Ira, Louis, and a returning Aida discuss Janelle Monae coming out as non-binary and other genderqueer celebs, Jerrod Carmichael’s comedy special Rothaniel, Elon Musk buying Twitter, hot takes on Steve Martin’s old SNL skits, and the new season of Selling Sunset. Plus, Kiernan Shipka joins to discuss her new Roku series Swimming with Sharks, her Mad Men memories, and more.

 

TRANSCRIPT

 

 

Speaker 1 [AD]

 

Ira Madison III: And we are back with an all new episode of Keep It. I’m Ira Madison III.

 

Louis Virtel: I’m Louis Virtel. And when you said we are back this time, you actually meant it.

 

Ira Madison III: I’m meant. I meant we.

 

Aida Osman: Because I’m here. Gayle King fresh off my Meg Thee Stallion interview. Still shaking. Hello. Back at five. Hi, guys. It’s me, Aida. I’m here. Hello. I missed you so dearly, and I’m happy to talk shit again.

 

Ira Madison III: I’m so excited that you are back, if only because of the DMS I get from people who are like, no, they’re not wondering where you are anymore. They want to replace you.

 

Aida Osman: I know. They’re like, Girl, we need somebody. We need somebody there. At the very least, some  consistency. It’s like when Mama keep bringing new boyfriends around and it’s like, I don’t care which one. I just want a father.

 

Ira Madison III: Don’t drag my Scorpio mother like that.

 

Louis Virtel: Since you just brought up Gayle King. What I think of Gayle King still. Years ago, I friended music mogul David Geffen on Facebook just to see if I could. And then he accepted, which is already mindblowing. And then I was like, Well, it must not be him. And then the first thing I see is a picture he’s posted from his yacht in like Vanuatu or wherever he lives on that giant boat. And he has his friends on the boat that day are Paul McCartney and whoever his wife is at the time. Oprah and Gayle, which I did not know, they went on like yachts together. Anyway, it’s always on my mind and then like a couple of other famous people, but just. Wow. Gayle on Oprah, really staycation together.

 

Aida Osman: See this is the private lesbian relationship I want to hear about. This is the memoir I need.

 

Louis Virtel: Yeah.

 

Aida Osman: This is the Whitney Houston girlfriend secret girlfriend story I want to hear about.

 

Ira Madison III: So this is this has brought up three things for me. One, Louis, I would completely expect you to be a David Geffen yacht gay. Wouldn’t shock me.

 

Louis Virtel: Does it not fit me?

 

Ira Madison III: Wouldn’t shock me if I saw you in the background of a photo.

 

Louis Virtel: No. But by the way, how many fucking schooners have I been on? Zero. No invitations.

 

Ira Madison III: Two, that Facebook story reminds me of I ever even mentioned it on here. One time I think it was with like Mariah was working with, like Billy Eichner doing like shit with him. I like commented on a thing and like Billy like responded to me because we’re friends with Billy. And then Mariah followed me on Instagram. Mariah Carey followed me on Instagram, must have realized her error, because when I went to her page, she was no longer following me.

 

Louis Virtel: Oh, wow.

 

Ira Madison III: But you could still see the notification. Like on the page.

 

Louis Virtel: Right right.

 

Ira Madison III: Like Mariah Carey has followed you. So I did screenshot that. That that is that is even better than being followed by Mariah Carey. Mariah Carey accidentally following you on Instagram. And then being like “Who is this nigga?

 

Louis Virtel: Right. And then. And instilling fear in Mariah Carey. I believe you did. She backed away from that mistake faster than Loverboy.

 

Aida Osman: Wait pause. I do want to say so if you’re a yacht with David Geffen gay and what like what’s your what are you, Ira? Because I would say I’m like a catamaran with Wanda Sykes, gay.

 

Ira Madison III: Um.

 

Aida Osman: So what are you?

 

Ira Madison III: We’re going to talk about Janelle Monae and genderqueer celebs, you know, today. And I think.

 

Aida Osman: I missed these segues. I missed your segues babygirl.

 

Ira Madison III: I’m like, I like I feel like said maybe it doesn’t count since I like, actually have been there, you know? But like, I feel like I’m a Kiki at Janelle Monae’s like house like in the hills gay, you know, like a black queer celeb. You know?

 

Aida Osman: On land though. Very much so on land.

 

Ira Madison III: One without a vendetta against me, like, Karamo [Brown]. So.

 

Aida Osman: Gotchu gotchu okay. I love that.

 

Louis Virtel:  Who apparently has a talk show that just sold in, like 90% of the U.S. or something.

 

Ira Madison III: Good for her. Um.

 

Aida Osman: Well hey you know, Janelle has a pool, you know Janelle has that pool. I did come at the very end of that. Every day people party, I did sneak my lil way in.

 

Ira Madison III: Well, that’s the party I missed you at, bitch. Always missing in my life is your theme.

 

Aida Osman: The only time I was ever outside.

 

Ira Madison III: The only time Aida was ever outside was I was she was like, Wait, you left already? I was like, You know what? I had a birthday party to go to.

 

Aida Osman: Yet another plane, another bus. Another thing another thing.

 

Ira Madison III: My third comment was just going to be that. Has Gayle replaced Oprah?

 

Aida Osman: Who’s Oprah?

 

Ira Madison III: The Megan Thee Stallion interview right?

 

Louis Virtel: Oh.

 

Ira Madison III: Like the Megan Thee Stallion interview with Gayle. I feel like I was recently talking with people about Wendy Williams and sort of like her place in culture, and we don’t really talk about her and Oprah in like the same breath, even though they sort of like are running like like the daytime game for like black women. Right. But like, I think it’s because Oprah only now does like, Harry and Meghan. You know, like I think like it’s Gayle, the one who like people go to for that chat because I feel like Megan Thee Stallion would have been on Oprah back in the day.

 

Aida Osman: I feel like Gayle has assumed the position of doing the like kind of hard hitting revelatory interviews, like the one that we I mean, my first time really clocking her as that position as a more journalistic expression was with R. Kelly.

 

Ira Madison III: R.Kelly! Robert.

 

Louis Virtel: Robert.

 

Ira Madison III: Robert.

 

Louis Virtel: Robert. Robert.

 

Aida Osman: Something shifted in that moment, I think Oprah has kind of gone into her spiritual little bag where it’s more so “Meg, how do you feel about getting shot in the foot?” And Gayle’s like, “Girl, what happened?” You know?

 

Louis Virtel: Also, I just want to say, Ira, you did a brief Oprah impression right there. And it sounded to me like Deborah Wilson’s impression of Oprah, which I miss desperately. I think we needed again, Deborah Wilson, come back to us.

 

Ira Madison III: We have so much to get to in this episode. And Ms. Aida is back, but. also.

 

Aida Osman: Yes

 

Ira Madison III: Back for the last time.

 

Aida Osman: Back, for the, technically.

 

Ira Madison III: Technically, last time.

 

Aida Osman: Technically the last time. This is like the formal. We’re wrapping it up. So you guys understand that I’ve been doing a bunch of other things and I’m first of all, I love you guys so much.

 

Ira Madison III: Everything. You are booked and busy. When people when people try to act like where’s she at I’m like, do you not see that she’s on set?

 

Aida Osman: Yeah ya’ll know, y’all know where I’m at. And I think but you know, I was reflecting on this as without crying as much as I could. Ah the little cancer girl. I owe everything that’s happening in my career to Keep It. And to the things that you we’ve talked about.

 

Ira Madison III: Don’t say that.

 

Aida Osman: No, listen girl, listen let me make my lil argument, okay? Let me get through it. But I have a proof. I have a whole proof I’ve done because the only reason I even started working at Big Mouth and started writing for television shows was because comedians saw me going up in Los Angeles. The only reason I was in Los Angeles was to be working at Keep It to work at Crooked. So I do think it was the it was an inception point for me of learning that I could be an entertainer in all different types of ways. And it was very fulfilling. Very fulfilling. I. Everything that we’ve done, I. I. Just let me.

 

Ira Madison III: Oh.

 

Louis Virtel: Oh, this girl.

 

Aida Osman: Every interview has been like an opportunity to connect with some of my favorite people in Hollywood. It’s been a chance to meet with life changing women. I. Like my our interviews with Gabrielle Union and Drew Dixon have been pivotal for me in understanding who I am as a person, as a black woman, as a non-binary person and in the industry. So, girl, I met Issa Rae on this podcast.

 

Louis Virtel: True. You know what yeah.

 

Aida Osman: How can I say that I don’t owe every aspect of it.

 

Ira Madison III: To be fair. To be fair her camera was off.

 

Aida Osman: Yeah. She met me. She met me on this podcast.

 

Ira Madison III: She was wedding. She was wedding planning. She was wedding planning that day already probably. Trying on dresses, trying on dresses while zooming with us.

 

Aida Osman: That’s, from what I’ve learned about her, she is the person to do 15 things at once. So that’s probably accurate.

 

Louis Virtel: Well I really appreciate that if you gave a mouse a cookie trail back to Keep It that you gave us, but also, I mean, Jesus Christ, like Ira and I always talk about this like we knew,  the minute you came on, we knew we were going to blow up and do 55,000 other things. So the fact that it’s happening now, it’s like, well, if it wasn’t now, is it going to be a month from now or two years ago or whenever it’s happening now and we couldn’t be more thrilled for you.

 

Ira Madison III: I’m so proud of you.

 

Aida Osman: Yeah. Yeah. And I want everyone to. Thank you so. I want everyone in the audience to know, too, that this is purely just scheduling issues. If I could be here every single week, I would be here. But learning how to balance acting and writing and, you know, potentially producing and working on projects like that. It’s been it’s been so difficult, especially at my young, dumb age. So I’m learning I’m learning how to be a person. I’m learning how to keep existing in this career. And I thank you guys for giving me that space and still holding me dear in your hearts.

 

Ira Madison III: Of course. You know, and.

 

Louis Virtel: Keep It going. There you are.

 

Ira Madison III: And of course, you know, we’ll have you back whenever you are free when you have to promote Rap Shit.

 

Aida Osman: Not an interview. Not an interview with the girls.

 

Ira Madison III: The interview. Okay. Thee interview.

 

Louis Virtel: Oh, wow. I’m so excited for that. We’ll see who’s Gayle King now. Yeah.

 

Louis Virtel: Exactly. Exactly.

 

Ira Madison III: I mean, listen, Louis doesn’t know I’m going to make him interview me when my book comes out. I will be the guest.

 

Aida Osman: I can’t wait. Maybe I’ll have to come back for that one.

 

Louis Virtel: I might be out of the country that I might be. I might be dead that day.

 

Aida Osman: Gravely ill. I can’t wait for your book to come out too

 

Ira Madison III: Don’t make me just host a show like I’m Marc Maron.

 

Louis Virtel: Right? Or like interview yourself a la Joe Calderon and Lady Gaga. Yeah, mmhmm

 

Aida Osman: Is giving Donald Glover in the recent interview piece.

 

Louis Virtel: Oh, yes. Wait I was just I couldn’t think of who it was. It was him yeah.

 

Aida Osman: That’s a Ira moment, for sure. That sheparding

 

Ira Madison III: Are you are you afraid are you afraid of black women, Ira? Well, I’m afraid of my mother. She used to own a gun. So maybe I’m afraid of black women.

 

Louis Virtel: I do think I’m Afraid of My Mother would be an amazing film noir. So

 

Aida Osman: I’m afraid of my mother?

 

Louis Virtel: Yeah.

 

Aida Osman: Yeah.

 

Louis Virtel: All shadows.

 

Ira Madison III: All right, all right. I’ll get to work on that.

 

Aida Osman: Casey Lemmons need a new movie, anywhoo and. And also, I was so I didn’t realize I took it for granted at the time. But. But, you know, with Rap Shit occupying a lot of my time last year and even now the Keep It was the only reason I could actually process and meditate on what the fuck was going on around us. Like it had become this place for me to make jokes and stay abreast and a breast haha. Okay. And you know really just talk to very, very smart people. The two of you are so intelligent and that is namely why people come back and keep listening and you’re so funny. And I learned so much from the two of you and I know we’ll continue to keep learning. So, again, thank you. Thank you. Thank you. And don’t expect me to be funny anymore. I’m a serious actress now.

 

Louis Virtel: Yes, I. Here comes Marion Cotillard.

 

Aida Osman: Yeah, yeah, yeah. And. Oh, and you know, what was also interesting, too, was I saw recently and listen to the podcast where you guys had Judith Light on and Sheryl Lee Ralph and I just had gotten back from filming a movie with the two of them. And when I tell you I’ve met, it’s like the hyperbolic time chamber of information I learned from this one moment with Sheryl Lee Ralph. I became a f. I’m a sound woman. Now.

 

Louis Virtel: No. The full circle moment we had was Judith Light recommended the work of some author, I think. And then seconds later Ira, and I realized, oh, you were working with that woman. So it was like, it was like you had jumped the times the Keep It time space continuum into pop culture.

 

Aida Osman: Absolutely wild guys. I feel often like a weird fly on the wall that is critiquing and learning, but also trying to do the thing that I’ve been saying that, you know, Zendaya can’t do that well for so long. Like, now I’m trying to figure it out. And I’m like, Damn, I was wrong. I was wrong. It was safer for me to be offset. And it’s just, it’s, it’s very actualizing and it’s been hard and I’m excited to keep learning and keep growing. It’s it’s strange to have seen Kiersey Clemons in 2015 in the Dope movie and go, Wow, you can be a feminine woman and look like that. And then in 2022, I’m in a film with her and I play her best friend and I get to have those conversations with her about how to comport yourself as a young black woman on sets and as a number one or even as a number five or whatever your position is on the call sheet. So it was cool. Guys, it’s really cool. I’m living life and I’m very happy right now.

 

Ira Madison III: I love it. If this is E.R., your you’re our George Clooney.

 

Aida Osman: Awww. Don’t do that

 

Louis Virtel: That’s true. Yeah.

 

Ira Madison III: Yeah.

 

Louis Virtel: I’m I’m Sherri Stringfield over here. Jesus Christ. Can someone get me? I’m still dealing with my sister, Chloe.

 

Ira Madison III: I just hope I’m Julianna Margulies. I mean, can’t you can’t you can’t you can’t you see me in a long running beef with someone on a network TV drama. And then we don’t even shoot our final scene together.

 

Louis Virtel: Yeah.

 

Ira Madison III: That’s my journey.

 

Louis Virtel: That really is among the most unparalleled pop culture moments. I just. I cannot think of anything else like that, that. Anyway, we can unpack that another day. Love Julianna, of course, and her many SAG awards.

 

Ira Madison III: I mean, if we were Hollywood Unlocked, if we were Jason Lee, we would have asked her about it.

 

Louis Virtel: Right? Dammnit. We sucked.

 

Ira Madison III: Alright. Well, let’s get to this episode.

 

Aida Osman: Yes.

 

Ira Madison III: We’re going to get into, like I said, Janelle Monet, the genderqueer celebs of our time. We’re going to get into us being an Elon Musk America.

 

Aida Osman: Welcome. It’s hell here.

 

Ira Madison III: And I have Selling Sunset opinions.

 

Aida Osman: Our favorite white people.

 

Ira Madison III: And Louis is going to talk about some shit from the seventies, as usual.

 

Louis Virtel: That’s where I live.

 

Aida Osman: Gangs are here.

 

Ira Madison III: And not just us. We will also be joined today by Ms. Sally Draper herself. Ms. Sabrina Spellman, the one and only Kiernan Shipka is on Keep It this week. So we will be right back with more of the show.

 

Ira Madison III: In the season five premiere of Facebook Watch’s Red Table Talk, Grammy nominated singer and actor Janelle Monae stopped by to chat with host Jada Pinkett Smith, Willow Smith, and friend of Keep It, Gammy during their chat.

 

Aida Osman: Yes, friend of us. Personally.

 

Ira Madison III: I still have Gammy blocked from my Instagram stories. Do you?

 

Aida Osman: You have to. Gammy don’t Gammy don’t need to see what I be posting about, but I still want that connection. I want that motherly figure in my life.

 

Ira Madison III: Surprisingly, during the chat they did not talk about the Oscars, so we’re still waiting for that. We’re still waiting for that Red Table Talk episode. But in this one, Janelle Monae said that they now identify as non-binary the official quote, I’m non-binary, so I don’t see myself as a woman solely. I feel all of my energy. I feel like God is so much bigger than he or the she and I. And if I am from God, I am everything. But I will always stand with women. I will always stand with black women. I just see everything that I am beyond the binary. And so I believe Janelle Monae now goes as they slash she. I have always considered Janelle Monae to be an actual computer. So.

 

Louis Virtel: No. I would say do those not sound like just lyrics to Janelle Monae song like straight in row? It could be that’s like is that Django Jane. I don’t know.

 

Aida Osman: Is that an Octavia Butler essay that she just read to us? I think what was funny about this was girl we knew, girl we knew from the moment you stomped out in 2010, dressed like a stylish penguin, ok. In that tightrope video. You chose Big Boi as a feature we knew you wasn’t with the girls exclusively.

 

Louis Virtel: No, she’s she’s very a combination of Bugs Bunny in a suit and Bugs Bunny dressed as a woman.

 

Louis Virtel: That’s her whole range of fashion. Yeah.

 

Aida Osman: Period. But I’m so happy that she verbalized it and gave it to us. And then also is using pronouns that are non-binary, leaning, which of course there’s no, like inherent worth to being like I’m she/ they but it’s even pivotal that she comes out as they/ she, you know.

 

Louis Virtel: There’s something about coming out as non binary now that reminds me of the old days of coming out as just gay, which is to say I almost I’m not afraid for them, but it’s like, it’s like you almost have to explain yourself to people in a way that you once had to do. And like the early like, what does it mean that you’re gay? Who do you hang out with? Like you do have disease whatever. And now non binary is let me read you the dictionary definition of what non-binary is so that you understand what it is I’m doing, who I am, whatever.

 

Aida Osman: And something she probably also had to do in 2018 when she came out as pansexual. And I felt that way coming out because for those of us who felt outside of the binary, we always were like, There’s this nagging lack of attachment to my gender. I don’t know how to address it, but I need somebody to give me the language for it. And once you hear non-bi the concept of being non-binary for the first time, it’s like, Oh, oh, that’s what this is, you know? But it does come with a certain set of like your friends hearing a new path. You have to explain what this means.

 

Ira Madison III: Baby, when Janelle came out as pansexual in 2018, I mean, I remember I remember everyone being in a state of flux. Aon Flux, if you will.

 

Louis Virtel: Director Karyn Kusama. Yeah.

 

Ira Madison III: Um. Because they were like, what is this word?

 

Louis Virtel: Right.

 

Aida Osman: My first introduction to the word pansexual was one of those like true life. I’m in love with my car, like something like that, where this man was like, Well, I’m pansexual. I like to have sex with my vehicle. And I was like, That’s. See that’s not me. That’s not me. I can’t be that and that.

 

Ira Madison III: Stephen. King actually got me into wanting to fuck my car. Christine. Christine is the most erotic film I’ve ever seen.

 

Aida Osman: And that’s fair. That’s your life. And I lift up your truth, Ira.

 

Ira Madison III: I actually want to say that people don’t fuck cars about their movies. Like remember The Counselor.

 

Aida Osman: Oh, girl.

 

Ira Madison III: Cameron Diaz. Just grinding her pussy on that windshield.

 

Aida Osman: Mm hmm.

 

Louis Virtel: And also, was there not a moment where we thought she would be nominated for an Oscar for The Counselor? It’s like, guys, let’s look back at the history of the Oscars. Do you see much car fucking in there? I don’t see Jessica Tandy on top of her Trans-Am or whatever.

 

Ira Madison III: Tthere’s a moment where The Counselor was going to be a good movie, too.

 

Louis Virtel: That’s true. That’s true. True enough.

 

Ira Madison III: And then it just turned in to be pussy on a hard body.

 

Aida Osman: But we’re here. It feels good. Like to have a dark skinned black person say that they’re they’re non-binary. Like it feels in a way that we as a people have kind of arrived because for what it’s worth, Sam Smith, Demi Lovato, you know, Amandla Stenberg. I’m so happy that they were the people that kind of paved it, paved the road in a public way. But it has never, for me at least equaled the amount of artistic work that Janelle has done, like living a non-binary lifestyle.

 

Ira Madison III: Yeah. I mean, that is that is the thing for me, too, you know, because whenever I hear a non-binary person discuss, you know, sort of like the fullness of, you know, like being themselves, you know, and like being able to just sort of be like. Like in this speech, you know, like, if God, you know, made me, then, you know, like, if God is so much bigger than he or she, you know, then like we’re everything, you know. And so then, you know, it honestly gets is get to that weird point where you start to feel like, well, damn should I be? But then I feel like I definitely don’t live to the full potential of my life. So maybe I never will be.

 

Louis Virtel: Mhm. Well grim. Yeah

 

Aida Osman: Ira. But you know what the fact that thats the state of your develoment right now.

 

Ira Madison III: I wake up and I just don’t want to do it all, okay? I don’t want to be everything.

 

Aida Osman: There’s. Yeah, maybe next lifetime. Maybe next life. Badu’s with you. Take your time with it. I’m interested in the shift that’s happening in culture where people are taking steps to radically free themselves. And what’s interesting, too, is that sometimes being non-binary isn’t necessarily like a identity decision as much as it could be like 80% a political one where you are rejecting the binary as a whole and you want to be that. You want to represent and exhibit that kind of transcendence. And I feel that coming through in Janelle Monae explanation of it, a girl was a computer. She half human, half computer. Like like you said, she’s been pushing this non-binary thing for a while.

 

Ira Madison III: Right? Like, she’s she she she came out like she came on this bitch, like, you know, like cyborg as hell. So.

 

Louis Virtel: Yeah.

 

Ira Madison III: The arch android, I mean, you know, and Jane, like, all the computer shit from the beginning, you know?

 

Aida Osman: MhhmHmm.

 

Louis Virtel: In fact, no. I think she’s going to pull a Grace Jones soon. And in her songs, she will actually identify as a sexual car, warm, leatherette, pull up to the bumper, etc. That fits for her. There’s another car song that she did. It comes up frequently in her work anyway.

 

Ira Madison III: Mm hmm.

 

Louis Virtel: Now wait. Speaking of. This isn’t .This isn’t about non binary black celebs.

 

Aida Osman: Fuck em. Yeah, fuck em.

 

Louis Virtel: But did you see.. Okay. Good. Did you see Rothaniel by Jerrod Carmichael, the stand up special, where he comes out and sort of just sits in it like it’s not about and here are the conclusions I came to. It’s I haven’t come to the conclusions yet. I was wondering what you guys thought of it.

 

Ira Madison III: Well, to be fair, he was sitting during the entire thing so he could do nothing but sit in it.

 

Louis Virtel: A sit down comedy.

 

Ira Madison III: Yeah.

 

Louis Virtel: Yeah.

 

Aida Osman: That’s how you know you’re getting some from. Well, watching the special was really relieving for me because I did run into Jerrod at a party a couple of years ago and I tried to hit on him and I was met with zero response except for “I like your shirt” and I should have known at that moment because I was wearing an Aliyah shirt. I should have known right there that boy wasn’t swinging on my side.

 

Louis Virtel: You weren’t You weren’t rocking that boat. If you will.

 

Ira Madison III: You don’t live in L.A. if you don’t have a friend who had matched with Jerrod Carmichael on Raya in the past few years. Okay. Like like. The girls knew.

 

Louis Virtel: Right.

 

Ira Madison III: The girls knew. And it’s it’s it’s it’s weird, right? Because I feel like growing up when you would sort of like, quote unquote know a celebrity is gay, right? It was always just sort of like that whisper network. And then there’s the weird disconnect of being in L.A. and, like, sort of knowing that someone was gay, but, like, not actually knowing if, like, they’ve ever come out in their, like, public sphere. So you just don’t talk about it.

 

Aida Osman: Mm hmm.

 

Louis Virtel: Right. And it’s this understood thing, like, oh, I get access to that because I occasionally go to that bar where he would be. But, you know, I guess some of those people then run around and tell something like du moi. But.

 

Aida Osman: Yeah.

 

Louis Virtel: You know, the rest of us, you know, dignified boulevardiers of the world, we kept it to ourselves.

 

Ira Madison III: I loved the special. I thought it was I thought it was beautiful. I thought it was so funny. I will say, though, it is intriguing that he is sort of one of the only people who could do this, and that is because he is a black man. I don’t think that any one else could really. Use a comedy special to come out like that and have it be a thing. Because I feel like, first of all, if you’re a cis man and you are a comedian, like so much of comedy and like the response to it now with a lot of queer comedians, you know, and female comedians is sort of like this response to what’s been sort of like a cis, heteronormative, comedic space for so long. And I feel like if the white man were like, I’m coming out as gay, but it had like this sort of history, like, like a John Mulaney, right? If John Mulaney came out as gay now, people would be sort of like, excuse me? Or they’d feel some type of way about it, you know, with sort of like, why weren’t you telling us? Like you’ve had a whole TV show where you were straight, you know, you’ve had so many comedy specials, etc., right? I feel like part of the impact of this is still couched in people’s perception that it is harder to be Black and gay within the black community. Do you get that Aida?

 

Aida Osman: I think I think I totally understand what you’re saying. I do think, though, too, like your John Mulaney thing, that it wouldn’t it would be part that, like, why didn’t you tell us before? I wish that you had been at that stage in your life, but also it would just feel like self masturbatory. I don’t know why.

 

Ira Madison III: Yes. It would feel sort of self masturbatory, but for for this, for Jerrod, I feel like maybe it’s just also the way people were responding to it. I felt like a lot of the responses were a lot of like, Oh, we’re glad that this Black person, you know, can overcome like the homophobia, like within his community and family to be able to come out.

 

Aida Osman: And to the untrained eye. To the untrained eye, like Gerard is a masked presenting, straight presenting person. So for him to do it for me, I think the people like that. Of course, Lil Nas X has done his work, but people like that, i,t I that’s when I think again like with Janelle Monae like we’ve arrived, we’ve gotten to the place where I feel like there’s a level of equilibrium and equality and anybody looking like anything can start to speak their truth. And I think what was beautiful about it too, was that in the special, like you were saying, Louis, he’s in a place of ambivalence about it. He’s in a place where it’s created turmoil in his family. It’s created turmoil with his mother. And now we get to kind of watch that unfold as he as he recreates his identity. And like the moment I knew, the moment I knew that this was really transformative for queer culture and for us was him hosting SNL. And you see, now he’s dressing himself differently. He’s presenting jokes differently.

 

Ira Madison III: He looked great. He looked great.

 

Aida Osman: He looked sexy as hell.

 

Ira Madison III: Baby the queer glow up is real.

 

Louis Virtel: Mm hmm.

 

Aida Osman: Yeah, but what’s beautiful is he is uncomfortable being comfortable. As somebody who’s been a diehard fan of Jerrod Carmichael for years now. He’s one of the main reasons I decided I wanted to do stand up. Like I saw this guy who was pensive and kind of, you know, apathetic but still cool and Black. And I was like, you know what? I see myself in this person and I could do this, too. And and so I do hold him very dear to me. Now.

 

Ira Madison III: It is a lot in the way that we grow up, you know, with like just sort of like how we’re conditioned and it is sort of like very freeing, like, see, you know, like celebrities sort of come out and sort of like explain their truth to us because I feel like, you know, that’s sort of how I felt as a kid, seeing celebs come out as gay, you know? And now this is a new thing where, you know, it’s like it’s helping younger people, definitely. But I feel like, you know, maybe it’s even helping people our age too try and figure out who they are.

 

Aida Osman: For sure.

 

Ira Madison III: What’s interesting, it’s like it’s not even the same thing, but it’s like I saw a fantastic standup show last night in New York. Alex Edelman’s show. Just For Us.

 

Aida Osman: I love Alex Edelmen.

 

Ira Madison III: I love Alex Edelman. He is so sweet and like, so fucking funny. And when I saw his show, his show is basically about the time that he went to sort of like a white supremacist meeting, you know, of like antisemites like to find out what it was about,.

 

Aida Osman: As one does.

 

Ira Madison III: Right, as one does. And him acknowledging the privilege of him being able to do that. It’s like it’s a white like presenting like a Jew Jewish person like who’s like white, you know. What was interesting too is like when he talks about like, you know, like being like religion and growing up and in this standup special, he’s like, you know, like in in like if a different religion or like a different time like maybe I’d identify as bisexual, you know, but it’s like but there’s a joke where he says like now, you know, identify as straight. But he’s like, I grew up in Boston, so I would identify as straight with a couple of secrets. Which is such a funny joke. But also like another thing in that realm of sort of like expressing fully like who you are as a person, but who’s able to do that based on their upbringing and what community they’re in.

 

Louis Virtel: I always say I think something about this special does particular and I think speaks to what you were saying about why only a black man could deliver it, is it is very specifically melancholy. And by that I mean like like I can’t think of another comedy special even like Mehmet. You come in and that’s a pretty raucous atmosphere, you know, like she’s going for broad jokes initially. But the vibe of this is very more sedate, like there’s jazz music playing. Bo Burnham directed it. It’s this very like kind of lush looking special, and it starts with some jokes that are mostly pop cultural, which is really how you could tell he’s gay because they were all like ending on. And this lady, which I understand, of course, but the fact that it then moved into a space of just I’m sitting here and I think the audience is mostly black and it turns into kind of a conversation between the two of them, too. And it made his coming out feel sort of like intramural. Like, you know, it’s like here I am just talking with other Black people, talking about my family, too. So it was interesting how he kind of couched the coming out in his upbringing and what to do with it now that he lives up and around these. People in, I guess, New York City. Mm hmm. Yeah, it was just. It was a one of a kind experience. But I will say, if you want to hear him be hilarious, I would recommend honestly rewatching the SNL monologue that I thought he nailed about Will Smith.

 

Ira Madison III: Its so fucking funny It was so fucking funny.

 

Louis Virtel: Right? And that was sort of the moment, too. Like, I almost feel bad in a way that, that that the comedy of that moment may disapate because it’s about just the Will Smith thing. So you might think, Oh, this is dated now or something. It’s still so funny.

 

Aida Osman: Yeah, it was funny. And he was like obligated to address that too. And I think he only had like 3 days to write that.

 

Ira Madison III: Be he made jokes about it at the end and it like was one of the best jokes ee’d heard about it too.

 

Aida Osman: Yeah.

 

Ira Madison III: You know, um, but I also do want to touch on the fact that Bo Burnham did direct this. And if there’s one person who does melancholy and like comedy well.

 

Louis Virtel: Oh yeah.

 

Ira Madison III: It is him. Because, I mean, like the last I think one of the last fucking specials I saw that like Rocky was like, Bo Burnham’s inside. Bo brought up, like, his pandemic comedy special.

 

Aida Osman: Yeah, yeah. Which again, I think too with Bo Burnham is Bo Burnham is helping to shift with the structure of a standup special can be and what the medium can give to audience members. And you know, I do still have some critiques of the special as a whole. I didn’t like the jokes, I didn’t like most of the jokes. I felt like they were. But this is not without intention. I do feel he was trying to make it like we’re in the living room with him and he’s just telling us a story about his life. But as somebody who appreciates, like pithy, sharp, clever writing, I didn’t receive that from Jerrod, which is kind of something I had been accustomed to as a listener from his first special Love at the Store and his HBO special Eight. Um I didn’t get that

 

Ira Madison III: Those are so funny. The SNL,.

 

Aida Osman: They are.

 

Ira Madison III: The SNL monologue is so funny. And it’s great that it came like the same weekend as Rothaniel, you know, because yeah, it wasn’t funny and it’s sort of, it’s, it’s funny how like when there were the critiques of like them that were, it’s like, oh, it wasn’t funny then it’s just getting into this like, you know, like misery porn at the end, you know, I’m like.

 

Aida Osman: Yeah.

 

Ira Madison III: It starts out with jokes like you called it raucous like a few minutes ago Louis. It was like it starts out with, like, the jokes and like pithy, like, like I’m doing stand up jokes, right? And there was a moment where it shifted from like the pop culture takes of the day to I just telling a story and it felt more like story time which or storytelling, which, you know, is a form of like, you know, like standup and comedy, but it didn’t feel like a comedy special.

 

Louis Virtel: I would also say to Aida’s point, I think what happens in the special is he basically sort of gives up on overly explaining himself and like because the audience starts interacting. And I actually think if he filled that with more material, it would have been more effective because I think we were supposed to sort of like stew in the like in the pensive ness. And I think we did that for maybe a few beats too long. That’s what I would say about that.

 

Aida Osman: Yeah. And I’m like very sensitive to kind of gratuitous looking off and looking at the camera and taking a little moment to pause.

 

Louis Virtel: Yeah, it was kind of performed earnestness eventually.

 

Ira Madison III: Yeah. It was a little self indulgent towards the end, which also made sense though with the direction because like as much as I loved inside, there were certain points at the end of like inside where I was sort of like Bo Burnham its actually time for you to wrap this up because I get.

 

Aida Osman: Yeah girl. Its over.

 

Ira Madison III: Like, like you’re like, I get it. You’re trapped in you’re trapped in your apartment. We all are.

 

Aida Osman: Me, too bitch. I’m a hermit, too. bitch.

 

Ira Madison III: Chop chop

 

Aida Osman: But, you know, as like someone like me, who I instead of like hating things, are being irritated by the performative nature. I’m going to try and make it about what it feels like to come out as a gay person.

 

Louis Virtel: Yeah.

 

Aida Osman: Like maybe those moments of forced earnestness is like me trying to get you to understand, like, how serious this feels, but isn’t how colloquial this needs to be for you to understand. That’s why I just make jokes like you’re sitting with me, and I just thought of them right now. Rather than have this feel like a packaged thing that I’m giving you, it’s just my truth. It’s my life.

 

Ira Madison III: Of course. I mean, and I think if anything, you know, like something like that from like a Black man too, you know, seeing that it’s just been, you know, but it felt very much needed, you know, it felt very much like something that I connected to. And it just sort of I don’t know, it makes me want to be more honest in your own, like, comedy and truth telling and stories, you know?

 

Aida Osman: Really? For me it makes me want to take it all back so I can have my own special coming out as nonbinary and pansexual. I fucked up. I gave it to the girls too quickly. Now I have nothing.

 

Ira Madison III: I’m like, let me burn somebody podcast episodes so I can, you know,.

 

Aida Osman: Please.

 

Ira Madison III: Come come out in this book, be a bit more truthful, be like, so can I can I go and can I go? A lot of actors have done that. Like, can I go back? Can I, can I, can I, can I shift to straight for a bit?

 

Aida Osman: It’s safe in that bed because it is cozy and dark and warm. Okay. I would like to use my last episode of Keep It to formally say I am no longer non-binary. Janelle Monae went in, I am coming out. The other way. Its one in, one out. Okay.

 

Louis Virtel: That’s the policy.

 

Aida Osman: Yeah. That’s how we keep it fresh.

 

Ira Madison III: Yes. You. You’re like, you know, none of that computer shit for you. You are a manila folder.

 

Aida Osman: Catch me in a couple of years. I’ll be Elliot Page-ing girl just wait. Just wait..

 

Ira Madison III: Oh. All right, when we are back Louis and I sit down with Kiernan Shipka to discuss her latest series, Swimming With Sharks and after that it’s Keep It.

 

[AD]

 

Ira Madison III: You’ll know her from Mad Men, the title role in Chilling Adventures of Sabrina and now as the star of Roku’s new series Swimming with Sharks. Please welcome Kiernan Shipka to Keep It.

 

Kiernan Shipka: Hello, Keep It.

 

Ira Madison III: Hiiiii. It’s so nice to have you here.

 

Kiernan Shipka: Hi. So good to be here. I’m so excited.

 

Louis Virtel: Unfortunately, I can never get enough of Hollywood as a horrible, wretched place of stories. So.

 

Kiernan Shipka: I know.

 

Louis Virtel: I signed, I logged on and the first words of the show are “in Hollywood.” I was like. Here we go.

 

Kiernan Shipka: In Hollywood!

 

Louis Virtel: Yes.

 

Kiernan Shipka: Let’s go. Let’s go. Let’s ride.

 

Louis Virtel: So, I mean, in the story, it occurred to me you are basically have been fully indoctrinated with Hollywood your entire life.

 

Kiernan Shipka: This is true.

 

Louis Virtel: And this story is about basically being acquainted for the first time with the horrors of how Hollywood works. So I was wondering, how much do you relate to this story and or do you at all?

 

Kiernan Shipka: I sort of was tapping into maybe the idea of Hollywood I had when I was six years old. And I got I got acquainted with with the town in a way that was quite gentle and nice. And obviously, I had a very lucky and wonderful experience. But I didn’t necessarily I didn’t relate to the to the character’s position in Hollywood, but I did sort of tap into, I think, that sort of there is an allure to Los Angeles and Hollywood that I feel kind of never goes away or dies. I don’t know. I’ve lived there for a very long time and I still find myself quite enchanted by it from from time to time. So. So it was it was like stepping into definitely very different shoes. But but I could really grasp sort of the idea of being intoxicated by by that town. And we filmed it in L.A., too, which was nice. It helped. It was nice that it wasn’t, you know, if I love a Vancouver moment, but it wouldn’t have been the same. It just wouldn’t have translated the same kind of way.

 

Ira Madison III: I truly love shows set in L.A. that are filmed elsewhere, because it’s truly the funniest phenomenon to me.

 

Kiernan Shipka: It’s really it’s really funny.

 

Ira Madison III: But speaking of intoxicating. Tell us everything there is to know about Diane Kruger.

 

Louis Virtel: Yeah, just list it off.

 

Kiernan Shipka: Guys, she’s so fun. It’s so funny because I’d never met a before and she was very good friends with January Jones and is very good friends with January Jones. So I felt like we had a point person which made it easier for me to sort of go in. The thing that made it very easy is that my character’s supposed to be in love and obsessed with her, so. And kind of watches her from afar. She is. She’s so chill. That’s the thing. I mean, just seeing her kind of order like a sweet green for lunch, it’s just effortless. Look, there’s certain things that she does that are just effortless. And she’s also just an ice queen in this, too. And she’s so but she’s very warm. She’s very warm and very sweet. We had a great time.

 

Louis Virtel: I’m getting vibes of. I remember Rooney Mara giving interviews about Cate Blanchett in Carol and she said It was my job to be in love with her. And it turns out that’s really easy to do. You know, it’s like. Mission accomplished. She’s amazing.

 

Kiernan Shipka: Fair enough. Yes. Yeah. My job was made so easy. The job was made so easy.

 

Ira Madison III: It’s funny you bring it up too, I mean, like her friendship with January Jones, and it’s like what I think about Mad Men, which was what a still is one of my favorite fucking TV shows. It’s so interesting thinking about just like that seven years of that shows on the air and then sort of like everyone’s lives after it and like. How have you. Have you been abused by I guess, like January has become like one of the best people on Instagram since Mad Men.

 

Kiernan Shipka: A legend. A legend.

 

Ira Madison III: And it’s like shocking to me that that just sort of like, shifted and happened at one point.

 

Kiernan Shipka: Well, the funny thing about Mad Men was that Instagram wasn’t really a thing until maybe the last season. People weren’t. That was a. That wasn’t sort of I mean, maybe I got Instagram in 2013, but it didn’t really feel like everyone was sort of on it. It wasn’t sort of a part of things and and that. And then January got it the last year I remember. And that’s when I mean, she really she became something something else in the culture after just because of I mean I think she’s so iconic on there its.

 

Ira Madison III: I mean, well, she’s so funny and sort of like acerbic online. And I’m just sort of like was she like sort of just always like that on set and what was it like? I just like playing her daughter and then growing up from being a kid to then being like a teenager, like working with her.

 

Kiernan Shipka: I always looked up to her. She was she was the my number one fashion icon growing up. I wanted to be Jan Jones. I, I would I would buy the ugg boots that she showed up to set. And I would I would idolize her. I would, I would every paparazzi photo that was ever taken, I would look I would dissect the outfit. I would I she was like, it was just so fun for me to watch her shop set every day. And she’s also so kind and so lovely. And then as we as I got older and our friendship became more mature, I just think she’s wonderful. But she was truly to me, icon, legend, my my idol.

 

Louis Virtel: You just put into perspective a moment I totally forgot about, which is around 2013, like I think I probably got Instagram around the same time too. I remember Jan Jones was the only celebrity I followed for a while. I was like, Oh shit, there’s a whole new part of herself on Instagram. Oh, she’s like very sarcastic or funnier, whatever. And I didn’t realize, like, Oh, this is really expanding people’s brands.

 

Kiernan Shipka: Well, yeah, because especially with something like Mad Men, the writing was obviously so excellent and it was such a it went on for such a long time. People really felt like we were our characters. I mean, I would walk around, I would I would be six, seven, eight and have people come up to me and be like, Your mom is horrible. Like, your dad is so hot. And I would just kind of I mean, you kind of just get used to it. But people really and people would scoff at you anywhere on the street. I mean, people would not be able to differentiate between our characters and ourselves. And I think that Instagram actually really helps in that sort of one way. Which, which is which is, which is a pro for sure.

 

Ira Madison III: I mean, I just what are sort of some like lasting memories or just sort of sort of what are your sort of takeaways, I guess, from being on a TV show where you essentially grew up on it? You know, it was sort of like your you’re like coming of age. Like if someone wrote a coming of age, movie or story about you, it’d be like you being on Mad Men.

 

Kiernan Shipka: Yeah, I think about it all the time. I think that I. I thought that maybe when I wrapped and time went on, I would think about it last, but I actually find myself thinking about it more because those were my formative years. And it’s very interesting playing someone from from the age of 6 to 15. I mean, all the massive so much massive stuff happens. And my character was she was doing everything before I was I mean, I got my TV period before my real period and first for a TV cause before the real. And so I felt actually like she was kind of a she’s kind of my my trial girl. I could I could I could sort of figure out life in a new sort of way. But it was yeah, it was like parallel growing up, which was, which was I guess it’s strange if I think about it now, but I knew no different and. The writing of the women on that show is so thoughtful. And and I think that my my character in every and and every woman on that show was written with such depth and complexity that it kind of gave me the hall pass to be a complex person in my own life. Like, I was never scared of being dynamic because I knew that that was possible and that’s what I grew up consuming. So if anything, I feel really lucky looking back because I, I just, I never really questioned myself and sort of in sort of that way I could, I could talk about it forever because it’s it’s my it’s my childhood, my experience. But honestly, it was so great. Everyone was fun. It was it was wonderful. Everyone was so talented. And I just it’s where I learned everything, really, that I that I know about acting.

 

Louis Virtel: I was all I was reacquainted recently with the fact that you played Betty Davis’ daughter on Feud, which was fabulous to watch. I find that to be such an underrated series period, not just because of like the dynamic in June and Joe and Betty, the ancillary characters were so good. I’m Jackie Hoffman. So good.

 

Kiernan Shipka: Oh, my god Jackie Hoffman!

 

Louis Virtel: Yeah.

 

Kiernan Shipka: Yes. Alfred Molina.

 

Louis Virtel: Alfred Molina is fabulous.

 

Kiernan Shipka: Amazing stuff in there.

 

Louis Virtel: Now, obviously, you had Mad Men before that. But I was wondering, was that still, I guess, an intimidating show because everybody on that show is a legend in some way.

 

Kiernan Shipka: Absolutely. It was a totally different ballgame. And also, when you’re when I felt it was it was maybe a year or two. It was probably two years after Mad Men wrapped in it. And it’s still a period piece. So I wanted to make sure the character I was playing wasn’t like Sally or didn’t feel like that, and it was something totally different. And I was playing a new a new age and a new kind of girl. But Susan Sarandon is the coolest and made me feel very safe and loved the entire time. And I yeah, again, I had out of ten experience, it was really fun. Such a big operation too. I mean, those, those shoot days were were long and it felt like they had so much time to shoot a couple of pages, which is just very, very much so a luxury.

 

Louis Virtel: Is that is that not like Mad Men?

 

Kiernan Shipka: Well, Mad Men was I think Mad Men we shot it was probably a little bit more moderate on that. But we had we had time. We didn’t have all the time in the world, but we didn’t have no time. It was, it was sort of somewhere in between.

 

Louis Virtel: Oh yeah.

 

Kiernan Shipka: Between an Indie between Sabrina and, and like a, an HBO show was probably Mad Men.

 

Ira Madison III: Mm. Well, speaking of Sabrina and you know, that entire like Riverdale Universe. What was it like playing, first of all, this iconic character and then like jumping over to do like a spot on Riverdale, too? Was it fun to, like, get back into the character?

 

Kiernan Shipka: It was so fun.

 

Ira Madison III: And also, like, had you any idea like, what the fuck happens on Riverdale before you even, like, stepped on set? Because I even try to explain Riverdale to people.

 

Kiernan Shipka: Well that’s the thing. A lot happens on Riverdale all the time. You have to really keep an ear to the streets to know what the latest and the greatest is. Because I dropped in and I needed I needed some updates I needed some updates. But Sabrina was great. It was so fun. I, I’ve never I got my 10000 hours and I worked so much and I feel like again, I learned so much about how I wanted to perform doing that, doing that show. It was like a playground and. Everyone was fun and I had fun. I loved that character and I felt like I feel like really, truly, I had time to find her voice, which made me very grateful because I love the voice that I found. And then hopping into Riverdale was so fun because I felt like I knew her and I’m going to go back again. I’m going to do it again. And I feel like it was almost like riding a bike when I got the Riverdale sides and I started saying them out loud, I kind of feel like, Whoa, I’m back in this. Back in this body. It was. It was sensory memory kind of stuff.

 

Ira Madison III: Mm hmm. I mean, you’ve done a lot of period stuff, too, and then you have, like, a lot of, like, horror shit, too, you know?

 

Kiernan Shipka: Yes, I do that.

 

Ira Madison III: But like what kind of stuff. What kind of stuff do you like to watch?

 

Kiernan Shipka: Oh, my gosh, guys, I’ve been watching a lot of movies lately. I like a like a drama. I like I mean, I Before Sunset, Before Midnight that kind of like painful, aching romance drama is sort of probably my favorite my favorite watch as of late that that energy, that kind of normal people-y

 

Ira Madison III: Yeah that is.

 

Kiernan Shipka: Painful romance is sort of sort of what I gravitate toward when I when I get emotionally moved by stuff.

 

Ira Madison III: That is still that is still like my cultural blindspot, by the way, the.

 

Kiernan Shipka: The Before movies?

 

Ira Madison III: The Before Trilogy.

 

Kiernan Shipka: Oh you gotta watch.

 

Ira Madison III: The Before Trilogies.

 

Kiernan Shipka: You gotta see it

 

Louis Virtel: It’s so watchable. Like they, like you put in one and by like it feels like seconds later you watched all three. And also, I mean, Ethan Hawke is fabulous. Julie Delpy in particular, like she is the one who really elevates it to this place of like I am talking to a sophisticated person who is taking me on a journey just by being herself.

 

Kiernan Shipka: It’s, it’s. They’re so good. They’re so good. Second. The second one is my favorite. I think.

 

Yes definitely. Also, I mean, God do we love an 81 minute movie or whatever it is and it just like ends.

 

Kiernan Shipka: Sign me up.

 

Louis Virtel: Yeah.

 

Kiernan Shipka: Let’s go. On to the next.

 

Louis Virtel: So beautifully shot too. Yeah.

 

Kiernan Shipka: Yeah. Gorgeous, cinematic European. You could watch it. You could watch it on your flight, Ira.

 

Ira Madison III: I said, Well, one of the main problem I’m going to have to actually download it, because one of the problems is every time I’ve been on a flight, they have like the second or third film in the trilogy. They never have the first.

 

Kiernan Shipka: Yeah, that’s, that’s a bummer.

 

Ira Madison III: And I feel like I can’t watch em at a different.

 

Kiernan Shipka: You don’t wanna hop in. No

 

Ira Madison III: Like watch em at a different. Yeah

 

Louis Virtel: You definitely do not. No no no.

 

Kiernan Shipka: Noooo. Watching those backwards.

 

Louis Virtel: Incorrect. Normal.

 

Kiernan Shipka: Sounds like a bad idea.

 

Louis Virtel: Normal people is also very good too. I have friends who obsessively watch that a few times.

 

Ira Madison III: I mean, I feel like you worked with so many just sort of like actresses like, like we said, who are sort of like giant, you know, to like what do you sort of what sort of like a takeaway you’ve learned from like working with people like Susan Sarandon and like what’s or Diane Kruger, like what you want to take into roles that you want to do or stuff you’re interested in.

 

Kiernan Shipka: Yeah, I think what I what I’ve observed with a lot of actors that I admire is that they aren’t afraid to kind of find the scene. And I think as someone who tends to be a perfectionist to a fault, I want to go in feeling like I’ve got it and. Being able to trust that you can get there and that almost makes it more rewarding and better is is something that I think about a lot lately. Like I see a lot of actresses say, hey, this isn’t this isn’t working. Let’s let’s figure this out. And I kind of have a fear. Sometimes I find that I have a fear of of doing that because I just want everything to to work. But what I’ve noticed is that when when people really care about something and when they want it to when they want to bring it to life, it’s it becomes a genuine collaboration. And that is something that I’ve sort of taken with me as I’ve gotten older and and put into my work is just not being afraid to ask questions and find something and and not not be scared of finding something. That’s, that’s actually part of the process. That’s that’s that’s part of the drill.

 

Louis Virtel: That’s interesting. Does that mean you in general feel a little bit obligated to speed things along when you’re making a show or, like, not not ask questions, just be like, well, yeah, it’s written perfectly on the page. I better just say it as is.

 

Kiernan Shipka: Well, I mean, I think that also comes from Mad Men is that it kind of was, so not a lot of us has to ask a lot of questions. Like they had like ten years of it actually being kind of perfect and everyone sort of knowing their place and knowing the characters so well. It was such a well-oiled machine in that kind of way. Not to say that certain scenes didn’t need to be finessed or finagled in some sort of way, but it really did feel like you could show up and put your best foot forward and everyone else was doing the same thing. And voila, you’ve got you’ve got a show. But with with a lot of other things, it’s it’s different. I’ve written not to say that other things are fantastic, but you just it’s a different process. And sometimes it takes a little bit more digging to get to the sort of core of what the what the scene means, that everything’s Mad Men.

 

Louis Virtel: I think the thing that’s interesting is I feel like in a lot of the shows you’ve done, you’ve been like the primary or only young person on a show. And that would strike me as isolating, generally speaking, I’m sure a lot of your like schooling was done on your own, etc. What did you have to do through specific measures to make sure you like knew other people your age?

 

Kiernan Shipka: It was an active pursuit. It was an active pursuit to find people my age. But I think because I was so adamant about having friends that were in my age range, I actually I made it happen in a way that felt like I chose my friends and it was authentic instead of I didn’t go to a traditional school, so it was all through extra curricular things. So I never felt like I fell into a friend group that I didn’t like. I kind of kind of hung out with all the people that truly made me happy and know I did it. I met Weiner, who created man, and he had sons that were close to my age and. One of them threw a party when he was out of town when I was maybe 14, and I went and the cops busted it and I was like, at my boss’s house because you’re busting party. And it truly felt like that was a that was a portrait of of my, my life at the time. I was going to high school parties. But at your boss’s house, like go diving in a bush.

 

Louis Virtel: Yeah.

 

Kiernan Shipka: Yeah.

 

Ira Madison III: I mean, it’s been so long since Mad Men now, you know, like, I remember all of the chatter after the show was ending was first of all, it’s amazing that you became like you were just like Don Draper’s daughter on the show. And then you essentially became like one of the main characters within like the last couple seasons. I feel like that’s what so many people were just sort of like, We want this show to keep going, you know? We want to see what Sally is doing, like after this. Like, what were your feelings about that then? I assume you probably were just like, I would like to do something new. And what are your feelings about like even revisiting that world now, or do you think about like what your character’s up to? Like, does the character get that seeped into your brain where you’re, like, wondering what Sally Draper is doing, you know, like now.

 

Kiernan Shipka: For sure. For sure. I think when it ended, I wanted to remove myself from it, not remove myself from it, but step away and find new things and and figure out who I was as a person. And I think I knew I needed time. But now I’m ready. I’m ready to see her again. I’m ready to see what she’s up to. I feel like I have so many ideas for what she would be doing. And obviously the way I’m so curious to see how how effective she she would be, by the way she was raised, because we sort of we sort of left her at a very interesting point in her life where I think things would have just started to have really shifted. And and to see her maybe in her mid-twenties, doing whatever she would be doing is extraordinarily appealing to me.

 

Ira Madison III: Truly a wild, upbringing.

 

Kiernan Shipka: Extraordinarily. She would be. She had. Yeah. And I think she would be letting loose.

 

Louis Virtel: Yeah. For once

 

Kiernan Shipka: I think she would not be well. I don’t think she’d be well at all. But in a good way. In a fun way.

 

Ira Madison III: All right. I’m waiting for, like, better call Sally to happen.

 

Kiernan Shipka: Better Call Sally. Let’s go. Let’s go. I’m ready. I’m ready. Glenn can come back. It can be.

 

Louis Virtel: Oh, my God, Glenn, I mean that the hair scene. Oh, my God. From season 1.

 

Kiernan Shipka: Oh, my God.

 

Louis Virtel: With January Jones. Unforgettable. Unforgettable.

 

Kiernan Shipka: Gosh, what a guy.

 

Louis Virtel: Now, do you do you have a favorite character on Mad Men that you never got to interact with? Because I think that’s also a show where, like, you are basically, you know, part of this family. So you didn’t get to, like, go to Sterling Cooper Draper Pryce at all.

 

Kiernan Shipka: I know I had maybe two or maybe two or three office visit episodes, and those were that was like candy to me. That was the most fun because I got to have these tiny little interactions with people that I never interacted with. It almost felt like I was doing a crossover dance. It’s like a different show. I am. I mean, I’m a Peggy Olson’s then, of course, through. And I feel like Peggy and Sally would get coffee and would have a great, great time together. I mean, gosh, everyone in the office I p campbell i’m a I’m I mean, I think that would be so funny to see them interact together. Joan. Joan was probably one of my favorite characters, though.

 

Louis Virtel: Oh, duh duh.

 

Ira Madison III: Absolutely.

 

Louis Virtel: Like I said before, it’s crazy to me that Vincent Kartheiser never got a an Emmy nomination because he is the that character’s the definitive douchebag in the history of television.

 

Kiernan Shipka: Genius Vinnie K us. I love him so much. My friend is randomly extraordinarily obsessed with Vincent Kartheiser and I asked him a year ago, maybe two years ago, it was her birthday and I said, Hey, Vinnie, I hope you’re well. My friend is a huge fan. Would you mind? Maybe, I don’t know, making her like a tiny little video. He sent like a two minute voice that is truly out of this world. He’s he’s wonderful. We need we need more of him in this world I think.

 

Louis Virtel: He seems like a genuine kook, too, which I fucking love. Yeah.

 

Kiernan Shipka: Yeah, definitely. Definitely eccentric.

 

Louis Virtel: Nobody’s. Nobody’s, like, legitimately weird anymore. I crave these things.

 

Kiernan Shipka: I know. I know. We need more weird.

 

Ira Madison III: I fell in love with him on Angel too. I fell in love with him on Angel, which I feel like, you know, like, good. He had the most controversial storyline on that show and so people were happy to love him on Mad Men. But yeah, great character, great actor.

 

Kiernan Shipka: The receding hairline he would shave it. He would shave it. He’d committed to the bit.

 

Louis Virtel: Wow.

 

Ira Madison III: Oh. I hope his hair grew back.

 

Kiernan Shipka: I know. Me too. I should check in on it. Send him some Viviscal or whatever kind of growth supplements are on the market these days.

 

Ira Madison III: Oh, well, it’s so nice to talk to you, Kiernan.

 

Kiernan Shipka: A pleasure. A pleasure. We all have to go to San Vicente Bungalows in Los Angeles. When when everyone’s in the same place.

 

Ira Madison III: I would love to.

 

Louis Virtel: I’ll get a rye martini or whatever. I’ve been there one time. It was lovely.

 

Ira Madison III: You’ve been there one time?

 

Kiernan Shipka: Great. It’s really a fixture.

 

Ira Madison III: For our listeners. Kiernan and I are both friends with Sam Lansky, who’s been on Keep It, by the way.

 

Kiernan Shipka: He has.

 

Louis Virtel: Oh right. Mmmhmm

 

Ira Madison III: He has. Yeah. And he loves. Loves a dinner. Loves a lunch at the San Vicente Bungalows.

 

Kiernan Shipka: He loves that place. We all do. It’s where we exist, mostly.

 

Ira Madison III: Who’s. Who’s, like, one of the most interesting people you’ve seen there.

 

Kiernan Shipka: Oh, my gosh. I mean. I feel like everyone that goes there is is I feel like Tower Bar is actually where more of the sightings are these days, though, in L.A. SVB, SVB kind of has the rotation of regular people that you see and and it’s actors are kind of around.

 

Ira Madison III: Tower Bar’s like the.That’s like the Holland Taylor joint.

 

Kiernan Shipka: There are some there are some wild cards. I feel like you get a very a very pop star energy at a tower bar. It’s like, ah, it’s like Dylan McDermott and Dua LIPA. Like there’s. There’s a broad spectrum.

 

Louis Virtel: Dream team .

 

Kiernan Shipka: always existing at Tower Bar that I kind of live for. Like its always so broad and it makes me so happy.

 

Louis Virtel: I believe that’s the only place I’ve ever had baked Alaska either. Which, by the way, recommend it.

 

Kiernan Shipka: Ohhh I love a meringue.

 

Louis Virtel: Yes.

 

Kiernan Shipka: A torched meringue, even better.

 

Louis Virtel: Yeah, torched . Yeah, right. Desserts should be on fire. Yes.

 

Kiernan Shipka: I think so. I think so.

 

Ira Madison III: Well, now I’ve got to go to Tower Bar so I can make Dylan McDermott and Dua Lipa star in a Sweet Charity remake. I’d love it

 

Kiernan Shipka: I swear to God. One of them are gonna be there. I would love it

 

Ira Madison III: All right. Thank you so much for being here.

 

Kiernan Shipka: It was a pleasure.

 

[AD]

 

Ira Madison III: And we’re back with our favorite segment of the episode. It’s Keep It, I think got a little bone to pick with some of you bitches.

 

Aida Osman: Pick, those bones.

 

Louis Virtel: I thought you were. I thought you were referring to me. I was like I’m right here. I’m on the show with you.

 

Ira Madison III: No, I’m talking about our listeners. I’m calling our listeners bitches. But only the ones who felt the need to try and DM or tag me and be like, I guess Ira’s just going to flirt with Alexander Skarsgard this whole interview, huh?

 

Aida Osman: I guess he was.

 

Ira Madison III: I want to say, he started it.

 

Aida Osman: Set the record straight.

 

Ira Madison III: All right, from the jump I brought up running into him at the 2016 like MTV Movie Awards, and he was like, Oh, the one. He was like, was I wearing any pants then? That’s when I presented without pants. And I’m like, Sir. What are.

 

Louis Virtel: And yet you didn’t bring up Passing, so you’re dead to me.

 

Ira Madison III: Yeah. You know what I actually forgot to bring up? I forgot to pick up the story about him almost hiting Gretta Thunburg with his bike.

 

Louis Virtel: Which is.

 

Aida Osman: What?

 

Louis Virtel: Norseman on Norseman crime? Yeah.

 

Ira Madison III: Just biking and almost ran into her because, you know, I mean, you know, they all be hanging out.

 

Aida Osman: The Biking Vikings. Oh no.

 

Ira Madison III: They all be hanging out, you know, like. Like in Smurf Land or whatever. Are the Smurfs, like.

 

Louis Virtel: Belgium.

 

Aida Osman: Scandinavian for sure

 

Ira Madison III: No, they’re not Scandinavian, they’re Belgian.

 

Aida Osman: Blue from the lack of sun.

 

Ira Madison III: Why do you know that?

 

Louis Virtel: I ask that about most things I know. But yeah. Belgium just like their cousin Tenzin.

 

Aida Osman: You’re telling a truth. You’re not joking.

 

Louis Virtel: Yeah, they’re Belgian.

 

Aida Osman: Okay. girl

 

Ira Madison III: I will say there is the one thing I love. Well, before they started to have before they started to sell them in the U.S., the one thing I loved about, like going over to Europe all the time was seeing like the Smurf Haribo.

 

Louis Virtel: What’s that?

 

Ira Madison III: You would only see that like the Haribo like the Haribo gummy bears.

 

Louis Virtel: Right, right, right there.

 

Ira Madison III: You would only used to see the Smurf ones like in Europe, but now they sell them here in like specialty stores. But they have so many different flavors of Haribo gummies in Europe. It is beautiful. It’s beautiful.

 

Louis Virtel: Okay.

 

Ira Madison III: It was beautiful.

 

Louis Virtel: We can talk about the implications of Gargamel as a character some other time, anyway. What’s your Keep It?

 

Ira Madison III: Gargamel lost the election in France, so yeah,.

 

Louis Virtel: That was good.

 

Ira Madison III: Louis, we’re going to start with your Keep It first. I think Aida has to go last this week.

 

Louis Virtel: That’s true.

 

Aida Osman: Okay okay.

 

Louis Virtel: Okay my keep it is Twitter related and I have the feeling the conversation won’t end about Twitter after I’m done with my key. But but it’s regarding a conversation about Steve Martin’s famous King Tut sketch from late seventies SNL, which.

 

Ira Madison III: Very relevant.

 

Louis Virtel: Some Gen Z are. Yes, right, right. Tip of everybody’s tongue. Everybody wants that Lord Carnarvon and Howard Carter humor. So okay I guess the deal is people from Gen Z discovered this sketch and found it pretty hokey and unfunny. And at the time it was basically a sensation like almost everything Steve Martin did. People were just fucking obsessed with it at the time. Here’s the thing, okay? They’re right. It is not that funny. I mean, I just it’s him dancing like King Tut and pointing around and being silly. I get that. It’s, like, not laden with brilliant humor, but at the same time, if you’re going to post that clip, you also have to post, first of all, the introduction to the clip, which he begins in a very kind of serious, earnest way that leads into the silliness. So there’s like a little bit of a preamble. Secondly, you have to understand, at the time the news cycle around King Tut was basically unthinkably sensational. We would not have anything like this. Now, this there was this tour of this museum exhibit where King Tut’s remains were shipped everywhere and people were obsessed with it. They couldn’t believe they got to experience ancient Egypt at all, let alone King Tut. And so to be really irreverent about this kind of solemnly amazing moment was, I think, really novel to people at the time. And also, I think what Steve Martin once was in the comedy world is kind of lost to current audiences. We know him as like a lightly sarcastic, relatable dad type, but at the time he was so goofy in an unexpected way. He’s like a former, like Six Flags banjo performer or something, Disneyland banjo performer. And people were just blown away at his kind of mix of silliness and like fun self-absorption. So I think you had to be also wrapped up in who he was at the time, anyway.

 

Aida Osman: Wrapped up.

 

Louis Virtel: Yeah, that’s wrapped it.

 

Ira Madison III: Now he’s just Selena Gomez’s costar.

 

Louis Virtel: Yes. Right. By the way a lot of people keep saying about her, they’re like, oh, she’s going to get that nomination this year. I’m like, Guys, are you sure? I never even think about her on that show. But moving on.

 

Ira Madison III: I told you that I prefer her comedy stylings and acting, and I think she’s actually like, really fucking funny, like odd wizards of Waverly Place. They actually didn’t give her anything to do in season one. Only murders at the building. And I hope that changes what, season two?

 

Louis Virtel: There’s plenty about seventies SNL that does not hold up, and I hope this leads to further conversations about the fucking Blues Brothers or the fucking B costumes that are not funny at all or.

 

Ira Madison III: The Samurai.

 

Louis Virtel: Gilda Yeah. What the samurai is just somebody being loud it’s so bad.

 

Aida Osman: Mhm.

 

Louis Virtel: Yeah.

 

Ira Madison III: I would, I would say.

 

Louis Virtel: Samurai delicatessen look them all up. Yeah.

 

Ira Madison III: It’s wild that you reminded me of like how King Tut had a chokehold on us when we were young. Maybe you missed some of those, Aida, but I feel.

 

Aida Osman: I did miss. Miss it. But I did recently also discover the Bangles song Walk Like an Egyptian. I was like what were ya’ll got? What were you doing?

 

Louis Virtel: Yeah.

 

Aida Osman: What’s going on that you needed that dance?

 

Ira Madison III: Maybe this is maybe this. Maybe this is like anti-blackness, but like I feel like in the nineties specifically, like when kids were learning about black kids and learning about King Tut and the Egyptians and shit, you know, like, everyone, like, was like, you know, like, oh, are we all descended from, like, King Tut and the Egyptians and everyone sort of wanted to claim like an ancestry as like Egyptian rather than like anywhere else in Africa. You know, I did a whole book, I did a whole school report in the third grade about being from Egypt.

 

Aida Osman: Third grade.

 

Louis Virtel: Good guess.

 

Ira Madison III: Because. Because, like our teacher, our teacher had everyone do like a report on their heritage and people did reports on like Vikings, you know, like Scandinavians and, you know, like Germany, but somehow leaving up the Nazi shit. And so I was like, You know what? I came, you know, from the pyramids.

 

Aida Osman: I was there. I was working in the fields

 

Louis Virtel: I don’t think so Marshall Reed.

 

Ira Madison III: No one called me out on it.

 

Louis Virtel: Well, here I am. Now, consider you called. Okay.

 

Ira Madison III: That was before 23 and Me, Louis. Okay. Black people just did not know.

 

Louis Virtel: That’s true. That’s true. That was the beginning.

 

Ira Madison III: We were descended from a slave, American, or the actual pharaoh.

 

Louis Virtel: So you sound like a real historian right now. Glad you cleared that up for everybody.

 

Aida Osman: Egyptology. Egyptologist Ira. Thank you.

 

Ira Madison III: Ken Burns. Watch out.

 

Louis Virtel: All right, Ira, what’s your Keep It?

 

Ira Madison III: My Keep It this week. Goes to Christine Quinn on Selling Sunset.

 

Louis Virtel: Now, that’s a TV Show.

 

Ira Madison III: Christine. Selling Sunset is back. It’s everyone’s favorite Netflix show where absolutely nothing happens. But these blonde women are so captivating and so funny, unintentionally and sometimes funny intentionally. You know, we’ve had the lovely chrishell on the show. Unfortunately, I do have to fast forward most of her scenes this season because she is rubbing the head of Jason, one of the owners again. We are one of the owners of the Oppenheim Group’s head. A bit too much. They’re dating this season, but we also already know that they’ve already broken up in real life. So watching.

 

Louis Virtel: That’s so annoying on a reality show, knowing what will happen, that’s so annoying.

 

Aida Osman: The actual reality.

 

Ira Madison III: Yeah, it’s like, okay, like with Netflix, I don’t need all this. Keep it moving. But let me tell you something about Christine Quinn. She is the purported villain of the show. You know, like everyone’s always talking about how, like, she’s so fashionable, she should be on Real Housewives of Beverly Hills. Like she just because like she she’s basically a bitch to everybody, and she is an awful television villain. And I need people to know that she is awful as a TV villain. First of all, the fashions aren’t that great. She just wears labels. She just walks around in labels and like designer bags and like, there’s no rhyme or reason to what she’s wearing. So, like, the styling isn’t even there. Like, it’s just it’s sort of like worse than when Erika Jayne used to walk around, like, looking like a, you know, looking like a barbie that fell like off a Mattel truck, you know? So, like, this is really bad fashion. And it’s also. She really is just like a miserable, rude person to everyone that she works with. And the problem with that is this isn’t Bravo. But you’re not going toe to toe with, like, Kenya Moore, Nene Leakes, You know, like you’re not fighting with Erika Jayne, you know, and Lisa Rinna, like. Like these women are timid and, like, sweet and, like, don’t want that kind of confrontation. Like, if you call someone a bitch, they’re not going to give you that. They’re not going to keep they’re not going to keep that same energy. And this is season five of the show. And at this point, if you’re going to be the villan of the show. You got to switch up the energy, because what’s actually happened is like nobody wants to film with us. And so, like, you’re just on an island and so you’re not actually villainizing anybody. You’re just sort of making people uncomfortable. And when she does make people uncomfortable, she just sort of, like, makes up stories and, like, tries to be a victim and cries about it. And, like, well, like, she flees an event this season because people are sort of like ruining her work event, quote unquote, ruining her work event. Okay. This event that’s being taped for TV, it wasn’t a real work event girl. And she’s like, goes downstairs, she’s crying and she’s like, I just felt like I was like, you could all be professional. I’m like, okay, it’s not professional. Like selling stories about your coworkers to the tabloids, either. Girl. So which is it? Are you going to be a villain or are you going to be a victim?

 

Aida Osman: That’s the part that’s always lost on me is where’s Oppenheimer H.R. Where they at? These are your coworkers, these the people you’re supposed to be making money with, sometimes against. I mean, they are real estate agents, but it’s like you guys work together. You can’t burn all these bridges all the way down.

 

Ira Madison III: Right. And then they talk about getting rid of her, firing her. I’m like, okay, there’s plenty of people on the show who have not even sold the damn house in five seasons. So what are we doing here?

 

Aida Osman: Not even an office space.

 

Ira Madison III: I do want to say I’m obsessed with the new girl on the show, the first black girl, Chelsea, who is British Nigerian. But her accent is giving Anna Delvy.

 

Louis Virtel: Oh, we love that.

 

Aida Osman: Yes.

 

Louis Virtel: So there’s some Bjork in it too.

 

Ira Madison III: The money is coming. The wire is coming. I promise. I promise.

 

Louis Virtel: Julia Garner.

 

Ira Madison III: It’s coming. I promise. I promise. We never talked about that show, but what an awful TV show. Anyway, Aida, what’s your Keep It?

 

Aida Osman: Okay, guys, this is a this is perfect for a potentially final Keep It because Twitter is my home, my breeding grounds, and where I handle all my dirtiest work.

 

Ira Madison III: I will be back.

 

Aida Osman: You will be back because free speech is up. Mr. Daddy Musk is going to free you.

 

Ira Madison III: Yes. Okay. Alright. Me and the freethinkers will be returning to the app. Okay.

 

Aida Osman: Alas, democracy. We back in this bitch

 

Ira Madison III: I’ve been having a lot of fun on the truth app, but it’s time to come back.

 

Aida Osman: So that’s my. That’s my Keep It, my, Keep It is to Twitter being bought by Elon Musk. So we off Twitter we now tweeting no more.

 

Louis Virtel: A solid Keep It yeah.

 

Aida Osman: It is. Elon Musk bought Twitter on Monday for $44 billion, which might seem like a lot of money. But remember, Tesla is worth $1,000,000,000,000 and space X is worth 100 billion. So this is still kind of chump change for him.

 

Ira Madison III: And I owe Sallie Mae 600 billion. So.

 

Louis Virtel: Right.

 

Aida Osman: And they will never be getting that.

 

Ira Madison III: They sure won’t

 

Aida Osman: Look, I’m not prepared for a world where Elon Musk owns the place where I make pussy jokes. Okay. I’m not prepared for a world where Grimes is going to consolidate all of our Twitter typos and name her next alien baby like that. You know, you don’t get that for free, honey. You don’t get that for free. I don’t want to live there. In buying Twitter. So Elon has been so critical of Twitter in the past, even though that little ho can’t stay off it, he can’t stay off it. He said, let me find this quote. He said, Free speech is the bedrock of democracy. And Twitter is the digital town square where matters vital to the future of humanity are debated.

 

Louis Virtel: It better not be.

 

Aida Osman: What matters are those?

 

Ira Madison III: Nicki Minaj. Nicki Minaj’s verse on Bedrock is the bedrock of our community. First of all.

 

Aida Osman: Put that pussy on his sideburns.

 

Okkay coming off the top asbestos.

 

Exactly what do we talk about on Twitter? We talk about Kali Uchis in a Moyglare suit. Do we like it? Shawn Mendez , oh, he’s sad now. Are we okay with that? Those videos, you guys keep calling Sydney Sweeney ugly on Twitter. Leave that girl alone. That’s what we talk about on Twitter. Nobody’s opinions are being changed on that app. This is not fucking Athens. It’s social media. Like the way the way Elon Musk and people like the free speech libertarian, like we make money and that’s all we do hyper capitalist. They think that the Internet is a world where like actual dialog can happen. Insightful dialog. Girl nothing is happening on Twitter, nothing is happening on Twitter like that.

 

Louis Virtel: Also, can I just say I’m a lot of people been dragging old Elon Musk tweets that are like bad jokes, whatever. And it just hurts the soul to realize that someone that fucking powerful is still obsessed with being funny.

 

Aida Osman: Yes.

 

Louis Virtel: Like, it’s like, so, like, it’s not your job. And yet there’s something about being, like, a straight man and people being, like, wrapped up in how funny they think you are. That’s like, super attract. It just, it’s like, sad to me. It’s like you, you need this weird validation and that’s a part of your obsession with Twitter because by the way, historically, Elon Musk has said things like if if the U.N. outlines a world or a plan to end world hunger, that costs this amount of money, I’ll pay for it. And they did it. And then he went and not and then didn’t pay PayPal and then went and bought Twitter instead. So he’s just this weird juvenile, you know, Marvin the Martian type, while the coyote asshole who could be doing a lot more with the money he used and in fact has threatened to do a lot more with the money he has and is instead just buying Twitter. But I just want to say about Twitter in general that Aida does fabulous work on it. And I know we think of her as like, you know, shall we say, an envelope pushing, you know, vulgar comedian. But there’s a tweet of hers that I want to read here that I think puts into perspective, you know, the soul of Aida. I hope we can enjoy it together.

 

Aida Osman: I’m shaking in my little boots.

 

Louis Virtel: Here we go. You got to pinch the clit and suck it like a blunt roach. That’s so.

 

Aida Osman: Yassss.

 

Louis Virtel: So nice. So.

 

Aida Osman: Sex education.

 

Louis Virtel: I’m putting it on a pillow. I’m laying down on it. You thought I was going to give you an inspirational Aida quote? Come on.

 

Aida Osman: I really had thought I’d like, over time, I’ll age and mature into, like, a poetic understanding of self that will translate to my Twitter, but I’d still does shit like that. And I’m going to be 20 I’m going to be 25 in July. Okay. It’s not going away.

 

Louis Virtel: Also I just want to say that Aida is also the queen of lowercase Twitter. There’s there’s something about like the way people abuse lowercase that I can find over overdone. But it’s you speak in lowercase in a way.

 

Aida Osman: It’s very. It’s very E. Cummings of me, emphasis on the Cummings. Let’s go baybee.

 

Louis Virtel: What’s wrong with her?

 

Aida Osman: I’m not sure. I’m not sure. It’s this weird breed of, like, smart but stupid, right? Can we agree? Okay. And then lastly, lastly, I just want to say, I don’t I don’t know what his impetus for doing this is. And that’s what scares me is because like Twitter is not a very profitable place as an app. There’s only 400 million people on Twitter and 200 of them are Russian bots. So I don’t know what he’s going to accomplish. She wants to clean that out and make this a safe space for us. And my I don’t I, I fear I fear that people like Donald Trump and Ira will be invited back on to the app. And that is not a world we need.

 

Ira Madison III: It’s truly not. Listen, I give in to the joke about like returning back to Twitter, but like, my life has been great since I left Twitter. I don’t want to go back.

 

Aida Osman: You caused political chaos, Ira. You are like somebody who should not be on the app.

 

Ira Madison III: Yeah, I actually did cause political misinformation. It was.

 

Aida Osman: Mhm.

 

Ira Madison III: Yeah. If I’m allowed to come back what’s next.

 

Louis Virtel: Right.

 

Aida Osman: My heart goes out to the employees of Twitter that have now worked for Jack Dorsey and Elon Musk. You are a statesman. You are a patriot and I feel for you.

 

Ira Madison III: I want to close this out with two of my favorite Aida quotes on Twitter.

 

Louis Virtel: Alright here we go

 

Aida Osman: God guys, why are we doing this? I’m trying to rebrand.

 

Ira Madison III: At this point, I think Kevin Hart just wants dick.

 

Aida Osman: What? When did I say that?

 

Louis Virtel: Aida’s Aida’s shocked at her own tweets.

 

Ira Madison III: And my absolute favorite – “don’t burp after you suck dick and then swallow. That’s why we got ghosts.”

 

Aida Osman: Ok. If he going to gosh for me to be laughing, but I really dissociate. I tweet it and I don’t know who did it.

 

Louis Virtel: That really is just an astounding tweet.

 

Ira Madison III: The amount of friends who sent me that tweet. To find my favorite Aida tweets all I had to do was go to iMessage and search Aida because people always send me your tweets.

 

Aida Osman: I love that. I love that.

 

Louis Virtel: Oh, my god.

 

Aida Osman: Guys. We did it. We did our final Keep It together. Watch me be like can I guest co-host next week?

 

Louis Virtel: Right?

 

Ira Madison III: I mean, listen. Also you you really have, like, made your mark on this show. We’re really going to miss you. And we’re also letting our listeners know we’re not doing the guest host merry-go-round.

 

Louis Virtel: Sweepstakes.

 

Ira Madison III: Sweepstakes anymore. You know, Keep It well, just become Keep It with Ira and Louis after this. How could we possibly replace you?

 

Aida Osman: Stop. Stop

 

Louis Virtel: Sincerely. It would feel contrived. You are one of a kind. And rad. And also the amount of questions I got about you just from people on the street being like, what’s up with her? And then the answer is always everything. And its a thrill that is happening to you. .

 

Ira Madison III: She’s everthing, everywhere all at once.

 

Aida Osman: All at once.

 

Ira Madison III: Everything everywhere. Aida at once.

 

Aida Osman: I’m the third Daniel. Aida Daniel. Guys, thank you so much. This has been a blast. An amazing, I want to say two something years of my life and I love you dearly. I will support your career and be around for every moment of it and to thank you and also Rap Shit premieres, I have to plug now I have to be one of those girls.

 

Ira Madison III: Ayyye.

 

Aida Osman: Rap Shit premieres in July. And of course, you guys hopefully will be at the premiere right there with me. So we’ll see.

 

Louis Virtel: Duh

 

Ira Madison III: If if there’s one thing I associate with Rap Shit, it’s Louis Virtel.

 

Louis Virtel: Oh please.

 

Aida Osman: Yes, exactly. Rap and shit.

 

Louis Virtel: You know, my favorite rapper is Madonna.

 

Ira Madison III: I got a lawyer and a manager and a chef.

 

Louis Virtel: And a chef.

 

Ira Madison III: All right. Well, that is our episode. Thank you to Kiernan Shipka for joining us this week. And next week we will be back with more Keep It with Ira and Louis.

 

Ira Madison III: Keep it as a Crooked Media production. Our senior producer is Kendra James. Our producer is Chris Lord. Our executive producers are Ira Madison III.

 

Louis Virtel: And Louis Virtel.

 

Ira Madison III: Our editor is Charlotte Landes and Kyle Seglin is our sound engineer.

 

Louis Virtel: Thank you to our digital team, Matt DeGroot, Nar Melkonian, and Delon Villanueva for our production support every week.