In This Episode
Soaring death rates at Maricopa County Jail, Trump attends the National Association of Black Journalists Conference, Bloomberg donates record funding to HBCU medical schools, NYC restores budget to public libraries.
News
‘Dying in the dark’: Investigation finds ‘astronomical’ death rate in Maricopa County jails
You Did It, NYC! Library Budgets Have Been Saved
Opinion At NABJ, Trump was both a missile and a mirror
Bloomberg gives record $600 million to HBCU medical schools
Sylvester: The Disco Diva You Didn’t Know You Knew
Follow at @PodSaveThePeople on Instagram.
TRANSCRIPT
[AD BREAK]
DeRay Mckesson: Hey, this is DeRay. And welcome to Pod Save the People. In this episode, it’s me, Kaya, De’Ara, and Myles talking about the election and the rest of the news that you don’t know. Uh. Also, this Friday, August 9th, is ten years since the protests in Ferguson. I cannot believe that it’s been ten years, but let’s do intros. I’m DeRay at @Deray on Twitter.
Myles E. Johnson: I’m Myles at @pharaohrapture on Instagram.
Kaya Henderson: I’m Kaya at @HendersonKaya on Twitter.
De’Ara Balenger: And I’m De’Ara Balenger at @dearabalenger on Instagram.
DeRay Mckesson: So let’s talk about the election. And it was just announced this morning right before we pressed record that Governor Walz of Minnesota is Kamala Harris’s VP pick. What’s on your mind? What you think?
Kaya Henderson: De’Ara I’m sure you’ve got something to say about this. Minnesota.
De’Ara Balenger: Listen.
Kaya Henderson: Minnesota.
De’Ara Balenger: I haven’t I have not done adequate research on this man. However, being having been a person born in Minneapolis, Minnesota, and having most of my childhood traumas take place in the state. And every chance I get, I say, if I ever become a billionaire, I’m getting all the Black people out of Minnesota. So that’s that’s the framework from which I’m coming into the conversation. But I haven’t looked at what this man has done. In in in in my, my home state to my birth state. It’s giving me Tim Kaine vibes as well. Just from the excite the non excitement factor. So I don’t want to I don’t want to say too much other than womp. But more to come.
Myles E. Johnson: You think womp? I didn’t I didn’t think womp.
DeRay Mckesson: I didn’t think womp at all.
Myles E. Johnson: I was kind of I was really nervous about if she picked Shapiro. I thought that was going to be maybe the deflation of a lot of uh stuff. Uh. I think Shapiro came with a lot of political baggage. And when I was researching more and hearing more about him, it got me more and more scared about her picking Shapiro. So I think it’s actually a good thing, because I think that she has enough charisma and excitement and she’s Black and South, and South Asian, and she’s young and she’s and she got Megan the stallion on her. I think she has enough of all of that. And I think the vice president pick can be somebody who’s a little womp womp.
Kaya Henderson: So he’s 60. He’s a former U.S. Army National Guard member, which will appeal to our military friends. He’s a former teacher, which appeals to me. Woop woop. [clap] Um. And he he is the one who started calling Trump and Vance weird. And that thing has gone viral. He’s a former member of Congress from a Republican leaning district. He’s he appeals to rural white voters, although he has also championed progressive policies as a governor, such as free school meals and expanded paid work or leave. While Minnesota is a solidly Democratic state, it’s close to Wisconsin and Michigan, two crucial battlegrounds. So that’s just a quick and dirty.
De’Ara Balenger: Mm hmm. And it looks like he’s also enshrined abortion rights into state law in Minnesota.
Kaya Henderson: Woop woop.
DeRay Mckesson: What I like about the thing I love about him is that he can talk to aunts and uncles. He sounds like a real person. He doesn’t sound like a robot reading from a teleprompter. I don’t know if you saw the video of him with his daughter at the fair.
Kaya Henderson: Oh, did not.
DeRay Mckesson: But his daughter, like, made him go on they made, like, a deal and he she got to choose, like the next ride. So he’s, like, on the slingshot and he just, he just is like, is like a real person who also is a progressive governor who has been pushed on issues. Like there was a conversation, one of his older daughters pushed him on one of the policy issues. And they were like, he just listens. I’m like, I like it. I talked to my friends in Minnesota last night being like, do we like him? Or is this like national hype? You know, like you might not. And they were like, no, we like him. And you’re like, you know, I actually love that. It’s reported that he is one of the first non sitting members of Congress to be nominated as VP in a very long time, because he’s–
Kaya Henderson: Oh nice.
DeRay Mckesson: –actually a governor now. He’s not. He’s no longer in Congress. Uh. And it gives me the sense that Kamala will actually be set up to govern differently than like if this is about running the government, it’s cool to have two people who, like, ran the government. She was the AG in the biggest state we got. He was the governor in middle America. I mean, it’s like, I’m excited to see where [?]–
Kaya Henderson: [?].
DeRay Mckesson: –[?] because this is a critique of Obama is that Obama comes in, but had never led anything before. So he had to learn how to be an executive over those eight years because he’d only been a legislator. It’s like Kamala and Walz. They’ve been leading the government their whole career, this stint in the legislative body, this is a small part of a much longer career as executives. So I’m actually really pumped about it. Um. Somebody said from, you know, because he did do the weirdo thing, Kaya, somebody tweeted this morning, from the weirdos to the Walz. [indistinct banter] [laughter]
Kaya Henderson: Oh, I love it.
Myles E. Johnson: Do you all think that this pick will I know, like, places like Pennsylvania are like a big deal right now when it comes to um, when it comes to the election, do you think this pick will sway those kind of like, swing states in a in a significant way, or is it too early to to decide?
De’Ara Balenger: I think that’s why Kaya I wanted to think about this, because again I’m very much on, Kaya, you’ve been missing my sister soldier approach to politics these days. Which is like, I’m still. I’m so tired of us like making all our decisions based off this, like, elusive middle America white voter. And so I I want to think of the like, as I read more and more on Walz and what he’s done when it comes to reproductive rights. I think it makes sense, given all that Kamala has done. She’s done quite a bit as a as as a sitting VP. She had a reproductive justice tour. Um. It’s an issue that she’s really been focused on. I think the repro community is super excited about her because she actually says the word abortion, unlike Joe Biden. And so I think perhaps this pick also plays into I’m going after, you know, I’m going after women. I want this is a key issue for women. It’s a key issue for young voters. And so this pick. This pick is building off of sort of building coalition around that key issue. So that’s how I want to think about it. That may not be true, but that’s how I’m making up in my mind so that I’m not like, yes, we’re picked this. We picked this VP because we want to make sure all the farmers across America, farmers are important, especially Black farmers, are going to vote for Kamala Harris.
Kaya Henderson: I I hear you. I think that that is right, and I am I’m excited. I’ve been gone. I missed you all so much. Um. But I, I am newly excited in ways that I did not think that I could be because we’re not following these silly rules anymore. We are just going for the win. And I feel like, you know, one of the things about the VP is nobody’s VP pick ever, like catapulted them to the White House. Right? Like it is it is like I don’t I don’t I don’t know necessarily Myles that this is going to guarantee swing states or whatever, whatever. What I do know is it’s another effective spokesperson for this administration. And I feel like we have to stop this whole thing about like the one person administrations are broad and there are lots of amazing people. And as DeRay said, this dude is normal. Like he’s, you know, he’s in ads with his daughters. He is and like, I think the vast majority of America is pretty normal of all colors, of all stripes. And so I think we need a return to like regular people leading government, not whoever else these other people are. Um. So I’m inspired. I’m excited.
DeRay Mckesson: The last thing I’ll say, too is I think, Kaya, to that point, I think people are also tired. Like, I think one of the things that Trump did is he exhausted people. Like there was a there was this fascination with him where you could it was like a the train wreck. You couldn’t look away and you were like, what, what and then it the protests and Trump. I think people are like people want normal. They want normal everything. They want–
Kaya Henderson: Yes.
DeRay Mckesson: You know, like those memes that are like, I don’t want to live in unprecedented times anymore. It’s like, give us people who just want to run the government. They don’t want to be reality TV stars. They don’t want to be famous. They just want to, like, make sure I got health insurance and food. I think the other thing that I love about this is that for so long, the Democratic Party and we’ve complained about it is run by a set of consultants and people who just have been in power for a really long time. These teams of people who have directed and what I love about this pick and Kamala, is that it doesn’t seem like she’s beholden to all of those same people, because there were there was a big contingent of the Democratic Party who was fans of Shapiro, who did want him, who so I love this idea that, like, she can do her own thing. And that’s what was cool about Obama in those early days, you know, there are critiques about what he left behind. But there is just like, you know, you get these people who have worked in the government for 8000 years, they pay the same consultants, get the same people da da da da da da da. And Kamala ain’t got that. That’s not the that’s not the world she came up–
Myles E. Johnson: Yeah.
DeRay Mckesson: –in, in politics. So I’m excited about that.
De’Ara Balenger: But guys she does. There was a big story over the weekend, David Plouffe, no, what are their names? Plouffe, Axelrod, Stephanie Cutter all the same consultant type folks, particularly folks who I think this is what I think they’re thinking. You know what we really helped that Black man do? Get elected. And us white people, he wouldn’t have been get able to get elected without us. And so now this slew of white consultants has now jumped onto this campaign. And I’m just very, very nervous in this 90 something days we have left, like, what is this going to look like and what and and DeRay to your point, how does Kamala and I and I think she will how does she continue to say, this is what I think this is the direction I think we should take. As opposed to getting, because this is the problem with Joe Biden, right? He had those close close that that those circle of advisors and didn’t get the truth until you know what? Three weekends ago?
Kaya Henderson: Okay, so–
DeRay Mckesson: Also, Pelosi’s press tour has been amazing. She’s like, I did not call anybody. They’re like does does Biden still talk to you? She’s like, I’ve always loved Biden. I’m like, Pelosi got the points. Kaya. Sorry. What’d you say?
Kaya Henderson: So to De’Ara’s point right? I actually think I’m I’m going to draw a little bit of my experience, um of being a number two and then moving into a number one role and like people were like, is Kaya going to do the same thing as Michelle did and blah, blah, blah, and all of this jazz? The answer was clearly no. But nobody knew that at the time, right? And what I was able to do is see what things worked. So if those people got Obama elected, that is the task right now, right? So let’s get me elected. And I do like there is nothing in me that thinks that a group of these white consultants is going to run Kamala Harris. So she might be making strategic decisions to do the job. Right? And if those people won the election last time, well, then lets win this election.
De’Ara Balenger: But they didn’t. I just I want to get out of this Kaya.
Kaya Henderson: Okay.
De’Ara Balenger: Because I feel like there are people that I’ve worked with, particularly members of digital teams that are still out there today that think that they got Barack Obama elected.
Kaya Henderson: Well, listen.
De’Ara Balenger: Black people well–
Kaya Henderson: Of course they didn’t.
De’Ara Balenger: And I think–
Kaya Henderson: Of course they didn’t.
De’Ara Balenger: But I just like that narrative like that is what these and as a consultant myself, I never go into a room and say, hey, do you know that a lot of the successes that the Obama administration had, it was because I was there like, that’s–
Kaya Henderson: Well, right.
De’Ara Balenger: –crazy.
Kaya Henderson: Absolutely. But those people are campaign strategist and they help organize stuff and blah, blah, blah. And she is resonating with voters. She’s out in the thing doing the so like all of it, we need it all. And I just I mean, I have been so heartened by how she is showing up as her own person. And I think that that’s what we need. We need somebody to break the mold. She is breaking the mold. Um. And I, I think she’s smart and strategic about who she employs to get the and I don’t mean employ, I mean uses. I don’t mean employs like pays. I mean who she uses to get what she needs done done. And I want to I want to lift up Black woman strategy, because I think lots of times we know exactly what we’re doing and people can’t put it all together. And that’s by design. You don’t have to know what I’m doing. Just watch me do my thing. [laughter] Boom.
DeRay Mckesson: I will say uh the last thing, just to like highlight–
De’Ara Balenger: Yes.
DeRay Mckesson: Is that because Governor Walz will now be the VP nominee, he will be leaving the governor’s office, and it will, we will usher in Peggy Flanagan, who will be the first Indigenous woman governor [shriek] in American history.
Myles E. Johnson: Oh, wow.
DeRay Mckesson: So shout out to [?].
Kaya Henderson: Look at that.
De’Ara Balenger: Now we’re talking. Now we’re talking.
Kaya Henderson: Look at that.
DeRay Mckesson: We get to see Peggy be a rock star governor in a progressive place. And shout out to Governor Walz, soon to be VP Walz. Kaya and Myles–
Kaya Henderson: Nice.
DeRay Mckesson: You wanna say something to close this out?
Myles E. Johnson: Yeah, I did want to say something towards what you all were discussing earlier. Um. I do think that the fact that Kamala has gotten so much uh, just groundswell of support and has done so much without these consultants like before this announcement says something too and gives her power too. So I, I hear you um De’Ara with um with your concerns and I mean, I never underestimate the power of, like, white delusion and entit– and entitlement. Um. But I do think there’s something to Kamala getting to this point of influence and power and and energy in the nation without those consultants. So I feel like certain, uh lies and trickeries can’t even happen. Because look what I did before before we decided on you all. So.
DeRay Mckesson: I want to talk about Sonia Massey. Uh. Let me read this to you. This just came out today, and I will read it to you straight up with no um, none of my own interpretation, because I’m interested in what you have to say. Uh. It was just released. So the deputy sheriff who fatally shot Sonia Massey in her Illinois home last month, said he believed that when she said when she called 911 for help unexpectedly and said, I rebuke you in the name of Jesus that she intended to harm him, according to the deputy’s field report released Monday, as in yesterday. Quote, “I interpreted this to mean she was going to kill me,” Grayson wrote, adding that when he drew his pistol and Massey ducked behind a counter that separated them, he moved around the obstacle, fearing that she was going to grab a weapon. [laughter]
Kaya Henderson: Oh, my soul.
DeRay Mckesson: What?
Kaya Henderson: First of all, I mean, there are so many things that are wrong with that. Who says when have you ever said I interpreted that to mean? Please, your lawyer coached to to say that because interpret has some legal meaning I’m sure De’Ara.
De’Ara Balenger: Mm hmm.
Kaya Henderson: But uh, but first of all, you ain’t never been to church before, heathen. You don’t know what rebuke means. Um. And she ran around the counter to hide from you, and you ran around the counter to shoot her and there’s only one person who intended to kill somebody, and that was you.
Myles E. Johnson: Yeah, that all sounds like uh malarkey to me. Like, I think that’s just what you have to say once you do an execution of a Black woman in her own home. Uh. So you you’re going to manipulate the whole situation to make it sound like you were in fear. My big thing with that comment, too, is why are the why are police so cowardly like and why are you reaching for your uh gun first? There’s so many weapons. Uh. Tasers and and pepper sprays. And why are you so cowardly? That’s why if you’re going to be a police officer, that’s why you’re a police officer. For those high temp situations like that, for you to be able to de-escalate it and do things that the normal, average human being couldn’t do, because you are here to protect and serve the people even when they are out of their um, you know, even when they’re having a, a mental health episode. So, I feel like I think I’m hearing like Toni Morrison. Like, I think she said something about that, about, like, a critique of the police, about she’s astonished about how cowardly the police are, how everybody’s talking about when it came to Mike Brown, how a lot of these, um Tamir Rice, a lot of the language around these people that the police have executed is about how scared they were. And if you’re a police officer and you get that scared by one singular Black person, you shouldn’t be a police officer. You need to go and, you know, find the wiz and get some and get some courage with the cowardly lion before you [laugh] try to get a badge, if that’s the case.
De’Ara Balenger: I mean, I think what’s so what’s so wild about because I did. I watched it. I don’t know why. And I think what was so wild to me was just like sort of the lack of urgency after he killed her. It was kind of just like whatever. Which I think is another layer of just like how horrific this is. And the other officer was like, well, we should get help. And he’s like, nah. You know what I mean? It’s like that. It’s like even in our most even even in death, the, the, the the care and the thoughtfulness isn’t it’s just. I can’t. It’s like it’s you [?] look why would we be able to wrap our minds around it? Because it’s so inhuman. But I think that’s what continually stands out to me about it.
DeRay Mckesson: Um. Switching gears a little to another big thing in the news is the Olympics. As you all know, you probably saw Simone Biles be that girl and hold it down for the United States time after time. Jordan Chiles as well. And I was up there rooting for Rebeca from Brazil as well.
Kaya Henderson: Yes! Yes! [clapping]
DeRay Mckesson: I’m like Rebeca I want you to win. I want all the girls to win.
Kaya Henderson: Yes.
DeRay Mckesson: And you probably saw Noah Lyles’ photo finish.
Kaya Henderson: Mm hmm.
DeRay Mckesson: Uh. And Shericka and um Sha’Carri and um so many other women had injuries right before uh the trials, but Sha’carri still did well, Sha’carri still did well. But what did y’all what are y’all watching? Um. Three on three basketball was a joke. I don’t know what the what happened with three, we need to send some, there were basketball players for three on three. That was rough. What are y’all watching?
De’Ara Balenger: No one steal this idea. But for the next Olympics, I’m going to design an app that can let Black people know when the Black people are doing their thing on the Olympics. Because I, we had in this house the Olympics on all weekend. All we saw was swimming, fencing, whitewater rafting or kayak. I don’t know what that was. [laughter] Um. Badminton. So I don’t know what BET Olympic channel y’all are watching, I didn’t, I didn’t see anything. [laughter]
Myles E. Johnson: BET Olympic channel is crazy. [laughter]
Kaya Henderson: That no, that’s not that’s smart, is what it is. [indistinct banter]
DeRay Mckesson: Snoop Dogg [?] $500,000 a day to be at the Olympics is really something.
De’Ara Balenger: Well, I–
Kaya Henderson: Listen.
De’Ara Balenger: –should have been watching his Instagram. That’s what I should have–
Kaya Henderson: Snoop–
De’Ara Balenger: Done.
Kaya Henderson: Snoop and Flav are like the heroes of this Olympic, which I find to be absolutely hilarious. I we’ve been watching we’ve watched lots of gymnastics, swimming, lots of track and field, like lots of track and field. Shout out to the Whitaker girls. My colleagues, two kids, two girls, little sisters from from Maryland are in the thing. But I’ve I’ve been wat– the men’s the men’s 100. Shout out to Rai Benjamin from Mount Vernon, who’s running the hurdles like there are so many Black people that like, we know or know somebody who knows and I don’t know, I’m on BET Olympics because we’ve been watching Black, Black and all Black. In fact, the Auntie thread is on like hype because people will be like, oh, so-and-so is running right now, or so-and-so is, and then you just turn on your TV, um or turn to the whatever. So it’s been astounding to see. I mean, for me, like one of the of course, Simone. Simone Simone Simone Simone. Jordan, Suni like all of those girls, the oldest Olympics gymnastic team, the most diverse like all of that for sure. But maybe the like peak moment for me is seeing Jordan and Simone bow to Rebeca Andrade from Brazil. And when they asked Simone why they did that, she said it was the first all Black podium, number one. She’s like and like she’s the queen. She had the best floor routine. And it just I mean, you know, we talk about women’s leadership being different from men’s leadership. And and I think Black women’s leadership is very different from other people’s leadership. You know, lighting somebody else’s candle doesn’t dim yours. Shining somebody else’s crown doesn’t tarnish yours. And that is the lesson, I think these girls are giving us lessons in leadership, in class, in grace, in cooperation, in sportsmanship. All of these things that, like, are the antidote to, you know, what has been ailing us over the last few months. And I am here for it all, y’all. And I’m not like an Olympics head like that. I have been more into this set of Olympics than, I don’t know you could shake a stick at. It is fantastic.
DeRay Mckesson: The fact, we know that you watching BET Olympics, because the fact that you called it the Oh lympics [laughter] is so Black, Kaya. She said I was watching the Oh lympics. [laughter]
Myles E. Johnson: Oh, oh Olympics.
Kaya Henderson: I’m a old Black lady.
Myles E. Johnson: Yes.
Kaya Henderson: What can I tell you?
Myles E. Johnson: Yes.
DeRay Mckesson: Oh lympics.
Myles E. Johnson: Yes.
DeRay Mckesson: Myles are you watching something?
Myles E. Johnson: Um. No. But [laughter]–
Kaya Henderson: Myles listen.
Myles E. Johnson: Not because [?]–
Kaya Henderson: You should you should watch this track and field honey because these fellas out here are all of the things.
DeRay Mckesson: Did you see the transphobic moment that happened?
Myles E. Johnson: So that’s so that’s exactly.
Kaya Henderson: Oh with the boxers.
Myles E. Johnson: I’m so I’m so glad that you’re gonna that you’re saying DeRay because that’s exactly what I was going to segue into. Even though I have not been watching the Olympics just because I’ve been moving and busy, not because I don’t care about Black people in sports and sweat. But I have encountered this um conversation around the boxer. So she’s from um Algeria, I believe. Uh. Her name is Khelif? Um. And I saw the conversation because um I mean, you know, to to put it plainly, she knocked somebody the hell out. And then everybody started having this conversation around her, um her being a trans woman. And then uh, I saw in these kind of uh uh, like, like, for instance, I saw on TS Madison and and um and Craig Stewart were speaking were just like having this, like, kind of pop cultural conversation that was really interesting and kind of deep to me around how even biological realities aren’t good indicators of gender, as shown in this position, because everybody was saying that this is a trans woman and this is unfair. And she’s like, I have all the parts that you say you need. I have the uterus, I have the I have the I have the stuff that makes you a woman. But obviously biological biology is more diverse than the gender binary. So you’re going to have moments where if somebody trains themselves to be an elite athlete, that’s going to show up differently than everybody else. The best way I can even compare it to is I don’t play sports, but I do compete sometimes when I go out and dress up and we in my community, we call it serving cunt. And I just– [laughing]
Kaya Henderson: [gasps] Can you say that on on the thing?
Myles E. Johnson: I don’t know bleep it. Um. It’s called it’s called serving the doll. Like whatever it is being dollish. I have soft skin, round face.
Kaya Henderson: Kaya’s face.
Myles E. Johnson: I’m curve I have soft skin, round face, I’m curvy. My waist goes in. That’s how my body is actually naturally shaped with no estrogen hormones and stuff, because our bodies and our biology aren’t just dictated by these two, uh these two gender binaries. And that’s how and that’s how I see this whole conversation, is that people have this warped view of what bodies are and what gender is, and you really use it to attack this woman. And the last thing I’ll say on that, too, is in putting this woman, this cis woman, y’alls team [laugh] in a very in a lot of danger because you ain’t that’s illegal where she’s from. So that kind of rumor could not just get her criminalized or killed or I mean, I mean, what else is it? That kind of rumor could get her criminalized and killed. So, yeah, it was fascinating.
Kaya Henderson: I thought that this was a tremendous teachable moment. Like, wildly, like, inappropriate for this to happen. But the woman, Simon Cartwright, [not correct it was Angela Carini] who originally posted she was the opponent and she posted, I guess, on her social media that um that Imane Khelif was trans or accused her of being trans. She can I just read you quickly her apology because I actually thought it was quite compelling, she says, I removde my post about Imane Khelif. I found out that she’s not trans. I thought she was someone born male fighting in a women’s league. She was truly, indeed born a woman, both with a vagina but born with a vagina and both X and Y chromosome. She has a condition known as differences of sex development. DSD is a rare set of rare conditions involving genes, hormones, and reproductive organs that can cause the sexual development of a person to be different than others, according to the National Health Service. Sometimes this can lead to a person having XY chromosomes but develop otherwise female. I also understand that because of this, it makes it impossible to test what gender she is by most sporting organizations to say what division she should be participated participating in. I was wrong and I apologize. To Imane they say that God doesn’t make any mistakes, so I guess he created you to carry a burden that most of us could not bear. I promise to do better research in the future before making a post about anyone. If I’ve offended anyone with this condition or anyone who loves you, loves someone with this condition to you, I humbly apologize. And so I thought this was a uh oh, DeRay says no. I thought this was a moment where people who are don’t know anything about this. Oh, Jesus. Okay, tell me, why am I wrong?
DeRay Mckesson: Kaya. I think that old girl hired a rockstar publicist. And baby that publicist earned every penny.
Kaya Henderson: Dollar.
DeRay Mckesson: That she got paid.
Kaya Henderson: Okay? Fair enough. Fair enough. Fair enough.
DeRay Mckesson: Because if you remember, do you do you remember what? How? Why she called her trans? She said, I’ve never been hit this hard in my life. It was she got hit [?]–
Myles E. Johnson: Welcome to the Olympics. [laughter]
DeRay Mckesson: And said I’ve never been hit this hard in my life. And you’re like, is that what made her trans? No girl, no. Absolutely not. You got beat up in a boxing competition at the Olympics and were floored. And because she knew that this issue had already been addressed before, the IOC said that she could play. She knew this.
Kaya Henderson: Yup.
DeRay Mckesson: What she had to release that statement because she got beat up in the press about it. And everybody was like, you are just rehashing some stuff that you know is not an issue because you lost, and that she has a history of doing this sort of these sort of antics. She got hit hard. And said, I’ve never been hit that hard. Good night. That’s crazy.
Kaya Henderson: Uncle.
DeRay Mckesson: It’s a box–
Kaya Henderson: I’m with you.
DeRay Mckesson: It’d be different if this was like a running–
Kaya Henderson: I’m with you.
DeRay Mckesson: –competition. This is boxing.
Myles E. Johnson: Yeah. I’m like, I’m I’m a I think about, like, Mike Tyson. I’m sure every man that Mike Tyson and specifically in that Mike Tyson’s heyday would say the same thing. That does not mean that Mike Tyson is mixed with, you know, Hercules. It just means that he’s a better athlete than you. And that’s what happens the more competitive it gets, you’re going to start competing against more elite, stronger athletes. That that’s just that’s so wild. I did want to connect though how what that woman did and the inflamatory comments that she did are reminiscent of what people would say about Serena Williams.
Kaya Henderson: Yes.
Myles E. Johnson: So when when we and when we think about those things so.
DeRay Mckesson: Preach.
Myles E. Johnson: The there’s a lot of transphobia that exists to be projected on cis women and and and to condition and police how cis women show up in sports, too. So this is just another reason why trans rights and and being anti-trans phobia is not just for the trans people in your lives or the trans community. It’s also so we could all be freer inside of our genders because and–
Kaya Henderson: Yes.
Myles E. Johnson: This is just proof, an example.
Kaya Henderson: Thank you, Myles and DeRay.
DeRay Mckesson: Hey, you’re listening to Pod Save the People. Stay tuned. There’s more to come.
[AD BREAK]
DeRay Mckesson: We’re going to go back to Trump, because if you or we’re going to go to Trump. We didn’t talk about Trump at all. We talked about Kamala. But back to the election is that the National Association of Black Journalists um invited Trump to talk. De’Ara.
De’Ara Balenger: [laughter] So, [clears throat] I couldn’t help myself. I had to watch the entire interview. And then there were some times where I was like, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. And then I actually had to rewind. There’s a streaming situation and then play it again. So just to give some context, because I also follow Karen Attiah I’m like a huge Karen Attiah fan. So if you all don’t know Karen Attiah, she’s like a columnist for The Washington Post. She’s like, bad to the bone. I’m obsessed with her. So the first kind of hint of it was when I saw she’d like, resigned from sort of like she was like on a committee or something, like a planning committee. And she resigned. And I’m probably getting these facts a little like Donald Trump. Like just–
DeRay Mckesson: She was co-chair.
De’Ara Balenger: –making making stuff up.
DeRay Mckesson: She was co-chair of the–
De’Ara Balenger: She was conference.
De’Ara Balenger: –conference.
De’Ara Balenger: Co-chair of the event co-chair. Okay. So she resigned in protest because she was like, why is this man coming? This is ridiculous. As my nephew Oliver has been saying all week, this is ridiculous. So I was like, oh I was like, so then it like just became a thing in my mind, right? So I’m like, and I’m like, why is Donald Trump? Why have they invited this man to speak um at the National Association of Black Journalists? Which is from and Karen wrote this really beautiful piece on it, of course, and and in it she just talks about how it is such a safe and sacred place for Black journalists and a place where people can obviously, you can come together with your little affinity group and sort of get your self restored. Um. And particularly as this group of journalists has such a big job to do in anticipation of this election. So he shows up. And off rip, [laugh] so wait look hold on. Because so Rachel Scott. So Rachel Scott who is with ABC. So she starts off with the first question. And Rachel is basically like, listen, you’ve done all these horrible things when it comes to Black people. You’ve said this. You said that. Why would Black people trust you? Um. And why like, why would Black voters trust you and then vote for you? He off the bat was so defensive and so rude and so harsh and said, oh you, where are you from? You must be from ABC, which is fake news. And also you all started late and it must be your fault. Now he’s saying this to a panelist, like basically accusing the panelist of the who is one of the moderators of, accusing her of being responsible for the, you know, sort of the tech issues, the the late start, etc., etc.. So it didn’t start well and it continues sort of with that sort of intensity. Um. And just a couple of specific things. He also said that, you know, Kamala Harris now is all of a sudden been Black, is Black. She was never Black before. She turned Black. He there was this discussion around police immunity that came up where because he said police are all he’s made this sort of general blanket statement that all police should have immunity. But when it came to Sonia Massey, he really wouldn’t say if he supported police immunity in that particular case. And then he talked about his accomplishments and how he saved HBCUs. And then the other thing that I found sort of most entertaining was him saying Black jobs in front of a room of Black people, which of course, the question was, what is a Black job? So just [sigh] I think I think ultimately, though, a good outcome of this, like I don’t I I I kind of I agree with Karen Attiah like, I think like if I were a member of the NBJ, he’s not somebody that I would want to have come, come speak or be in the vicinity of at all. But I think the good outcome here is if this if this has gotten out, like sort of into Black community is how he treated those Black women on stage. Because remember y’all, how he treated Omarosa. Have we forgotten? Okay.
Kaya Henderson: Or Yamiche Alcindor?
De’Ara Balenger: Oh. [slams hand] That part alone was so disturbing. And it’s also just like when you see him because we don’t we don’t we don’t see him in like a Black context, right? Like in a Black space with Black folks on stage. And he seems even wilder in that context. Like, you know, we’ve seen him in a rally and he’s like in Montana, like that all makes sense in my mind. Um. And I’m like, oh, he’s saying crazy things. But when he’s saying crazy things to our people in our space, it seems even more perplexing. And it’s like, what is this real life? So if you have a little time, just watch a little, a little bit of it because boy oh boy, does it feel like this is a wild place.
DeRay Mckesson: The really interesting thing about it is, you know, the reason why Trump was late to the stage was because he would not agree to be fact checked. That was a condition of him coming out, is that he said like you couldn’t fact check him. And he did just unravel like there was nothing good for him that came out of that and that he agreed to an hour. They pulled him after 30 minutes because as much as I I was even offended that they invited him, I thought it was a slap in the face [?] NABJ. The way NABJ handled the the the response to it was poor. All of it was bad. And those women came on that stage ready. They did not give him an inch. They asked real questions that any person running to be president should be able to answer. And I will say it was the first time because I didn’t. I forgot that I’ve only seen him on sympathetic media a la Fox, or places that don’t fact check him or ask hard questions. I forgot that we’ve never actually seen Donald Trump in any room where they ask a real question like I. I saw it happen and I was like, oh, he doesn’t even know. He doesn’t even have like the skill. Like, you know, for all of the talk about him being great, like a great talker and like, understanding people, I don’t think that’s not even true. He just has only been asked softball questions for so long that they just let it go. But he and they weren’t even asking him, like off the wall, like the Sonia Massey question was. That was something that you should be prepared for when you just said police immunity and he fell apart.
Myles E. Johnson: Right.
DeRay Mckesson: Um. That other thing I’ll say, because this just broke in the news, is that um, when Governor Walz got picked, the Trump team sent out an email with the headline, Walz Will Unleash Chaos. [laugh] Those people are really scrambling. Um. I think that’s great, but yeah.
Myles E. Johnson: I’m so disappointed. I’m like thinking about this as I’m watching Auntie Kaya’s background with children reading at their table. And I think the legacy for me, the legacy of Black people in journalism and Black people in like literary arts in general is so esteemed in my head. And when I think about Ida B. Wells and Toni Morrison and James Baldwin and I think that we knew I you know, I might just have an unpopular opinion on this, but I don’t respect what those three women or what that entire organization did. I think a lot of them did careerist moves. I think that a lot of them got on that stage for for a moment, and I think they knew exactly what who Trump was. This is not his first election. We all knew it. And I think that when I think about Black people in journalism, Black people in the literary arts, I think that is such an esteemed space to go into. And I think that the legitimacy that you brought him is not equal to you telling people what we already know. This is not a secret person who’s being covert. This is not Nixon. This is a bad, like, cartoon character that we’ve been talking about for almost ten years now. And I and and I hope that it was worth it, because that was 30 minutes that might have cost you 30 years of trust because there are 20 year olds, 21 year olds, 18 year olds, teenagers who saw that, who did, who have less respect for your organization, less respect for Black folks in journalism, Black folks in the literary arts and in media, because you decide to platform such an idiot. Like I, I’m not impressed by anybody who was affiliated with that.
Kaya Henderson: I agree Myles. I was like deeply disappointed um that they invited him, that they gave him a platform. Um. I think that they they had to ask hard questions. It was the only way to make up for what I think was the original, you know, mess up. Um. And it didn’t help anybody. Actually, I don’t think, as Myles said, we don’t there’s nothing different that we know it’s and it’s not like the Black people who are supporting Trump are going to be like, oh my gosh, did you see that? I’m not supporting him anymore. That this I, um it was a waste of time. And I think, I mean, I think there’s going to be a conversation in the NABJ about who they are moving forward and, and how people support that organization it’s, I don’t know. Um. Yeah. Somebody woke up the next day and was like, damn.
DeRay Mckesson: I will say, um white people and Black people saw that interview very differently. Like the way I saw some white pundits read, they were like worst interview he’s ever done. Da da da. I was like, oh, this is this is a reminder that there are two internets. And, um and this is interesting. Now, I like Pelosi. She’s gotten a lot done. But she also released a statement about Walz, or she did an interview about him the other day where she said to characterize him as the left is so unfounded, he’s right down the middle. You’re like, Pelosi, stop talking. You’re not helping. That’s not helping us girl.
De’Ara Balenger: See? See what I’m talking about.
DeRay Mckesson: Not helping us. Not helping us.
Kaya Henderson: In other news, um I have some happy news for our community. Oftentimes on the pod, we lift up instances of um health disparities and how our community um does not have access to the kind of quality health care that we need and deserve. And I’m super excited. I woke up this morning and saw that Bloomberg Philanthropies announced this morning a $600 million gift to four historically Black medical schools today. Um. And that is some good news. $175 million will go to the endowment of Howard University’s College of Medicine, Meharry Medical College, Morehouse School of Medicine. Um. $75 million will go to Charles Drew University of Medicine and Science in Los Angeles, and some money will go towards the creation of a new historically Black medical school in New Orleans at Xavier. And I think that this is amazing, amazing news. A many what many people don’t know is at one time, there were 14 historically Black medical schools producing most of the Black doctors in in the country. Now there are only four. And so the fact that these gifts are going towards their endowment, which means money will spin off every year and will help them um continue to operate. Um. And the creation of a new, uh of a new school is really, really exciting. Um. This is Bloomberg is true to this. He’s not new to this. Um. He’s been giving money to um, to medical facilities at least over the last few years. He actually has a longer record of it. But most recently, in 2020, he gave $100 million to these four historically Black medical schools. In 2021, he gave an additional $6 million to those four medical schools to support their efforts to provide corona vaccines to local communities. Um. And I think last month or so he announced a $1 billion gift to Johns Hopkins Hospital, which is in the city of Baltimore and largely serves the Black community to make sure that um, that medical school could be free for most of the students. Um. Which I think is huge. What he said about the thing is, we have much more to do to build a country where every person, regardless of race, has equal access to quality health care and where students from all backgrounds can pursue their dreams. Um. I brought this because I think that it is really important, um to remind us that uh, government can do some things, but the private sector and philanthropy can do things as well. It also is a reminder to us that we can’t rely on other people to support our institutions. We also have to support our own institutions. Um. You know, Black professionals largely come from historically Black colleges and universities. And so whether you went to one or not, I did not go to a historically Black college or university, but I support them financially because that is the that is part of the answer to freedom for our community. Um. One of the things that I learned about Bloomberg, I’ve done so full disclosure, I’ve done some work with Bloomberg Philanthropies. They supported me tremendously when I was chancellor of DC Public Schools. Um. Funding my Black male initiative um and a number of other things. And, what I learned during that time was uh, that Michael Bloomberg is a huge supporter of the NAACP. And I was like, wow, what’s that about? And his father, who I think was like a janitor or something, very kind of low level. His father took $5 from his check every week and gave it to the NAACP. And when young Bloomberg asked why, he said, because the same thing that happened to us in the Holocaust could happen to anybody. And the NAACP is committed to fighting that. And, you know, I don’t I think there’s lots of criticism to be had for Michael Bloomberg for a lot of things and whatnot. But I it reminds me that we are all in this together. It reminds me that our communities can be supportive of one another. And I think that the best shot that Black people have for better health care is what comes out of these historically Black medical schools. And so I am here for it.
DeRay Mckesson: The only thing I’ll say is that it wasn’t until I learned that uh it was the racist white medical institution closing Black medical schools that decimated the production of Black doctors. That I was like, oh, this is this is a, this is a thing. This is a scam. I was even talking to one of my friends who a paramedic in a big American city, and he was like, all the paramedics don’t live here. They are white. And I’m like, well, what’s wrong? What’s going on? Why can’t we get Black paramedics? He’s like, they can’t afford it. They can’t like the cost, the entry cost of the exams and the da da da da and the classes. And I’m like, again, it all comes back to race. So shout out to Bloomberg for this.
Myles E. Johnson: Just to echo what you said um, Kaya, towards the end, I think we had so many news stories throughout um, my, our tenure [laugh] on the podcast around uh, just medical calamities that have that are that Black people experience. And I do think this type of investment improves our chances of living healthier lives. When you have Black people, like, there’s uh, so many, polls and like, surveys that show that when there’s, you know, a Black doctor and Black teachers that, you know, Black patients do better. So I think that funding these types of research and medical schools really will help us have a reality where we improve a lot of these, like [?], just different news stories around our, around our like, our health lives. You know, I think we could probably do a whole podcast series on Black health and wellness. And I think these type of intentional, moments of of of of of I don’t want to call it charity, but of investment really help us change our, our kind of medical reality. So I loved hearing this story. And I think it’s just the kind of stuff that we need from the, from the, from the rich folk.
De’Ara Balenger: And I’ll just add one thing, Myles, to what you said. It was, one of us covered it, but it was like it’s not even a Black doctor seeing patients that leads to better outcomes for Black people. It’s a Black doctor in the town.
Kaya Henderson: This is actually, July was my four year anniversary on the pod. Can you believe that? And–
Myles E. Johnson: Wow.
Kaya Henderson: My first my first article was that I ever did on the pod was about how Black if if Black mothers have a Black doctor, their mortality rate, um their mortality rate is much better. Is that the right thing? Yeah, yeah, yeah. That Black women live when they have Black doctors. Black mothers live when they have Black doctors.
De’Ara Balenger: And the baby. I think it was the babies too Kaya.
Kaya Henderson: And the babies too. That’s right. It was. It’s both of them. Right. Um.
Myles E. Johnson: Wow.
Kaya Henderson: And so this feels nice to be able to report that there are some systemic fixes and endowment spends off money every year. And so this is a long term, you know, strategy to help build those HBCUs. I’m excited.
De’Ara Balenger: Mm hmm. And the other thing I will say, because I did go to a HBCU, Thurgood Marshall School of Law at Texas Southern University. Going to an HBCU changed my life. And having spent time with so many of my friends that have gone to, you know, obviously my dad, my brothers, my uncle went to Morehouse, so I spent a lot of time in Atlanta, but also [?] just all of them like it, it is just it is the most magical, sacred experience. And these institutions are just they ground us. They ground us. Hampton University, for example, was the first place where you that actually held Black art. The only place where you could actually exhibit Black art was at Hampton University. So please, please, please to Kaya’s point, support as much as you can.
DeRay Mckesson: Don’t go anywhere. More Pod Save the People is coming.
[AD BREAK]
Myles E. Johnson: So I have some more good news. I wanted to do this a little bit earlier, but, you know the election. So there was this huge thing, going on in New York. There was huge budget cuts. Uh. I know the big thing I live, like, very close to Brooklyn, um uh library, the so the big thing that the budgets were being cut for the libraries and, like sud–, like you couldn’t go to a library on um Sunday, um I believe maybe Saturday and Sunday, I don’t know, I think it was different for each library. But you couldn’t go to these libraries anymore because of the budget cuts. And I wanted to kind of bring this news because I think sometimes we hear about the calamity. [laugh] We organize or do what we can in order to change it. And sometimes we don’t always have victory stories, or sometimes there might be a victory story, but it’s never always reported on as heavily as the original. The original sin, let’s say. But it’s official. Funding for New York City libraries is being fully restored. Brooklyn, Queens and New York, public libraries are thrilled that the city’s 2025 fiscal year budget agreement includes the full restoration of 58.3 million in funding for public libraries. A resounding victory for all New Yorkers. What does it mean? It means we are able to continue the vital programs and initiatives and hours of operation that New Yorkers want, need and deserve. I think this is so great because one thing that I learned through, you know, it feels I mean, it’s over ten years now. Ugh. Oh my God. But it’s almost ten years now. But I had so many interactions with libraries when I released um my children’s book, and it was there that I learned that specifically inside of uh, inside of cities. I was in Georgia at the time, but inside of a lot of cities across the world this is a huge, uh resource for people who are homeless, people who are looking for jobs, people who are looking for a safe place for um, their children to be. Libraries are really the heartbeat of a community. And anytime you see a library, you know there that’s someplace that you can go and be safe and get resources. So it’s it’s imperative that um as as long as those libraries can be open as many days as those libraries can be open, that they stay open. And I think that you couldn’t ignore the idea that the police were getting some funding, like so much funding, and you took 58, you took $58 million from the community. So I’m glad that this was corrected. And I also hope that it’s not played with next year, hopefully because of this push back that people did. People in the government will say this is something that we can’t play with when it comes to New Yorkers. And I hope that this is a trend, you know, nationwide, because I think that sometimes when you’re not in the need of the library space, you don’t know how crucial it is. So a lot of people who are privileged or and just a little bit more privileged, I’m not talking about, you know, the liberal elites who I’m talking to right now. I’m talking about even your [laugh] your more your more average liberal elite, um who just has a laptop and can go to [?] books. You may not utilize libraries as much, but it’s so important. It keeps our communities safe, it keeps children. It gives children somewhere to be educated. It gives people jobs. It helps people grow skills. It’s just a great place for community. I forgot, um what is his name? Is it Michael, the librarian who was going who was going viral? Um. I think that Michael really in the in the in the, in the social media, pop culture zeitgeist sphere that we’re all existing in really uh put to surface this type of importance of uh of libraries very reminiscent of, like, our generation’s LeVar Burton of saying, no, this is a really important tool and resource for communities. And just because you might forget about them or there’s so much going on that you may not think about them all the time. When you cut library funding and you take away these services, your community will feel it. You will see more crime, you will see more homelessness, you will see more joblessness. You will see a stagnation in skill, um people absorbing skills and getting skills. It’s a big deal. Don’t touch the libraries.
DeRay Mckesson: All I have to say is the Adams administration cannot end soon enough. Wrap this up. Get him out of here. [indistinct] [laughter] Get this man out of here. There are a million examples I could say. But I don’t even feel like I need to say them. Get him out of here. Shout out to all the people that fought about the libraries. It seemed like he was never going to budge. It seemed like he had already made up the budget and made up his mind. And we won. When we fight, we win. Get this man out of here. That’s the clean version.
De’Ara Balenger: That’s where I was going DeRay, it’s like the New York City Mayor Mayoral race is November 2025. We have Scott Stringer announced, you know, someone I want to know more about is state Senator Zellnor. Zellnor Myrie so I don’t know look maybe this, in an episode soon we should dig into these these these candidates and and what it’s looking like, um from a New York City perspective on getting him out of here. DeRay. I know, that’s right.
Kaya Henderson: Um. I’m going back to Myles’s commercial for libraries and how libraries are a vibrant part of the community. Like, a community is unhealthy if it doesn’t have a library. And the New York City Public Library, like the vast amount of things that it does from like, career resources, to like people teach ESL classes at the library like arts and exposure. Right. There are author talks at the library, y’all the Jay-Z exhibit was not at the Brooklyn Museum. It was at the Brooklyn Public Library. Right. And that that opened things up to lots and lots of people. I’m particularly interested in the role of libraries and the New York City Public Library at this moment where accurate representations of our history are under attack, because all across the country where they’re banning books, the New York Public Library stood up and said, you know what? We will make these books available to anybody in the country. Um. All they got to do is get online and they can get a New York City Library card, and they can have access to these books. And so the New York City Public Library system, which actually is the probably the largest library system in the country, this is not just for New York City, it’s for the whole entire country. And so um thank you to all of the advocates who fought for this. Um. And the only way that we keep our library strong is going to the library. So put down your little Amazon cart and go to the library and borrow some books, friends.
Myles E. Johnson: Can I say something really quick before we um before we close out. Uh. I want to just do, like, a little quick shout out. I feel like I’ve never done a shout out, but a quick shout out to PBS Sound Field. They invited me to talk about Sylvester. That interview was live. Um. People have been responding really well to it. And, I don’t know, just libraries, PBS. I feel like little geeky eight year old me who’s watching Clifford and Arthur and and Zoom is so proud of myself. So thank you for coming into my home and talking about Sylvester and educating people on Black queer disco and having me be a part of that um education for another generation. So thank you. PBS Sound Field. Go look it up, y’all.
DeRay Mckesson: My news is about Maricopa County. Before I say that, I do love that Black people always. You know, the way we talk about names, people already call him Governor Waltz. His name is Governor Walz. There is no T in his name. It is not waltz. Y’all. [laugh] It is governor somebody was like, here we go Waltz. I’m like, that’s not the man’s name. Okay, so Maricopa County um is in Arizona and in Arizona, um Maricopa County is one of the biggest. It’s one of the biggest geographic regions for, like a DA’s office. It has a very big jail. Um. And they have a lot to do with jails. But this is about the number of deaths that happened in the jail. So um, there are a host of people who have died and the the short version I want to talk about today is that, they have been underreporting the numbers. There’s one person in particular whose story got told when, um the AZ central wrote about it, but there was a guy who was struggling with severe withdrawal symptoms from addiction, and he acquired 250 fentanyl pills while he was in the Maricopa County Jail. Now, how do you get 250? How do you get any fentanyl in jail? But how do you get 250 fentanyl pills? You can only get that with the help of the staff inside the jail. So he eventually dies, and he does not get counted in the Maricopa County jail numbers because the jail is like they released him from custody a day before he died in the hospital. Now he died because he attempted suicide in the jail. And then he was taken to the hospital. And they’re like, well, he wasn’t in the hospital when he died, or he wasn’t in the jail when he died. And what it what the numbers show is that 43 people are known to have died in the jail that year, and more than a quarter of those deaths were suicides. 43 more people died in the jails in 2023. Drug overdoses, withdrawals and suicides are uh the main contributor. But the story that makes it a even bigger deal is that they were just underreporting the numbers. So there are a host of deaths that just weren’t even counted at all, because they weren’t accurately counting the deaths at all. Um. So I wanted to bring it up because, you know, there are a lot of jails that do this. Riker’s used to do this where they would release people like the day before they died or something like that, so they wouldn’t count it as an official death at Rikers, or if they were sick and people like they knew that they were not going to recover, they would take them off the rolls and say they died in the hospital. And I’m just shocked by it. I’m always shocked by it. There’s no good reporting of uh jail deaths in the country. There’s no, like, central database. They don’t have to report it really to the federal government. You know, on the police side, we actually have the most comprehensive database of people killed by the police. But there is no corollary for prisons and jails. And I just wanted to bring it up because I didn’t want this to go um unseen by people. Maricopa County is a big place in Arizona, and Arizona has a lot of issues that people aren’t paying attention to.
Myles E. Johnson: I think, uh just what continues to disappoint me about around this reporting around the prison is how we relinquish our responsibility for people because of their status of being um in jail or out of jail. Like, there’s, they’re still our responsibility. And even when I think about I don’t want to like butcher any of these, like, news stories that I’ve heard because I feel I’ve heard so many. But I know the things about the uh, the people being buried, um uh and and bodies being found. I know the things about, uh just like the heinous um uh conditions and just saying just just how many just insanely Orange is the new black Netflix scripted things that we’ve heard. That it almost sounds unreal that this is still happ– that this happens in our nation. We can’t relinquish people from being our responsibility just because they’re in jail. And I think that’s what I think about because it’s just it’s just disgusting and it makes me even more fearful about the behaviors and actions that are happening from the people who are supposed to be maintaining some type of order from people. If you’re willing to, to do this type of dark, shady stuff, then we already know that you’re abusing people. Allegedly, in my opinion. We already know that you’re um doing other heinous things. That uh, that will be, you know, profiled in the New Yorker and and breaking news in in five or ten years, allegedly, in my opinion. So, I hope that we one day wake up from everything that’s going on in, in the prison system, because I do think that our outside society is going to end up reaping what happens if that doesn’t if we don’t really look at the prison system, even though it’s scary to look at for some of us, namely Kaya. [laugh]
Kaya Henderson: This show is scary, but um I had to, I had I was like, why do I know about Maricopa County jails? Right? And it’s because that’s where the Arpaio dude was, right? So I don’t know if you remember this, but Joseph Arpaio was the sheriff of Maricopa County from 1993 to 2017. I don’t know, somebody do the math on that. It’s a very, very long time. Um. And this is the dude who, if you remember, he was putting prisoners in pink panties. He had the prisoners outside in the, like, hundred degree heat. Um. He had the. Oh, yeah. He put, like, the tent city outside and made the people live out in the heat. All I know is there has been a long history of misconduct at the Maricopa jail. And even if Mr. Arpaio is no longer there, you know, those people have been there for their careers. And I think this is an example. Like when people say there is not institutional racism or systemic racism, like this is the example, right? Like people have devised a way it’s kind of like De’Ara, I’m asking my lawyer friend, can a jail just decide to release somebody? No. If you are convicted, you got to serve your time. How could I release you the day before you die? Just because I decided. So is that legal?
De’Ara Balenger: Yeah. They’re like exceptions where you can release people. That’s why a lot of, like, you know, during Covid especially, like people wanted they were sort of pursuing releases because of health.
Kaya Henderson: But there’s some–
De’Ara Balenger: You know, health.
Kaya Henderson: –process you have to go through, right? Like, you have to, the jail can’t just decide.
De’Ara Balenger: In Arizona–
Kaya Henderson: You know what I don’t want–
De’Ara Balenger: In Arizona–
Kaya Henderson: –Kaya no more. See you soon.
De’Ara Balenger: In Arizona, probably yes.
Kaya Henderson: Well, okay. That’s fair.
De’Ara Balenger: You I think–
Kaya Henderson: But–
De’Ara Balenger: You I’m sure you I’m sure there’s like a petition process or something, and a judge has to okay it, but I don’t I don’t think it’s like heavy process.
Kaya Henderson: I’m sure the day before I die because I’m in the hospital, you can’t just put me out and say I’m no longer [laughter]–
De’Ara Balenger: No.
Kaya Henderson: I’m no longer a resident. Um. And I think it just goes, we cover a lot of um improprieties in in jail. But it goes to show I want to link it back to the library piece. Advocates do meaningful work. They keep these issues in front of us. They remind us when it’s time to fight. And so shout out to all of the people covering these improprieties and the advocates who are working on behalf of our incarcerated citizens to stop this stuff, because when nobody is looking, all kinds of shady things happen. So thanks for bringing this DeRay. Um. Shout out to all of the families who are fighting. I mean, the number of examples that this article gave about how, you know, people are treated was just it was it was another reminder, um of how we got a lot of freedom work to do.
De’Ara Balenger: And and it’s interesting too y’all, there’s actually a prosecutor’s race happening right now in Maricopa County. So it looks like a sister, Tamika Wooten, is um is running as the Democrat because right now the incumbent is a Republican. Um. Rachel Mitchell so it’s also interesting, like as progressive as sort of this area, sort of like Phoenix and and beyond and Arizona is getting, they still have Republican prosecutors. Um. I guess they’re called county attorneys. Um. And I think part of that is, is that people people don’t know that in a lot of places in this country, prosecutors are elected, like, you can vote for who you want to be your prosecutor. Some places they are appointed. Um. But so, I don’t know, maybe that’s something we should dig into is this prosecutor’s race that’s happening right now in Maricopa County, because I think issues like, you know, obviously it’s the system at play. But I think having somebody that–
Myles E. Johnson: Cares.
De’Ara Balenger: Has compassion is. Yes, yes. And interestingly, um because one of my best friends is going to be there this week, the National Association of Black Prosecutors is actually having their conference in Boston this week. So I’m going to try to get some intel from there and see what they’re talking about.
[AD BREAK]
DeRay Mckesson: Well that’s it. Thanks so much for tuning into Pod Save the People this week. Don’t forget to follow us at @crookedmedia on Instagram, Twitter, and TikTok. And if you enjoyed this episode of Pod Save the People, consider dropping us a review on your favorite podcast app and we’ll see you next week. Pod Save the People is a production of Crooked Media. It’s produced by AJ Moultrié and mixed by Vasilis Fotopoulos. Executive produced by me, and special thanks to our weekly contributors Kaya Henderson, De’Ara Balenger and Myles E. Johnson. [music break]
[AD BREAK]
