In This Episode
New York City Council decriminalizes jaywalking, Black New Orleanians reclaim historical beach, and Questlove to direct documentary on Earth, Wind, and Fire.
News
Modified ‘Jaywalking’ Repeal Passes Council
In New Orleans, a ‘Black Beach’ Is Being Rescued From the Ruins
Questlove To Direct Earth, Wind & Fire Documentary
Follow @PodSaveThePeople on Instagram.
TRANSCRIPT
[AD BREAK]
DeRay Mckesson: [music break] Hey, this is DeRay and welcome to Pod Save the People. In this episode it is me and Myles and De’Ara talking about the news that you don’t know from the past week with regard to race, justice, and equity. Don’t forget to follow us on Instagram at @PodSavePeople. Boom. Here we go.
De’Ara Balenger: Family. Welcome to another episode of Pod Save the People. I am De’Ara Balenger. you can find me on Instagram at @dearabalenger.
Myles E. Johnson: I’m Myles E Johnson. You can find me on Instagram at @pharaohrapture.
DeRay Mckesson: And this is DeRay at @deray on Twitter.
De’Ara Balenger: Here we are. Another week. So much activity. I think we are today, 35 days out from the election. Wow.
Myles E. Johnson: Oh my goodness.
De’Ara Balenger: I don’t know about y’all but I’m so excited because this weekend kicks off my canvasing efforts. I’m taking groups of folks who I love and who have been doing this canvasing door knocking work with me. We start in Philly. We’re going to go to Georgia. We’re going to go to Michigan. So if you want to be involved, just DM me on the Instagram. I’ll get you hooked up. I’m also super excited to announce that I’m a senior adviser now to the entertainment and culture team for Kamala Harris. Okay. Because that’s what we need.
DeRay Mckesson: Woop woop, woop woop.
De’Ara Balenger: That’s what we need. So–
DeRay Mckesson: De’Ara can, what is–
De’Ara Balenger: –again.
DeRay Mckesson: What has door knocking been like? What is it like? What have the conversations–
De’Ara Balenger: So I haven’t–
DeRay Mckesson: Has it–
De’Ara Balenger: I have not I have not knocked a door yet this cycle. So this is–
DeRay Mckesson: Okay.
De’Ara Balenger: Every weekend until the election, I will be knocking on doors. But I am historically a terrible door knocker because I spend way too much time at one person’s home.
DeRay Mckesson: [laugh] At each door. Well, every week–
De’Ara Balenger: I’m also–
DeRay Mckesson: We expect an update De’Ara, of the door knocking.
De’Ara Balenger: I will be giving y’all updates. I will be giving you updates. But also there’s there’s things that you can do from home. Like if you just want to phone bank from home, hit me up. I’ll let you know how to do that. Um. But super super excited just because I think it’ll actually help being in the real world and talking to people. Because what we see in our what we experience in our New York bubble and what we experience on the news, I hope isn’t real. I know it is real.
Myles E. Johnson: I’m not in a New York bubble. [laughter] And in my very real Midwestern town um well, you know what’s so cool about here, too? You see Tim Walz and um and president, [?] I keep on doing it, and Vice President Harris stuff everywhere. So, like, what’s really normal here is, of course, you’ll see Trump stuff is just how it’s going to go.
De’Ara Balenger: Right. But–
Myles E. Johnson: But um you also see a lot of um Walz Harris stuff. You see a lot of um just like [?] like my body, my choice stuff. You see a lot of um cease fire now stuff like it’s kind of cool because I know that in suburban rural Georgia and Midwestern towns that I’m that I’m used to, usually it was the conservatives who have mascots. And then you’re kind of like a quiet liberal. But now it seems it feels like that’s changing.
De’Ara Balenger: That’s right. That’s right. Even I was in New Orleans for a couple of days last week and there were signs. Harris Walz signs everywhere. And for me, somebody that’s been campaigning for a long time, it’s a very old school sort of mentality. But when you see them yard signs, that’s a that’s a very, very good indicator. It is. It is. In 16′–
Myles E. Johnson: Oh. That you can lay your head down there?
De’Ara Balenger: Yes. But oh al–
Myles E. Johnson: Yeah.
De’Ara Balenger: Or or or that we’re going to have or that people are there’s like excitement is palpable.
Myles E. Johnson: Absolutely.
De’Ara Balenger: And people are showing it. And um–
Myles E. Johnson: Absolutely.
De’Ara Balenger: Yeah, so that’s that’s very exciting. And so, you know, I think that will help to color I mean Donald Trump said some really wild things, but not wild to us. I wonder if wild to his his audience followers, what do we call people that like Donald Trump? Trumpers. I don’t know.
DeRay Mckesson: Trumpers. [laughter]
Myles E. Johnson: It starts with–
DeRay Mckesson: Yeah.
Myles E. Johnson: It starts with what ends with [?]. [indistinct] I feel like it’s still a bad word to call everybody that, but I’m like, okay.
DeRay Mckesson: It is. Um. It’s interesting. I think about the purge comment he made where he’s like, you know, as if we just had one violent day. Like people would start acting better. And you’re like, that’s wild. If anybody on the left ever even hinted at that, it would be wall to wall coverage.
[clip of Donald Trump] Because the liberal left won’t let them do it. The liberal left wants to destroy him and they want to destroy our country. You know, if you had one day like one real rough, nasty day with the drug stores as an example. But they have to be taught now, if you had one really violent day, like a guy like Mike Kelly, put him in charge, Congressman Kelly put him in charge for one day. [applause] Mike, would you say, you’re right here. The whole it’s a chain of events and so bad. One rough hour and I mean real rough. The word will get out and it will end immediately. End immediately. You know? It will end immediately.
DeRay Mckesson: I think I took for granted just how xenophobic people are. Like I you know, Trump’s lies are obviously not true around immigration. This idea that, like, you know, Biden and Kamala just let anybody come in, there are no rules, like oh he’s just saying stuff that’s so intensely untrue and yet pretty sane people are looking at him and being like, yeah, yeah, they’re taking our jobs. And you’re like, that is just, I don’t know. It continues to floor me at how how ready people are to sign on to stuff that is rooted in racism, xenophobia, and at the same time untrue and his other comments. I don’t know if you saw he has this whole screed against overtime. He says, and I quote, “I hated to pay overtime. I hated it. I shouldn’t say this, but I wouldn’t pay it.” And you’re like, how does the average American sign up for that and think that is good policy? I just like I’m like, what am I missing?
Myles E. Johnson: He’s he’s been able to. You know, he’s been able to convince the most like economically like disabled of like of us that there are just like millionaires in wait. So I think a lot of the things that they’re cosigning and cheering on are things that they hope to be able to employ. So today they might be being exploited by it but, but tomorrow they’ll be inheriting it. So I think it’s a weird parasocial flip flop world that they’re in that they think that they’re just, you know, a millionaire in in waiting.
De’Ara Balenger: I’m just–
Myles E. Johnson: And also he’s like, okay, let’s say the quiet part out loud. Like he’s like going. [laughter] He’s like, he’s like, losing it. Right? Right. I don’t know the I don’t know the proper it’s ableist I don’t know the proper words. But like he’s like losing his marbles like his marbles have are he does not have a lot of marbles to spend left.
De’Ara Balenger: Yeah.
Myles E. Johnson: We saw Biden on The View. Well I saw Biden on The View because I watched I’ve been watching The View since I was nine. So it’s like [laughing] [banter] like a [?]–
De’Ara Balenger: –[?] so much commentary for The View. Okay.
Myles E. Johnson: I was like literally, I was going to be like, this has been my moment because I literally saw them go from um talking about kitchen appliances to interviewing presidents. So I’m like, you go women. So my first feminist consumerist action was watching The View. But um Biden was super sharp. I said in the group chat, he was super sharp, he was witty. Um. He was very present and alert. And it made me think that, yeah, maybe he did have a bad night. And I and I don’t know, everybody lies so I I wasn’t sold on it, but now I’m like, well, if we we have to have that same gaze with Trump because yes, he’s saying things that are xenophobic, racist, and all these other things which are normal for him. But to me, when I just hear like the quality of him being able to string thoughts and and ideas together, it feels like it has deteriorated since the last time we spoke to him. And I feel like that’s the grown up conversation to have too. Get him to do a brain scan, get him to do these things that they were trying to they were asking Biden to do. Let’s do that.
DeRay Mckesson: It is wild. I can’t believe that the actual election is coming in less than 40 days. It is. That is also sort of crazy to think about.
Myles E. Johnson: I’m I’m so excited. Did you all see the um SNL?
De’Ara Balenger: No, who was on SNL?
DeRay Mckesson: SNL killed it. Oh De’Ara. Everybody.
Myles E. Johnson: Okay. I was going to say. I was going to say. What?
De’Ara Balenger: Y’all oh my god. I guess I should know, since I’m on the entertainment and culture team, maybe I should keep up on these things, SNL.
Myles E. Johnson: I’m like.
DeRay Mckesson: They have an incredible well Maya Rudolph obviously is Kamala, has nailed Kamala’s voice.
De’Ara Balenger: Oh I see.
DeRay Mckesson: The guy playing Tim Walz. They got Eric Adams last time. They had there was somebody else, Myles. It was Eric Adams, Walz, Kamala, oh Biden.
Myles E. Johnson: [?]
DeRay Mckesson: The guy playing Biden.
Myles E. Johnson: And Vance.
DeRay Mckesson: Oh and Vance. Yeah, they got the whole thing.
Myles E. Johnson: Yeah. Yeah no it was it was–
DeRay Mckesson: And the lead star–
De’Ara Balenger: Love that.
DeRay Mckesson: –from Hacks was the, like, person. And she’s also incredible. The woman from Hacks is just great.
De’Ara Balenger: Mm hmm.
Myles E. Johnson: Maya Rudolph. When she when she does um Vice President Harris. Maya Rudolph, it’s all in the hands. Her hands uh and how uh and how Vice President Harris has her hands and how Maya Maya Rudolph does their hands. It’s so like on point. And I don’t know. She’s she’s just she’s just a genius. She’s just like just a comedic, like, actress genius. But it was so good. And um I think they really captured. I don’t know the moment the moment like I love that, like you could critique through comedy because they even critiqued some of the like the maybe the more like the um the hallowness of some certain of the campaign when it comes to um Walz and Harris. But I thought it was still fair and I and I thought it would still it still felt like independent comedians commenting on America and it felt like a freedom that I feel like we’ve been maybe afraid to have. I love that it was still poking fun about about it all, you know?
De’Ara Balenger: I mean.
DeRay Mckesson: And it was like the episode is had everything in it. But yes. Let’s let’s keep it moving.
De’Ara Balenger: Well, I think someone speaking of Eric Adams in SNL ha ha, um I think since we were last together, um Eric Adams had not been yet indicted and wildly DeRay, you covered it was you that covered sort of the update, gave the update on sort of like the indictment scheme of, I don’t know, the dozen or so people in his administration. And I still think I mean, I think even in our conversation last week. I don’t know necessarily if I would have left that being like I think Eric Adams is going to be indicted this week. But he was and on very serious things like fraud and bribery. Um. And this is related back to um to the accusation that he was sort of acting in in support of or in giving advantages to um the Turkish government in Turkey under the, you know, sort of the the guise of at some point Eric will be Eric Adams will be president of the United States. So we’ll get in to bed with him now, hoping that something um greater will come later. I wonder how those Turkish people are feeling now that [laughing] that ever thought Eric Adams was going to be president? Um. Y’all might also want to get a consultant over here too to help you all make some of your decisions [laugh] your political decisions. Um. But I in my sort of universe and community, everybody has been very happy with this indictment. Um. So, I don’t know, wondering what’s happening in y’all’s world, because in mine, people were elated. [banter]
DeRay Mckesson: You know, there are only two ways to get rid of the mayor um if he doesn’t resign, which he is refusing to resign. There is like a committee of elected people in New York City who can come together and essentially force it to happen. And they it’s like, you know, some city council people, the comptroller da da. It’s like a, you know, a seemingly old law that allows this. And then the governor actually has the power to remove the mayor of New York City. We should play a clip of the press conference that Eric Adams had right after the indictment. It is one of the worst press conferences I’ve ever seen ever in the history of press conferences.
[clip of unnamed protestor in New York] [?] New York saying that this is not a black thing. This is a you thing. This is a you thing Eric Adams. This is not a black thing. Your policies are anti-Black. You are a disgrace to all Black people in this city. The things that you have done are unconscionable. You hurt our schools. Our streets are dirty. Our children are harassed by police. This is ridiculous. This is ridiculous. You can shush me all you want. But the people are with us. And this is not a Black thing, this is a justice thing.
[clip of Eric Adams] First of all, I want to thank you uh for being here this morning. And I want to thank the supporters of all ethnic groups.
DeRay Mckesson: Shout out to the protesters outside yelling at him while he is talking because he deserved it. But then, you know, I don’t know if you saw he did two things is that he is now on a tour of Black churches saying, I’m not going to resign. I’m not going resign. The only people standing behind him during the press conference were older Black people. And then Sharpton has come out defending his decision not to resign. Sharpton’s like the governor should not intervene. Adams should think long and hard about it. And you’re like, well, it’s not that. It’s not that people are just upset with Eric Adams. Remember, it’s the entire administration is tainted. It’s the police chief guy raided, the new police chief got raided. The chancellor of schools is retiring, is forced out who is dating the deputy mayor. It is rumored that the deputy mayor and the chancellor are going to get married immediately so they can benefit from spousal protections in the criminal prosecution process because you can’t make spouses testify against each other. So they’re going to get married really quickly. His long time adviser, Ingrid, she’s retiring. It’s like, how do you run a city government when nobody of integrity will want to be around you as the leader? That’s not fair to New Yorkers. That’s not fair to anybody. That’s why he needs to resign. And Sharpton defending him actually just made me really sad. It’s like we have to acknowledge sometimes that our friends do things that you cannot defend. And I get really disappointed in the older Black political class that will defend until the end stuff that makes no sense.
Myles E. Johnson: That’s what I was thinking. I call when when Black public figures do this, I call it the R. Kelly tour because there’s just a knowledge inside of the Black community that if you’re a public figure, there is a type of tour, a church tour or a redemption tour um or I’m being crucified tour that you can go on and there’s a segment of our population that are that feels so activated and compelled by Black figures in power that they will support you even if this is the first time they’re seeing you when you’re in trouble, which is often the case sometimes. Is that the first time people are interfacing with churches or using certain types of um uh communities is when they’re in trouble trying to revamp or redeem themselves or create like a narrative around it. And I think you know personally that it’s disgusting.
De’Ara Balenger: I think what could be exciting here and like really riding off of listen, I’m not comparing Joe Biden and Eric Adams. However, I think the sort of the incredible energy shift we’ve had from Joe Biden to Kamala Harris, I think it could be exciting to see what we have in New York City from a shift from somebody like Eric Adams to a Jumaane Williams. I just I think we getting through Covid as New Yorkers sort of, you know, the last few years under this administration, the city feeling honestly gloomy, feeling gloomy, feeling um and I think Eric Adams is not that it’s all to him, but he is you know somewhat the mayor of New York is very important in terms of establishing sort of, you know, sort of a cultural tone. And I think how sort of vitriolic he’s been towards migrants. How what’s happened at Rikers with so many deaths that have gone completely unaccounted for? It’s just like sort of at every touchpoint for me in things of what reflects a pulse of humanity and dignity in a city. He’s just not accomplished any of that. And so I think what could be exciting is sort of a breath of fresh air, with Jumaane Williams And, you know, obviously they’ll still have to be a reelection, etc., etc.. But just anything I think would be welcomed for me.
Myles E. Johnson: Can I say a–
DeRay Mckesson: You know the–
Myles E. Johnson: –thing or or–
DeRay Mckesson: Can I just say–
Myles E. Johnson: Sorry.
DeRay Mckesson: Process wise, you know, what happens is that Jumaane will become, as a public advocate, will become mayor. But within three days of him becoming mayor, he has to announce 80 days out a special election and [?] today. And that is not necessarily great because nobody else has a lot of name recognition in the city. And the leading person with name recognition, who I don’t think will win, but we don’t want him to be mayor either, is Andrew Cuomo. And Cuomo is saying that he will run in a special election.
De’Ara Balenger: 100%.
DeRay Mckesson: If–
De’Ara Balenger: He’s been–
DeRay Mckesson: It comes up.
De’Ara Balenger: Yeah. Yeah. But maybe that’s what we need to just sort of get reengaged and galvanize even within New York City. I mean, I feel like. I mean, New York has now become a place where, you know, those wild moms that are anti-trans. Who are those moms? I forget what those moms are called, um but they’re even now in New York public schools going to you know, it’s just we actually need and and obviously there’s a huge activist community that is doing so much and that did so much around the budget and saving the libraries and yada yada yada. But I think it is actually time for us to get super engaged around this mayor’s race. We’ve had like a string now of sort of like okay, mayors. And we deserve more in New York, we we we need to have more. So I think maybe than than not us getting behind a candidate that doesn’t have good that doesn’t have necessarily, Tim Walz didn’t have name recognition until, you know, four weeks ago. So that could be that could be exciting. And I’m looking for another race after we win this one for Kamala. Maybe that’s in New York City.
Myles E. Johnson: Okay. Okay. The tiny little thing that I would want to say too is as I was listening to this, first of all, that attorney general doing the Diddy and doing the Eric Adams press conferences, been working, been working but um [laughter] but I did want to say that I was really happy that now, don’t get me wrong, hundreds of thousand dollars is obviously like a lot of money. But I was really happy that it didn’t get to a ridiculous place. That gave me like a lot of solace in in in this indictment and in the justice system is that it just didn’t go to this like, wild number. And I saw some people critiquing it because I think we’re so used to hearing 10 million, 100 million that it went on for so long, was so hidden, was so well oiled that by the time justice comes, it’s been happening for so long that it’s in this astronomical millions place. But it wasn’t and like I don’t know there was just something there around as soon as as soon as the smoke came, there was somebody to put it out, you know. And and it seems like I guess this attorney general was like the face of that. [laugh] But it seems like he’s not playing around when it comes to people abusing, abusing the system even, it doesn’t have to get to a the sexiest wildest number for justice to prevail. And I and I like that. I like that.
DeRay Mckesson: I don’t know if you saw um that Donald Trump came to Eric Adams defense and said that Adams was being targeted because he was against immigrants and the migrants coming into the city. Um. And, you know, there’s a whole set of people who have been Black politicians, Democrats who’ve been held accountable by this administration, who are suddenly like they’re targeted. I think about Marilyn Mosby also got prosecuted and convicted under this administration. And her whole thing is like she was targeted, da da da. Eric Adams as well. And Myles, I think you’re right. It’s like, you know, we what, the Adams thing though was so nuts was it was like for upgrades on the airplane, you know and you’re like, okay, sir.
Myles E. Johnson: Right.
DeRay Mckesson: They were upgrading you on Turkish air and you’re like giving them kickbacks. The aide is like, you know, I don’t think my boss would do this. You’re texting being like, Yeah, go ahead. It’s like, come on.
Myles E. Johnson: No. Yeah. Black. Black people who have. That’s why I guess we’re all Black and we all share the same race. But when it comes to any of these people, Marilyn Mosby, Eric Adams, if you are somebody who’s exploiting um imperialist capitalist white supremacist powers for your own benefit, then you deserve the cannibalization that happened. And let’s be clear. Whatever is going to happen to you is going to be less than the poor Black folks you’re supposed to be serving. So I don’t feel bad for the 1% of Black people who are hypnotized by power and money who now have been caught. [?] It’s not even interesting to see those people get um away with something like Trump. That doesn’t even it’s shameful for that to even be a part of our psyche when it comes to our politics. Black politics and Black worldbuilding. It’s amoral and that’s against how we do politics in the Black community. So get over that.
De’Ara Balenger: And for Eric Adams, I just see him as somebody that would be on Fox News talking about his support of Trump. I don’t I mean, you know what I’m saying?
Myles E. Johnson: With them big ol teeth.
De’Ara Balenger: Like, that’s just not. Yeah, it’s it’s not that’s just not out of the realm of possibility. [laughing]
DeRay Mckesson: Hey, you’re listening to Pod Save the People. Stay tuned, there’s more to come.
[AD BREAK]
DeRay Mckesson: I’ll go to the news so my news is about jaywalking. All of you know that jaywalking is a crime. Whether it gets enforced or not is another issue, but crossing the street outside of the crosswalks is not legal. It is mostly not enforced, just like in a lot of places. If you are under a certain age, it’s 10 or 11. In most places, if you ride a bike on the sidewalk, it is also illegal. I only know because the police have killed people who have ridden bikes on sidewalks. And this, the reason for the engagement was they were like well it was illegal to ride a bike on the sidewalk. Same thing, the police have killed people who have jaywalked, as you know. But my news is that Streetsblog NYC, which is a great news outlet in New York City, did an analysis of the last year of tickets for jaywalking. Of the 463 of the 463 summonses where race was identified, only 467 summonses were given out. Like so 463 is essentially all of them, minus four. 426 of the summonses, 92% were written to Black people or Latinos. Only 27 tickets for jaywalking, less than 6% were issued to people identified as white. Y’all. That is wild. As you can imagine, Black people are only 20% of the population in New York City, though they were almost 60% of the jaywalking tickets. And Hispanic residents received 33% of the tickets, though they’re only 29% of the population. White people are 32% of the population and only received 6% of the tickets. Now, I just needed to call it out, what I appreciate is that the New York City Council, in response to this exposé, repealed the law that made jaywalking illegal. And I appreciate that they did it quickly. This news came out. Somebody went and um [?] some people introduced a bill saying we don’t the police should not be able to stop people just because they don’t cross in a crosswalk. Boom, it was signed. I mean, it was it was passed by the council. And here we go. And I appreciate that sort of quick response when data comes out that shows racial disparities and shout out to the New York City Council for moving quickly and making it happen. But I wanted to bring it here because jaywalking continues to still be illegal and a pretense that the police use to stop people.
Myles E. Johnson: And I love this as well DeRay, because I think that sometimes for obvious reasons, we can get really um just hypnotized by the the bigger events that happen when it comes to racism um in this country. And it really are, it’s moments like this, though, right? It’s like what what is what is the the opening for this interaction. And that’s really it’s not it doesn’t sound as um eye catching jaywalking, you know, but that really could be the first initial interaction that makes somebodies name turn into a hashtag. So if these type of laws and these type of um uh moments that really help keep your average Black person safe from from what I’ve noticed from from from you all.
De’Ara Balenger: This is actually a interesting one. And one of those things like like as a Black girl, I just have trauma around. But don’t think about processing why. But growing up, it was always a thing in my family, particularly in Minneapolis, where you didn’t jaywalk. And you didn’t jaywalk because my Uncle Stanley had jaywalked, got arrested and got beat up and lost his eye by the police. And–.
Myles E. Johnson: Wow.
De’Ara Balenger: It just is something like my cousins and I grew up just not like like I think about it now, like even in New York, if I’m crossing the street and I know the light’s red or it’s a don’t walk. I like something happens physically where I’m like something could happen to you. You know, so I think it’s it’s also just like psychologically, some of these things, like what they do to our psyche is just in the growing up in a Black body that I don’t even think we process, right? It’s just like one of those things. But this in Minneapolis it was wild. In the ’80s, jaywalking, um disproportionately arresting Black men in particular. And so. Thanks for bringing this to the podcast DeRray, because I think it’s one of those things where it’s like. You know, you can name it and then somehow understand um more deeply what sort of is attached to it. So.
Myles E. Johnson: Yeah.
DeRay Mckesson: De’Ara, thanks for sharing your story. You know, it’s it reminds me that there are so many pieces of the criminal legal system that we know the data about, but we don’t always have stories about. So I didn’t know that, like people in your family have experienced the real time impact of how jaywalking because most people hear it and they’re like, oh you know, the police just randomly stop people. If you’re not doing anything wrong, then what does it matter? And it’s like, well, no, it matters because it leads to wild consequences. And you didn’t do anything.
De’Ara Balenger: Right.
Myles E. Johnson: And leave people alone. There are people who owe millions of dollars–
De’Ara Balenger: Leave people–
Myles E. Johnson: Got whole–
De’Ara Balenger: –alone.
Myles E. Johnson: Got tunnels going from Texas to Ghana just trafficking people. Like, leave me alone. If I want to jaywalk, leave me alone. There’s other [?] get away from me. Get away from me, I have somewhere to go. Get a go go away.
De’Ara Balenger: Oh my gosh.
DeRay Mckesson: Don’t go anywhere. More Pod Save the People is coming.
[AD BREAK]
De’Ara Balenger: Okay. So everyone should know that I love New Orleans. It has been a second home to me since I first went there for law school. Now, I was supposed to be there for the Black Law Students Association conference, but I was really just in the streets. And that was my first introduction to New Orleans, and I have loved it ever since. So it’s been like 20 years now. I’ve been going there, spending a lot of time there. And so The New York Times covered a story about a Black beach in New Orleans that I did not know about. Um. But also just seeing sort of like Black New Orleanians in The New York Times was like, oh what’s what’s going on here? And thank you, New York Times, since I pay my money every month for y’all, giving me things that I actually care about and want to learn more about. So thank you. Hopefully that happens more often. Um. But it’s called Lincoln Beach. And and I feel like we you know, we’ve covered a lot on, like, Black Land and and even Black beaches as well. And there’s something about thinking about Black folks and beaches that just takes me to a place of like how deserving we are of leisure and joy, just laying out at the beach. Um. And so this was really like a vital space for New Orleans Black community during segregation. It was a hub of live music, um but it fell into neglect after desegregation in 1964. The things that fell into neglect after desegregation. Any who. That’s a whole podcast in and of itself. But now there’s been sort of this grassroots restoration that’s being led by Michael Sage. Sage. I love a man from New Orleans.
Myles E. Johnson: Okay.
De’Ara Balenger: Michael Sage Pellet. So they took it upon themselves to revive Lincoln Beach. After decades of disrepair and all through volunteer efforts, this essential um cleanup has happened. And it’s just sort of interest has grown, dedication has grown, and it’s become this movement into something much longer. Um. And a 2022 report basically explored Lincoln Beach’s potential as a tool to combat coastal erosion and address climate change issues affecting Louisiana. So it sort of blends this cultural restoration and this environmental sustainability. Black folks just saving stuff, just restoring and saving. Okay. So uh the beach was officially recognized as a culturally significant site by the city in 2021. Thanks city of New Orleans in 2021. Even though people been going to the beach since 1966 pick up sticks um and it was added to the National Register of Historic Places in 2023. And that helps to secure additional funding to continue the redevelopment. So they’re plans ahead, it’s, you know, we’re it, you know economic, environmental, sustainably um designed plans that really make this a destination. And so there are ideas for a waterfront and entertainment complex, a rooftop pool. I want to live here. Food hall, an urban farm. I want to live here. Sage. I’m going to find you online. Um. And so it’s from poli– these volunteers and the help of a landscape architect, Aaron Chang, who were instrumental in both moving the city and national efforts forward. So this I just wanted to bring this because one again, I love New Orleans, but just what this sort of community deciding what was important, what deserve what deserved and needed to be restored and then doing it so thoughtfully. Sign me up. So that’s my news.
DeRay Mckesson: So the article De’Ara, that you put in linked to a study from the Land Trust um and the study is fascinating for a lot of reasons. One is that they note that people of color are less likely than their white counterparts to live close to parks with properly functioning amenities or just close to, you know, in what our own experience knows is like close to, you know, beaches da da da is that, you know, it’s often most the most expensive land near the water and da da da. So I even think about like in New York City there’s public housing in Chelsea really close to the water and da da da. But the to rent around there to buy around there is very expensive. But what the land trust also highlighted that I thought was fascinating and I did not know were a couple stats. So they note that parks in majority nonwhite neighborhoods are half as large and served nearly five times more people than parks in majority white neighborhoods. They also note that parks serving majority low income households are on average four times smaller and serve nearly four times more people than parks that serve majority high income neighborhoods. You know, when we say it’s everything is about race, we are right. And to give you a sense of the acreage, um when they say that parks that serve majority nonwhite populations are on average half as large, it is 45 acres compared to 87 acres in majority white neighborhoods. So I bring this up because the disparities around access to outdoors and you know, third spaces and play time with your kids and all of that, always informed by race.
De’Ara Balenger: In a layer to that, thinking about parks and thinking about Central Park and how Black people were displaced so that Central Park can exist. And I feel like we would find so many more–
Myles E. Johnson: –settings.
De’Ara Balenger: –cases of like that.
Myles E. Johnson: Seneca village. [?]
De’Ara Balenger: Sen– yes, village. Mmm hmm.
Myles E. Johnson: Yeah. Um. Is like that, too. You know, my my heart sings for this specifically because it’s around water and Black people. And just when I get into my really just spiritual bag just there’s so much healing to me uh to be done with when it comes to Black people and part of water. So that makes me really happy and how grateful, you know, I couldn’t help but be a little narcissistic when I was um listening to you speak, because that was I was I was living literally like on top of Prospect Park, like just right there. And I remember just feeling so grateful to be there. And that was one of the main parks in Brooklyn that would have Black families, Brown families, immigrant families uh there having fun and and and celebrating. And it was just it was um it felt like one of those parks that did not have that segregation, class segregation, race segregation going on inside of it. You would literally see everybody there at that park. And I felt so um grateful to be there because that just isn’t the experience. Like I you know, you all know New York City real estate living across the street from any park. I don’t care if it’s if it’s a little plot of grass with a swing on it, they’re going to be like, okay, well, that’s going to be 15,000 [?] how do you want it? So I felt so um grateful for for being there. But I’m I’m so happy about this project and more happy about experiencing it. You know, we need a Pod Save the Pod Save Pod Save the Cruise? Pod Save the trip. Pod Save the vacation. [laughter] Pod Save the party. What?
De’Ara Balenger: I know. That’s right. I can’t wait. I cannot wait.
Myles E. Johnson: Well, let’s keep the party going so I want to this is this is this is really specific for my Black folks listening. I want you all to know that when I’m recording this and it’s still September because it’s important, because this is a Earth, Wind, and Fire news that I got from [?]. And we know Earth, Wind, and Fire is their landmark uh paramount song is September. And I want people to know that the spirit you’re hearing this in is in alignment with with Black cultural what’s Black and culturally right. So Questlove is doing a documentary. Y’all. Okay. So I’ve been writing for a very long time. And my first, first very first column was with Okay Player, which is owned by Questlove. And, you know, I write and I’m a little frank when I write too, and I wrote something about Questlove and the Roots because I love Questlove and the Roots and about them being on Jimmy Kimmel during the Trump. So any who, Questlove says something to me on the Internet. And and basically the uh puts the Black thoughts freestyle [laugh] to me like ats my name and puts Black thoughts free style because I was critiquing them being like apolitical during that time. So Black thought had put it did a did a freestyle maybe 48 hours later and he tagged me. So I say all this to say is. I don’t know where my standing is with my old employer, but I really love what Questlove has been doing. And the last time I talked about Questlove, somebody like emailed me about that moment. And I just wanted to say here that I love everything Questlove is doing. I’ve always been a fan. And um as you know, Questlove just did the summer well not just did, but a couple of years ago, did the Summer of Soul, which was something that most people did not know about um when it comes to the Black answer to Woodstock, happened in the same year, and he’s kind of doing the same thing with Earth, Wind, and Fire. Um Earth, Wind, and Fire is an extremely popular Black band. But there is so much to get into when it, of course, comes to their musicality. And I think there’s also a lot to get into, specifically with Maurice White and how he positioned himself and his work and his music as also a spiritual work. So if you my favorite one of my favorite um Earth, Wind and Fire songs is Fantasy. If you break open Fantasy and read those lyrics, there’s not been more psychedelic lyrics. There’s not been more spiritually based lyrics. And I think when it comes to specifically Earth, Wind and Fire, their existence as new age before the new age, Black people, you can’t really get to a D’Angelo’s Voodoo, an Erykah Badu’s Baduizm, you can’t get these Black people who have been um popular by showing different modalities of spirituality and belief that are outside of conservative Christian without Earth, Wind and Fire not only doing it, but also making some of the you know, it’s it’s high level, beautiful, family friendly soul music that’s still baked was still baked in with these esoteric ideas. And I have so many Earth, Wind, and Fire album covers. If you look at anything, you’re going to see guys that are not Jesus. You’re going to see [laugh] you’re going to see. You’re going to see um uh words that have nothing to do with the Bible. You’re going to see a lot of different things. So I really hope that that is teased out in this as well as some background story, because even as I think about um Frankie Beverly and him and and um and Bill Withers there and Teddy Pendergrass and Donny Hathaway have been away from us for a for a minute now. But when I think about that era of soul music and that era of Black men in the public space, I do not see that anymore. I can maybe name like a one max, well like it’s just if I can name it, that means there’s not enough of it. You know, it should just be oh I can’t even name it how many, just like I can’t really even name how many little tie dye tattoo face felons there are making rap songs. It should really be the same thing about [laugh] about this too. And so I just love that Questlove is um doing some preservation around the legacy of Earth, Wind, and Fire, and I’m glad that it’s him, because now that we’re in the documentary Netflix complex, we’ll just fall into it. You know, there’s a lot of documentaries that I’ve seen lately that I don’t want to name, but you can guess. That have just been really poorly made. And they’ve been around our icons and they haven’t been honest and they haven’t been robust and they haven’t been interesting. And I think they’ve been insulting to those people’s legacies. But it’s obvious that they were being made so they can make a quick coin. And when it comes to Questlove, I know that he’s going to truly create something that can go into the colleges, can go into the history books. That can be a pedagogical moment for people when it comes to Black culture and Black music. So I’m so excited about this. I wanted to bring it to the pod. I think we should have um we should go to Louisiana, get this on a big screen and watch this, and we should do it at the beach. We should do that. We should do that. We should do that. Um. So, yeah, I wanted to bring this to the podcast and I also wanted to know I want to get closer to y’all so I want to know everybody’s favorite Earth, Wind, and Fire song too.
De’Ara Balenger: Oh man.
Myles E. Johnson: What, what’s–
De’Ara Balenger: I have so–
Myles E. Johnson: Yeah.
De’Ara Balenger: I have so many. Um. I think for me, Sing a Song for sure. Reasons.
Myles E. Johnson: Okay.
De’Ara Balenger: That’s one of my dad’s favorites. The reasons, um–
Myles E. Johnson: Okay.
De’Ara Balenger: Let’s groove. That’s another one. Septem, you know, September’s a classic, but I just saw Earth, Wind, and Fire, speaking of New Orleans at Jazz Fest last year, and they were spectacular.
Myles E. Johnson: Okay.
De’Ara Balenger: And just to show you, you know, not that I’m trying to keep score. To show you how Black my family is. My mom had saw them coming off of she was on Tom Joyner’s cruise and saw Earth, Wind, and Fire and then came straight to Jazz Fest and then was like, oh I know exactly what they gonna play. So they did the same set. And she knew song to song to song. Um. Joy.
Myles E. Johnson: That’s a wild Black run. [laughter] When you said Tom Joyner, I said, oh. [clapping] Oh 100 points off of that name alone.
De’Ara Balenger: That’s what we’re doing over here in southeast D.C. So thank you, Myles, for bringing this. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Um. I think especially like thinking of and still processing and healing from Frankie Beverly Amaze. I think it’s it’s just um makes my heart warm to know that um we have icons like this within our community that do sort of, you know, they they transform us. And, Myles, I think you’re really on to the spiritual part of it. And since my dad’s passed, it’s been it was a year yesterday I’ve been listening to so much, so much Marvin Gaye, Earth Wind, and Fire, like The Delfonics. And it’s just like the spiritual in these in in these songs. And the intention and the care in these songs is so it’s so healing. It really, really is.
Myles E. Johnson: Healing.
De’Ara Balenger: And it makes sense. Exactly. Yes. So I mean, it makes sense why we are then why we are drawn to artists like Erykah Badu and others because they are so they’re just in this legacy. Um. So thank you for bringing this. Yes. And we do need to have a screening on the beach in New Orleans and Earth, Wind, & Fire should come and play.
DeRay Mckesson: Woop woop. The only thing I’ll add is um my my father raised us. And, you know, he was funny in a lot of ways. But one of the things that he did is that I didn’t know all music wasn’t oldies until I was a little older because all he played was oldies. So when TeRay started listening to the Dixie Chicks and Lauryn Hill, and that was literally my first introduction to music, that was not the Delfonics. It wasn’t, you remember [starts singing] Gloria, Oh Gloria.
Myles E. Johnson: Oh by Enchantment. [banter]
De’Ara Balenger: Yes.
DeRay Mckesson: I, I could, Gloria is the jam.
Myles E. Johnson: That is it.
DeRay Mckesson: I like that was always my favorite. That was my favorite song and you know, my father was in love with Minnie Riperton. He you know, when we were kids, he talked about climbing up a tree and crying when Minnie died and so that was all the music that I knew. So when I hear Reasons [?] like that is that is literally what I was raised on because he um he only played oldies until TeRay got old enough to buy cassette tapes on her own. So shout out to Earth, Wind, and Fire. [music break]
[AD BREAK]
DeRay Mckesson: Well, that’s it. Thanks so much for tuning in to Pod Save the People this week. Don’t forget to follow us at Crooked Media on Instagram, Twitter, and TikTok. And if you enjoyed this episode of Pod Save the People consider dropping us a review on your favorite podcast app. And we’ll see you next week. Pod Save the People is a production of Crooked Media, it’s produced by AJ Moultrié and mixed by Vasilis Fotopoulos. Executive produced by me and special thanks to our weekly contributors Kaya Henderson, De’Ara Balenger, and Myles E. Johnson.
