you know, when it comes to like grieving like as a community, because we do have a lot of reminders of the– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –Of the person that we loved so much. Absolutely. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. And you know what? I was gonna say something else about that, because sometimes it’s not always the death of a physical person. Sometimes it’s the death of your dreams, or what you thought something should have been, whether it’s like, you know, the loss of a relationship, the loss of a job, the loss of a career, the loss, the physical loss of somebody. And I think the one thing that I’ve learned about grief in my own life is like to allow myself to feel it and not to think you’re weak because you feel it. Because I think sometimes we’re like, ugh, I’m still like, sad about that. Or I thought I was past that. And then something happens. You see something and you know, it reminds you of of what you were su– what you thought you were supposed to have. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Mm hmm. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: And then it’s like, okay, now I’m back and I’m back in the DABDA stages. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Right. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Okay. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Right. Circling back. Yeah. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: For sure. For sure. I um there’s, you know, when, when COVID first started and I mean, when, it, like when Covid first dropped. Right? I was like, oh, this is interesting because there really weren’t a lot of like Black folks, people of color, you know, it wasn’t being reported at the time. And I was like, oh, my God. Like, maybe we’ll, you know, like me being delusional, maybe we’ll come on, you know, get out of COVID scot free. And it won’t really hit our communities very hard. But we all know that when it comes to, you know, really serious epidemics with this pandemic, um we are going to be hit the hardest. And–. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: I thought about the doctors, like the first responders, the doctors especially, who like like I used to be a resident and how like how terrifying it would be to have to go into work knowing that you’re putting yourself at risk. I remember back then there were shortages of shortages of masks, and people had to–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –Keep rewearing the same mask. And–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: We didn’t know as much as we know about COVID right now. And then I thought about like, you know, all the, you know, people of color, all the Black folks out there who were, you know, on the front lines and, you know, treating patients. And like I, I could not I seriously could not ever imagine anything like that um. I definitely, you know, started to watch trends as far as um as far as, like, Black folks dying, because when it comes to Black folks and grief. First of all, we already have a bit of a disposition towards holding a lot like we in a in a lot of circumstances I would say– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –More often than not, especially if you live in the United States as a Black person, you know why you’re here. Meaning, you know that slavery was is a part of your ancestry. And it doesn’t mean that that’s all that we are. Like, we’re not just, you know, the children of slaves, but I remember being a kid and learning about slavery and like, literally it taking me like a full day. I kept going up to my parents, like, okay, so hold up? So what you saying is like– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right, right. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –Explain this to me again. Like, explain this to me again. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Because I don’t, I’m like, I don’t understand like, what like did you say chains? Like, what are you talking about? So– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: We hold this place in our psyche, in our bodies, even for the grief of our ancestors. And then when you add on to it, the fact that we are more susceptible to dying earlier, dying in childbirth, dying earlier, because listen, I don’t know about you, Megan, but like there are, I’m okay so I’m 46 and I would say once I hit like 40, everybody like all my friends, like, started being on, like, Lipitor and I mean Black folks– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Lipitor, like medication for high blood pressure, medication for high cholesterol. Some of it is familial, but some of it is just the stress of being Black in this country. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Like. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: For sure. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah, like I remember in 2020 when when George Floyd occurred and there was– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yup. 


Dr. Imani Walker: There was all this stuff going on. Like, I literally be– I remember being like, I can’t work right now. Like, there’s too much going on and I can’t. I mean, Covid is one thing. But, you know, once we started dealing with like just, you know, seeing a cop kill George Floyd in real time, I was like, okay, you know what? As a Black person, like, this is my time out, like. And I think we collectively– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: I think we definitely collectively–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Did that. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –Did that. Yeah. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: But, you know, I mean, as just as a people, we haven’t you want to if you want to go all the way back, if you take it to slavery in this country, when when were Black people allowed to grieve? 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah. Never. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: You know, if you’re a woman and your your husband is sold to somebody else, your children are sold, you got to go to work. You don’t get a day off, you know what I’m saying? 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: So that’s like almost ingrained in our DNA where it’s like, oh, you don’t get to process what happened to you. You just got to keep going. And I think we look at the processing and taking a moment of like, No, I need this time, is almost like a weakness, but it’s like we need that. We’re human. It doesn’t matter that we’re Black, we’re human, which means we have emotions, which means we need the space to grieve. We need the space to get better. You know?


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. And you know, if for any of you guys out there who may be experiencing grief like I’ll just say really quickly, that when it comes to my my mental health, like the issues that I’ve had with my mental health, yes, I felt sad, but a lot of it has been physical. A lot of it has been fatigue, um muscle aches– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Joint pain, having headaches, being dizzy. And some people do experience these same types, like those same types of symptoms when they are grieving. So in the past few years, there actually has been um a push and it has been recognized as prolonged grief disorder. And this is a medical condition where grief symptoms last longer than 12 months. So grief and depression can look very similar. I would say that as a as a mental health professional. You would pretty much treat them the same. Um. Some people, you know, they what they’re they’re let’s say that their precipitating factor the the factor that actually led them to to start experiencing um prolonged grief, which can, like I said, really looks very similar to depression, may have been the death of a loved one. You know, sometimes it can be other things, but but prolonged grief is for 12 months and you do treat them the same. Which is why with our listener letter, I was saying to Jordan, like, you know, even if he broke up with you, like tell your boyfriend, tell your ex-boyfriend to go get help because um it’s really important and it can drastically make a difference. I’m telling you, I’m just like–. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: If if you are, if, if, if any, you guys listening out here doesn’t hear anything else come out of my mouth on this episode as somebody who was really averse to medication, I’m just saying, like, for me, it made the difference between night and day. Like, I am just like a different person. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Girl, you got me wanting to be like, can somebody just prescribe me something just in case, like [laughter] and which is completely how opposite of how I used to be. Now I’m just like, is there anything wrong with me? Give me something. You know.


Dr. Imani Walker: Right? Yeah. No, for real. No, absolutely. I um yeah, I can’t. I can’t say enough about actually like getting the mental health help that I needed. So, you know, I, I hope that for anybody listening out there that, well, you know, us discussing grief and us discussing depression and how they can overlap, but more importantly, grief and how we as Black folks definitely have a tendency to hold on to our grief for longer. It’s just very important that we collectively like I definitely would say that we as Black folks, we have really taken the reins on educating ourselves about like, Oh, I can go get help. Oh, I can go talk to somebody. Oh, I can, you know, maybe take some– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: For sure. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –Medication. But–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –I think that when it comes to grief, you know, when it comes to COVID, like, yes, this is one extra thing that we do have to deal with in addition to just being Black every day. But one of the reasons why I wanted to become a psychiatrist is because I was like, yo, like, if Black folks, if we can collectively get our mental health together, like– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yes. 


Dr. Imani Walker: We could all vibrate at like a higher frequency and be like Vision out in here. Like we can have our mock necks out here flying through space like just I mean–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yes. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –just out here. Just vibrating at our like ancestral frequencies. Listen. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yes, ma’am. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Listen. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yes, ma’am. 


Dr. Imani Walker: So everybody go, go, get go get the help that you need. Please, please, please. And hey, you know, I know that we have listener letters if anybody wants to, you know, write in and let us know, like, you know, your before and afters or even like your in progresses like, let us know. That would be awesome. That’d be so awesome. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yes, please let us know. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah, please let us know. [music break] That was such a great discussion, like for real. But let’s move on to our favorite segment, pop culture diagnosis from this year. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Woo hoo! I’m going to say, it’s Wakanda forever. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Okay, you guys, let’s get right into our pop culture diagnosis for this week in honor of the New Black Panther hitting theaters. I wanted us to pick somebody from the first Black Panther movie to diagnose today as we all get excited about Black Panther two, rest in peace Chadwick Boseman. Always, forever and ever. So, Meg, I don’t know a person who is not familiar with Black Panther, but just in case someone has been living under a rock and a boulder and the entire Grand Canyon. Can you please tell us about the popular Black Panther movie and who we are diagnosing today? 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yes, ma’am. Wakanda forever now. Um. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yes. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: In in the first Black Panther, what happens is you have the main character, T’Challa, which is played by Chadwick Boseman, rest in peace. Um. So after the death of his father in that movie, T’Challa goes back to the African nation of Wakanda, um and he takes his rightful place as king. Now there is a you know, when a powerful enemy appears, this tests T’Challa, as a king and as Black Panther, and then he’s drawn into a conflict that puts the fate of Wakanda and the entire world at risk. So we’re going to diagnose T’challa’s cousin and the villain of the movie, Erik Stevens, better known as Killmonger, who is played by Michael B. Jordan. Fine, fine, fine, fine. His smile. I mean, goodness. That man’s smile. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Okay, I’m going to just say this because you just said that he that he was fine, fine, fine. I don’t really see it. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: It’s funny. It’s only when he smiles. When he smiles, I be like, okay, I get it. 


Dr. Imani Walker: I don’t now. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: I get it, girl. Look at the smile. 


Dr. Imani Walker: He got a nice body. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Look at the smile. He does, Google his smile, girl. Just google it real quick.


Dr. Imani Walker: He got a nice body. But I’m like, I’m like he alright like in the face. I mean, like first of all– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: I I feel you.


Dr. Imani Walker: Michael. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: I feel you. 


Dr. Imani Walker: He not coming to my house, so it don’t matter, but I’m like, you, all right? Like, I mean, I kind of felt like I guess maybe I never saw Creed. So I think a lot of people were, like, in love with him. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Oh. Yeah.


Dr. Imani Walker: Like from Creed. And I was like. I was like, he okay. Like, um– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: I do think that was probably his sexiest role. Hmm. We’ll say that.


Dr. Imani Walker: Creed? 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Mm hmm. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Okay. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: For sure. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah. I never– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: You should look at it. 


Dr. Imani Walker: I don’t know. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Like. It might change your– 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah no I should 


Meg Scoop Thomas: –change your view. 


Dr. Imani Walker: I don’t know. You don’t. Like, I had to think the other because the other day, Peter was like, Well, who do you have a crush on? Like, who would you have a crush on? And I was like, honestly, like, I was like, I don’t know. And he was like. Oh. You lying. You lying. I was like, No, I really like it took me days. Like, he’s asked me this before and it usually takes me days to come up with somebody, and I’m like, I have somebody. I have somebody. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Who’s your, who is it? Who is it?


Dr. Imani Walker: Um uh. His name is Yahya Abdul-Mateen the second– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Oh. Yeah.


Dr. Imani Walker: He was um, he he was uh Candyman and he was Doctor Manhattan. I really– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yes. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –Didn’t like I knew of him, but then when he was Dr. Manhattan, I was like, Oh my God, I love Doctor Manhattan. And he played Dr. Manhattan.


Meg Scoop Thomas: Why? Because you saw his, you saw him naked in that? And uh what, what was the name of that? Watchmen. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Um. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: You saw him naked in Watchmen? 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: That’s why? 


Dr. Imani Walker: I I yeah. I mean, we all saw him naked in Watchmen if you watched the whole series. But but I mean– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: So then that’s why you liked him huh?  


Dr. Imani Walker: Well, also, because like during the series, like in Watchmen, like he. I didn’t understand. I was like, this man is so docile. Like, what is wrong with him? And then when the series ended, like, and it all made sense, I was like, Oh, I was like, you acting for real for real. Like, okay. I was alright but no I was like, I would and also, you know why? Because he was also in Black Mirror. He was in this Black Mirror episode with um–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –Anthony Mackie, and they– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –Ended up like falling in love in a video game. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: And I think seeing him in that role, too, I was like, Oh, he’s so sweet. So it took me days and I was like, okay, I have a crush. I have one. Because it took me forever. But no, I don’t honestly, I don’t really be looking at people penises like that. I mean. I’m like okay–[laughter]


Meg Scoop Thomas: I’m mean you couldn’t miss it in Watchmen. I was I was like, oh, well this is a nice surprise. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Honestly. I more so was like, who had to airbrush his penis, though? [laughter]


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Like Oh my god. I was like [?] 


Meg Scoop Thomas: I don’t know. I can’t be I don’t know how to like–


Dr. Imani Walker: Right like here you go– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: –be professional like that. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Like [making buzzing sound] 


Meg Scoop Thomas: This whole time like– 


Dr. Imani Walker: Right. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yes. Lift the sack, please. [buzzing sound]


Dr. Imani Walker: Oh, my God. Okay. So, anyway. Anyway, before we went on a crazy tangent. Michael B Jordan okay is Erik Stevens. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah that’s his–


Dr. Imani Walker: Erik Stevens, right? 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Mm hmm. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Because everybody be like, oh yeah, Erik Killmonger. I’m like, I don’t think that’s his name. Okay. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: No. 


Dr. Imani Walker: So I loved the first Black Panther for so many reasons. I love Black. I love I just saw the the Wakanda forever. And I loved watching that movie– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: I haven’t seen it, don’t tell me. Don’t tell me. Don’t tell me what happens.


Dr. Imani Walker: I’m not. I’m not. I’m not. I’m not going to tell you what happened. But, okay, this this was funny. So we, me, Peter and Idris. My son went to go see it in the theaters on um this past Friday. So we left and we came home. And, you know, like when you first saw it, when you saw the first Black Panther, like, you know, it was just so many Black people. Like–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: I was just like, Oh, my God, oh, my God. So we came home and Peter was like, Yo, like what you, you know, like, let’s watch a movie. And I was like, okay. So he turns on this movie, and I was like. I was like, ugh, I was like turn this off I was like something something’s wrong. Something wrong with this movie. Girl. It was because it had it was all the a bunch of white people was in a movie. And I was in Wakanda for like 3 hours. So when we got home- 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right. 


Dr. Imani Walker: I was like, Ugh, ugh ugh. I was like, Get this out of here. I was like, I don’t want to see this. So we kept choosing movies, and I was like, you know what? Uh uh. Uh uh. No. I’m like, let’s just just turn off the TV. I’d rather watch a black screen because I can’t I’m like, I can’t deal with these white people problems. Like, I don’t care right now. I want to be up in my Black universe. So– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Anyway, back to Wakanda. Back to Black Panther. Okay, so the story of um Erik Stevens, a.k.a. Killmonger, was was such an interesting one. And it– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –Was so obvious that this was a Black movie because Erik is so, like it was so indicative. Like he like he was. He’s a villain. But we all as Black people, like Black Americans, like we felt that shit like– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right, right. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Like, damn. Like, yeah, we were like, we feel abandoned. And I understood his anger and his rage and his pain, especially if you got to go back and meet your African cousins. They up in here with spaceships and shit. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right. 


Dr. Imani Walker: And they got vibranium and they out here and it’s all beautiful and you like and you left me in in ghetto ass Oakland for real? 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right. Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Okay. And my dad is dead. Like, this is bullshit. So I understood. Like, this is somebody who or a character who obviously has abandonment issues. So I completely understand that. Um. His rage is understandable. Um. I don’t think that it was really. You know, focused properly. Um. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Correct. 


Dr. Imani Walker: I think, you know, like he he became Black Panther. Then he gonna kill all the heart shaped herbs. And now can’t nobody be Black Panther no more. And his rage is got so petty to the point of, like, it just wasn’t it wasn’t feasible, you know, like he’s– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right. 


Dr. Imani Walker: You can’t you can’t survive that long on being that angry um and being that petty and just being that vindictive. So, um I mean, this was somebody who obviously had a lot of anger issues, um definitely depression. We saw like how upset he was when he was reunited with his dad um in the afterlife. Um. Shout out to Sterling K. Williams [correction Brown], who’s an amazing actor who played his dad. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Um. In um in a Black Panther in the first one. But um yeah, I mean, I would say that Erik has depression and he also has some anger issues. And there it’s understandable, but pathologically, like, he really needed to significantly calm down. And I guess he did calm down when T’Challa put him down. So here we– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Here we all are. [laughing] So um. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Right. Right uh.


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah. Like, mmm okay, so yeah. That’s, that’s what I would say. Um. And I’m not a this is not a spoiler. But he does make a small cameo in the new movie. That’s all I’m going to say. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Okay. 


Dr. Imani Walker: I’m not gonna say anything else, I’m not gonna say any–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Please don’t.


Dr. Imani Walker: –thing. I’m not. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: But after this week, if I still haven’t seen it, then I understand if you want to spoil it, because I feel like people, after a week. 


Dr. Imani Walker: No, I’m not going to– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: If you haven’t seen something.


Dr. Imani Walker: I’m not going to spoil it. Yeah, no, I’m not going to–


Meg Scoop Thomas: You deserve for it to be spoiled. 


Dr. Imani Walker: I’m not going to spoil it. The only thing I will say is that and this is like, you’ll forget this and this won’t even make sense to you when you see it. But the theme of ashyness is a central theme to the new Black Panther. [laughter] It is, I swear to God. I swear it’s a major theme. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: The theme of Ashyness. [laugh] Okay. Yeah– 


Dr. Imani Walker: It is. It is. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Okay, Alright. 


Dr. Imani Walker: And that’s why I was like, Oooh, this a Black ass movie. I was like my goodness, that’s why I’m telling you. We got home. I was like, why all these white people on my screen? Ugh, I was like, get them out of here. So anyway, um but yeah, ashyness is real. And ashyness — 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yeah. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –Can make you angry and you’ll see when you when you see– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yes. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –Wakanda forever. So so anyways–


Meg Scoop Thomas: Not that I looked down at my hand, as you said that, and I was like, Ooh, a couple of crevices. Need a little work. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Because let me tell you, I I’m lotion I’m I’m moisturized inside and out. I’m I’m lotioned up. My son does not like lotion. He never has even when he was a baby, like it was a struggle. Peter, don’t use lotion. I’m like who are all these ashy– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: I think that’s a man thing. I don’t think men just, I feel like they feel like it’s too much work to try to lather up and, like, get moisturized. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Yeah. Peter’s, like, I don’t understand, like, why I got to put lotion on. I’m like, because yo legs is a different color than your face. And it’s not because– 


Meg Scoop Thomas: [laugh] I don’t understand why. 


Dr. Imani Walker: –you haven’t been tanning, it’s because your legs is ashy is hell. So like, sometimes I be writing words and he be like, get off me! And I’m like, Well, that’s why I wrote a whole sentence on your legs so. Go put on some lotion. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: You need some lotion, there you go. 


Dr. Imani Walker: You need some lotion. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: There you go. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Sometimes I be writing help. Help.


Meg Scoop Thomas: You know what? Oh, my Gosh. Poor Peter. 


Dr. Imani Walker: I do. I do.


Meg Scoop Thomas: I feel so bad for Peter. Run Peter. 


Dr. Imani Walker: I mean. Don’t. Don’t. Don’t. Because I plus, I get the good kind of lotion I get Kiehl’s too, because I have eczema, and that shit work. So I’m like, you got this expensive ass lotion in the house, and you don’t want to use it. I’m like, you got problems. So–


Meg Scoop Thomas: You just like being ashy. Okay.


Dr. Imani Walker: Anyway, when when we were okay, when we was watching Black Panther. I was like, See, that’s you. That’s you right there. That’s why you mad all the time. Because you ashy all the time. 


Dr. Imani Walker: Well, that’s all the time we have for today. Thank you, everybody, for going down memory lane with us. Have a safe and happy New Year. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yes. 


Dr. Imani Walker: And again. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Yes. 


Dr. Imani Walker: This is our last episode with Crooked Media, on the Crooked Media network. We will make sure to share our updates on what’s next on our social media pages. So be sure to follow us on Twitter at @doctor_Imani and @MegScoop on Instagram. Thanks for listening to Imani State of Mind. Thanks as always to Meg for co-hosting and we will be back with all new episodes in the New Year. 


Meg Scoop Thomas: Happy 2023! [music break] 


Dr. Imani Walker: This is a Crooked Media production. Our executive producer is Sandy Girard. Our producer is Leslie Martin. Music from Vasilis Fotopoulos, edited by Evan Sutton, and special thanks to Brandon Williams, Gabi Leverette, Mellani Johnson and Matt DeGroot for promotional support.