“Bring the Girls!” w. Julio Torres | Crooked Media
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May 11, 2022
Keep It
“Bring the Girls!” w. Julio Torres

In This Episode

Ira and Louis discuss the Tony nominations, whether Elisabeth Olsen does Marvel movies (like Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness) for the checks, Kim Kardashian robbing Marilyn Monroe’s grave, and Lady Gaga’s Top Gun song. Plus, Julio Torres joins to discuss his new children’s book I Want to Be a Vase, Nicole Kidman, and more.

Note: This episode contains mild spoilers for Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness


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Speaker 1 [AD].


Ira Madison III: And we’re back with an all new Keep it. I’m Ira Madison III.


Louis Virtel: Oh, God. Are you? I have to leave. I’m Louis Virtel.


Ira Madison III: And we got a lot of things to talk about. Jesse Williams’ dick is out.


Louis Virtel: I guess.


Ira Madison III: I mean, sorry, the Tony nominations are out.


Louis Virtel: Okay. I just became aware of the Jesse Williams dick situation yesterday. I’m familiar with the play he is in that he’s nominated for Take Me Out.


Ira Madison III: Take Me Out.


Louis Virtel: Richard Greenburg. And Jesse Tyler Ferguson is also nominated for it. But I did not understand and don’t remember this play, which I believe is from the late eighties, early nineties, and it’s about baseball that there was so much schlong-ery occurring in this play.


Ira Madison III: Yeah, I mean I just always know that the play was nude and had gay shit at it. And.


Louis Virtel: Right.


Ira Madison III: Let me tell you, I’ve seen Take Me Out and it is real and it is spectacular.


Louis Virtel: As in this version of it?


Ira Madison III: As as in Jesse Williams’s penis. But yes, also this version of it is really good. It’s a really good production.


Louis Virtel: Jesse Williams, for the record, is was the like blindingly hot person who was on Grey’s Anatomy for years and years. In case anybody here is not a Shonda-man.


Ira Madison III: Everyone in this cast was like on a TV show that I used to watch. Jesse Williams, Grey’s Anatomy. Jesse Tyler Ferguson, Modern Family. Patrick Adams, Suits.


Louis Virtel: Wow. I forgot that you watched Suits. I feel like that was a 2018 Keep It topic. Suits would come up every episode or so.


Ira Madison III: I mean, Jesse Williams and Patrick share the fact that Katherine Heigl was on both of their series. But.


Louis Virtel: Right.


Ira Madison III: Jesse joined, I believe Jesse joined after Katherine Heigl left.


Louis Virtel: Which is crazy because she joined in season 36. So it’s like Guiding Light over there. By the way, I did appreciate Ellen Pompeo recently saying that Katherine Heigl would be heralded as I don’t know if she said hero recently, but.


Ira Madison III: She was ahead of her time.


Louis Virtel: Ahead of her time. And guess what? I’m on Team Pompeo. I agree.


Ira Madison III: I’m on the team. People being like, is Ellen Pompeo not afraid of Shonda Rhimes anymore cause she’s retiring?


Louis Virtel: Oh, that could be. Well, but also, of course be terrified of Shonda Rhimes. She’s terrifying. So I. I think that’s a human response to Shonda Rhimes.


Ira Madison III: That’s fair. I agree with her. I love the concept of Katherine Heigl being ahead of her time.


Louis Virtel: That’s true. I mean, she’s not exactly like Laurie Anderson or something. She’s not throwing like  progressive performance art at us.


Ira Madison III: She’s Phil of the Future is what she is. But no getting back to Take Me Out. The Tony nominations are out. And as you know, I enjoy the theater.


Louis Virtel: Sure. Likewise.


Ira Madison III: And I’ve seen quite I’ve seen quite a few of these.


Louis Virtel: I know when I was going through the nominations, it occurred to me you actually can narrate most of the experiences. We got the first ever openly trans nominee and she is a performer in A  Strange Loop. And I was wondering if you could talk about that performance.


Ira Madison III: A Strange Loop is really fucking fantastic. It’s like Michael R. Jackson. It’s Opus. You know about a Broadway usher at Lion King who wants to write a musical called A Strange Loop using Liz Phair songs.


Louis Virtel: No. Can you believe you’ve seen this and I haven’t? Yes.


Ira Madison III: And the joke is that Liz Phair wouldn’t let him use the music. There’s a great song called Exile in Gayville. It’s really fun. But I would say that it’s interesting watching this Broadway production because, I mean, I think I think it’s fantastic. And I think that. Jackal Spivey is is great in it, but I had the pleasure of seeing Larry Owens in it off-Broadway and that role is still dominated by Larry for me.


Louis Virtel: Got it. Got it.


Ira Madison III: Completely. It’s a great show, though. It is one of those shows that is sort of about self-loathing. And I maybe think that it gets a bit too much into misery porn. But I really think it’s sort of a important piece to be on Broadway. And I love that, you know, this like black queer show is finding an audience. It is finding this audience of a lot of white gay men.


Louis Virtel: Oh. I see. Hmmm. Okay fascinating.


Ira Madison III: Who want to tell me they love Strange Loop. But you know what, white people are always going to see our art, so.


Louis Virtel: That’s true. I mean, you can’t stop us. I’m always in line. Sorry.


Ira Madison III: I’m sure you’ve seen Girl 6.


Louis Virtel: Of course I’ve seen it. Madonna’s on the soundtrack. Or not. Madonna’s in the movie.


Ira Madison III: She’s in the movie.


Louis Virtel: Yes.


Louis Virtel: The self-loathing thing reminds me of the kind of double edged sword that is Boys In The Band, which is when I watch the movie version of it. The original one from the seventies. Not the more recent Ryan Murphy fied version. You get a lot of queer joy in that movie and like, you see, like, whatever gay’s doing, like a kick line for fun at a party in 1970 and AIDS doesn’t exist yet. And this is, you know, a version of history I’ve not seen before. And then it spirals into this one guy freaking out and basically having a self-loathing sort of panic attack. And I’m not saying that doesn’t exist for a certain type of person, but you feel like straight people watch it and think, oh, at the core of all gay people, there’s just a self-loathing thing trying to get out. It’s not true. So I don’t know who that’s for exactly. But all right.


Ira Madison III: I know you sort of have to remind yourself that this is one artist’s.


Louis Virtel: Right.


Ira Madison III: You know, journey, you know, like this. This isn’t this doesn’t represent all Black queer people. And listen, there have been many instances of things in the play that I’ve personally experienced, you know, but, you know, the there’s moments where it just gets veers so much into. All right, I get it.


Louis Virtel: Uh huh. Uh huh.


Ira Madison III: You know, but it’s also 100 minutes with no intermission, so.


Louis Virtel: Love that. Oh, my God. Please


Ira Madison III: Okay, so let’s celebrate that.


Louis Virtel: Please hit me  with the 91-100 minute jam. Love that. I do have to say, reading the Tony nominations, I was shocked to have an emotional response to Funny Girl being all but shut out. And my reason is it wasn’t totally shut out. There was one nomination for supporting actor, which to me sounded like the Tonys saying, oh no, it was eligible. Like kinda getting in our face with it.


Ira Madison III: Uh, I have not seen Funny Girl yet, but if you think I will not be seeing Funny Girl soon, this is specifically one of those shows where it’s like, I need to see Funny Girl to be part of the conversation.


Louis Virtel: Right, right, right.


Ira Madison III: I can’t I can’t have been like years later being like, you what, no, I never saw that Funny Girl.


Louis Virtel: I would like to see it myself. And here’s the thing. Prior to this, I think I’ve loved Beanie Feldstein in everything. Like, booksmart to me


Ira Madison III: I love her!


Louis Virtel: That’s like a two and a half to three star movie for me. But she is great and unmistakable and owns that role. I loved her in Lady Bird in a role that was like maybe a little bit smaller than I wanted it to be. But she was great. And also she herself seems fun and, you know, rad. My favorite word. It is weird filling the shoes of Barbra Streisand, as every critic has noted, because I do think it is the best debut by anyone in anything that ever happened. I cannot think of a bigger, better debut than that. And also, as a couple of reviews, and more reviews should be pointing this out, noted the role was generally written with Barbara in mind. The like, the the extent of the vocals, the like the comic flourish. And so filling her. It really is about filling her shoes. It’s not like, well, anybody can play Fanny Brice. It’s like, no, this was molded to Barbra Streisand initially, who, of course, has a wild and specific set of extraordinary talents.


Ira Madison III: Mm hmm. Yeah, it’s. It’s giving very much in high school, you know when like, like the best actress or best actor, right, would get the lead in everything.


Louis Virtel: Yeah.


Ira Madison III: And, you know, it’s it’s like, okay, cool. You’re great in Footloose, the musical, you know? Right. But like, should you also have the lead in Night Mother? I don’t know.


Louis Virtel: And there’s only two roles in that. So it really does take up a lot of space.


Ira Madison III: Then we’re going to make you the lead in The Hunt for The Red October. It’s like, what are we doing here?


Ira Madison III: And I get this is the role she’s always wanted to do, you know, obviously idolizes Barbra Streisand, but I’m going to wait until I see it to comment on it. But it it is funny that it was just sort of snip snipped.


Louis Virtel: Yes. Right, right. Right. I. And also, there’s a whole bunch of Barbra Streisand esque roles. I could see Beanie Feldstein filling. Like we talk about. What’s Up, Doc? all the time


Ira Madison III:  She’d be great in a What’s Up, Doc? remake.


Louis Virtel: Yeah that spitfire delivery with that with a little bit of a wink in it and that that’s totally her to me. So hopefully there’s actually a little bit more. Streisand amazing


Ira Madison III: Here. Here’s here’s here’s my pitch.


Louis Virtel: . Nuts?


Ira Madison III: No, here’s mine it’s beanie in the Barbara role.


Louis Virtel: Okay.


Ira Madison III: Let’s see, it is  Andrew Garfield. In the .


Louis Virtel: As Ryan O’Neal.


Ira Madison III: Ryan O’Neal role


Louis Virtel: And I love that. And he of course, would be obsessed with what’s up, Doc? Andrew Garfield.


Ira Madison III: Yes. And you make his character bisexual. And the Madeline Kahn role is Channing Tatum, as Guy Branum.


Louis Virtel: Has told the Cook if he ever said yes.


Louis Virtel: I had my first breakdown on Keep It when he said that Channing Tatum was the new Madeline Kahn. I’m not saying he’s not delightful. I must say I don’t want to see him sing and dance. Madeline Kahn, her particular uppercrusty I’m about to fall apart thing just seems like there’s a there’s a bit of a there’s something there that’s specifically character actress and not that I am hardwired to believe in the binary, but I do feel like you have to you have to anoint a woman as the successor to Madeline Kahn.


Ira Madison III: You know what? I thought that he was great in The Lost City. And maybe the only good thing in it.


Louis Virtel: I agree that movie does exist. I agree that movie exists.


Ira Madison III: And maybe the only good thing in it.


Ira Madison III: I watched that on Delta recently and the amount of times I fell asleep and had to keep going back to it, which also which actually has become just a problem anyway. Because, you know, I’m a person who falls asleep immediately on a plane.


Louis Virtel: Oh yeah, likewise.


Ira Madison III: It’s always a struggle to stay up. So I get my fucking meal because I’m mad when they pass by you. And then it’s like, oh, I missed the meal or I missed the drinks. I’m like, aye, bring that back. You know? And they’re always just sort of like, if you miss it, it’s gone.


Louis Virtel: Yeah, right. Lost City feels like a definitive plane movie to me. I used to think it was Me and Earl and The Dying Girl was the number one. I think and Atomic Blond. That’s a good plane movie, because you could pay attention, you know?


Ira Madison III: I did watch that on a plane. Yeah. Yeah, I did watch it on a plane. Um, let’s see what else is nominated. Clyde’s, which starred Uzo Aduba. Uh .


Louis Virtel: Oh right!


Ira Madison III: I thought it was really fun. Uh she’s great in it.


Louis Virtel: I want to say I saw some statistic that 20 out of the 45 acting nominees are actors of color, too.


Ira Madison III: Okay.


Louis Virtel: Following last year’s season, which I believe had a ton of Black casts nominated. That’s like sort of interesting, I guess.


Ira Madison III: Well, I assume none of them are in Hangmen the Martin McDonagh play.


Louis Virtel: Oh, you don’t say.


Ira Madison III: I’m kidding. I don’t know the makeup of that play. And I love Martin McDonagh and I actually have not seen Hangmen yet. And I love Alfie Allen. And I’m so I’m excited for his nomination and I’m excited to see it. Mostly because I’ve missed Martin on stage. I think that his foray into movies like Three Billboards has been the worst aspect of his career.


Louis Virtel: And I have to say.


Ira Madison III: I want him to get back to the theater.


Louis Virtel: That movie was around when we did Keep It initially, and I just I’ve never there’s never been a movie where I was so sure I was going to like it going in. And then I was in denial about how much I hated it walking out. Like it took me days to realize, Oh, I don’t even fucking like Frances in this. Who is I think has among the most flawless records and of of all of our kind of legends walking around still people.


Ira Madison III: People died!


Louis Virtel: Is it? Is he still with Phoebe or what.


Ira Madison III: Yeah, I think he’s he’s there with Phoebe. So if Phoebe Waller-Bridge that that movie started more fights around the dinner table than Trump. Okay, more than Green Book. This is a litmus test. Do you remember when, like, I like I did not bring this up, obviously, when we made Uncoupled the show with the the show starring Neil Patrick Harris that I worked on. Yeah I remember when he, like, wrote a very angry series of tweets about Wesley Morris College, Three Billboards, racist.


Louis Virtel: Oh, my God. I forgot all about that.


Ira Madison III: People were angry that people didn’t like this movie.


Louis Virtel: And also, by the way, I mean, we could have just contained our outrage to Abbie Cornish playing American. Like that could have been a whole like we’re not alone. Sam Rockwell, what? Like punching some guy out a window and it’s like it was. Anyway, there’s a lot going on in that movie. I want to say also about the Tony nominations, so thrilled to see Rachel Dratch get a nomination for this show called Potus. Rachel Dratch is one of these people where Saturday Night Live is just built for certain people, as in it’s the epitome of what they bring. And you’re happy when those people get there and then when they leave, it’s like, Well, we don’t really have a track for you because Saturday Night Live is the track. So for her to get to play a a broad, fun role and by the way, her memoir is so good. It’s called Girl Walks into a Bar. It starts off harrowingly and ends up being a little bit funnier and more traditionally bossy pants ish.


Ira Madison III: But so the reverse in the not so good.


Louis Virtel: Which you know, is my favorite Kamasutra position.


Ira Madison III: Potus is definitely on my list to see a rundown Roseanne and MJ The Musical Versus Strange, Lupe and Six and like Paradise Square Mr. Saturday nNight, Gril From the north country like so these these are musicals that everyone’s sort of really talking about. So it’s interesting. It doesn’t seem like a year where, like, Hamilton’s going to win everything, you know?


Louis Virtel: Correct? Yeah, it does. You’re right. There’s no, like, dear Evan Hansen stick out sort of thing. That’s nice.


Ira Madison III: Yeah. I personally loved MJ the musical, and I read Katori Hall. Yeah, I get that. I love when you call everyone who’s been on Keep It Our Friend.


Louis Virtel: Well, they are friendly. They they don’t leave and discuss usually. At least they dont tell us.


Louis Virtel: What if Judith writes  like, I fucking hated them.


Ira Madison III: She’s walking. Around Manhattan. Like, let me tell you, I will destroy. Keep it.


Louis Virtel: But they would not shut up about that fucking Versace show. Yeah.


Ira Madison III: Heather Graham probably is, but that’s a story for another day.


Louis Virtel: Right, right we’ll save that for the book.


Ira Madison III: Obviously Six the musical is great, too, and I haven’t seen the.


Louis Virtel: Funny songs.


Ira Madison III: other usical nominees yet. Yeah, but Carolina Change would definitely win Best Revival Musical. I thought it was fucking amazing and I had weirdly never seen it before on stage. And so it was life changing to finally see, you know, one of Tony Kushner, his other works besides Angels in America and Company. Company still just doesn’t work for me. I’m sorry. Interesting. It’s like the the gender swap.


Ira Madison III: Is just it’s I like I like the idea of the gender swap, but I haven’t I haven’t liked the leads in either of the productions I’ve seen the Broadway or the West End. Jonathan Bailey was, of course, amazing in the West End production. And, you know, Patti LuPone is they’re collecting the check.


Louis Virtel: I was wondering if she was going to get her third, Tony, though, because she’s I’m I’m always concerned about award amounts like you know how at the Grammys everybody has way too many the Oscars it sort of feels like generally everybody kind of has the right amount like and Tonys also feels that way to me but and Patti only having to it’s like that just feels like that feels like that should have a problem that we solved in her forties.


Ira Madison III: Mhm. But I mean really this is just such an array of like people that I’m excited to see again. Like I haven’t seen How I learned to Drive yet, but.


Louis Virtel: Oh Mary Louise Parker is  absolutely in my ten favorite actors. Absolutely.


Ira Madison III: She taught me how to hold iced coffee.


Louis Virtel: Oh, right. No, Weeds?


Ira Madison III: The way that I could tell you to hold my eyes up with, like your hand around the lid. A straw sticking. Between one of the two of your fingers, like I held my iced coffee like that for years.


Louis Virtel: Oh, my God. I know. I brought this up at the time when she was in The Sound Inside. The last thing she won the Tony for. Just amazing. And then it’s it always pains me like that these things aren’t necessarily on tape so you’re it feels like you’re telling like you’re retelling a story you heard once upon a time when you’re talking about these productions. So anyway, you can go see Mary-Louise Parker live. My God, you should. What an awesome actor.


Ira Madison III: I haven’t seen Music Man yet because they were supposed to be sending me free tickets to Music Man. And then they’re like, Well, you can pay $200 for tickets. And I was like, Well, Hugh Jackman and Sutton Foster can dance by themselves.


Louis Virtel: That yeah, right. Sutton Foster You can. Sutton Spen.


Louis Virtel: Yeah.


Ira Madison III: So I don’t know how Music Man  is and I’m not in desperate need to see this production that I’m. going to spend that much money to see that show specifically when. Specifically when like The Real Hottest Ticket in Town is the show that I’m seeing this coming weekend which is the cities that are on Corden’s production of Into the Woods with Heather Headley.


Louis Virtel: Oh. Heather Headley. I’m sorry. I’m just gushing about everybody. Okay. I may have told that when I was in New York a few years ago. I bought a ticket to see the Heather Headley Color Purple. All right. I’m excited to see it. Best Grammy, best new artist nominee Heather Headley. I’m thrilled to go. And then a friend of mine is like, what are you doing this Saturday? I’m like, Well, I’m seeing Heather Headley in The Color Purple. And he goes, I have fourth row tickets to Hamilton if you want to go with me. And unfortunately, culturally, I had to say yes to that because it was the original cast of Hamilton. And so I just went to that. And then I didn’t get I sold my ticket or gave my ticket to a friend. And so now there’s always this what if thing because it’s not like not like something I think about as I feel like. Yeah. If I if I said.


Louis Virtel: If I saw. Color Purple, I think. I think that would have stuck with me.


Louis Virtel: Yeah.


Ira Madison III: Yeah. Yeah.


Louis Virtel: But would you have done the same thing?


Ira Madison III: I saw Hamilton at the public.


Louis Virtel: Okay, but, like, let’s. Let’s say you have to see. I’m just like, okay, you can go and see Hamilton for free with me in the fourth row.


Ira Madison III: I would have gone, but then I also would have seen Color Purple later that week. But you were probably just visiting for a few days.


Louis Virtel: That’s correct. I couldn’t go and see it again. Yeah.


Ira Madison III: I get it. That is a dilemma. That is a dilemma. I know you’re ruining lives.


Louis Virtel: That’s what this is actually what the song dilemma by not only and Kelly Rowland was originally about.


Ira Madison III: Yeah there’s everything that we need to say about the Tonys. Other plays that I see that were on here, like The Skeleton Crew by Dominique Morrison, starring Phylicia Rashad, was actually like really fantastic. And so she’s becoming like a playwright that I’m really interested in seeing her work more. So shout out to these nominations. They are like they’re full of like really interesting writers and actors, you know, people who are like staples, like Sam Rockwell, who’s nominated for everything. Anytime he steps on stage, I’m still not going to go see American Buffalo now.


Ira Madison III: Right.


Ira Madison III: Well, although actually.


Louis Virtel: It does seem to be the living worst, so.


Ira Madison III: Well, actually, someone told me in a in an Instagram DM that in his divorce with his wife that all money that this show American Buffalo makes actually goes to her. So if I could be confirmed that, then I will go see American Buffalo.


Louis Virtel: Oh, I wonder if this woman is Lindsay Crouse, who is the mother of Zosia mamet and as a best supporting actress nominee from the movie Places in the Heart, I bet it’s not.


Ira Madison III: And also played an evil villain in season four of Buffy.


Louis Virtel: Oh, really? About. There we go. See, this is how I keep it works. I produce half of the pop culture universe. It brings up that one


Louis Virtel: About.


Louis Virtel: A nice primer on how we communicate.


Ira Madison III: All right, when we’re back, we’ve got plenty more. Keep it. We’ve got Julio Torres here.


Louis Virtel: Funny


Ira Madison III: The space prince himself. And then we’re also going to talk about some things to say about Doctor Strange and the Multiverse of Madness. And we’re going to talk about actors who take movie roles just for a check.


Louis Virtel: Should be long.


Ira Madison III: We’ll be right back with more Keep It.




Ira Madison III: All right. So, Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness opened this weekend and I have some things to say.


Louis Virtel: Okay.


Ira Madison III: First of all, I had a lot of fun. Second of all.


Louis Virtel: That sounds like you. Okay


Ira Madison III: Second of all. Marvel is in its mess era.


Louis Virtel: Okay.


Ira Madison III: I had a lot of fun, but also I thought the movie was a mess.


Louis Virtel: I heard that Michael Stuhlbarg is in it for like 25 seconds and yet scored a “with” credit like it says with Michael Stuhlbarg which is pretty um using that Call Me By Your Name caché to swing his weight around.


Ira Madison III: You know, he shows up and he gives that same speech to Benedict Cumberbatch. And I was like, all right, this is a choice. But, you know, anything can happen in the multiverse.


Louis Virtel: That’s right. He puts his arm around Dr. Strange and says maybe I’m gay too son, just like in Call Me By Your Name.


Ira Madison III: I mean, the best part of the movie is obviously, you know, like Elizabeth Olsen as the Scarlet Witch, just killing a bunch of people. You know, and I kept seeing the comments online from people being white, girl, you don’t have to do this movie. You’re Elizabeth Olsen, you know? And it got me thinking about actors who I guess have taken roles that you would think is just for the check. But also, I want to point out. She’s done a ton of these movies now. So like, I think Elizabeth Olsen just likes doing it at this point. She’s been in like 50 Marvel movies.


Louis Virtel: Have you seen the press tour she’s been on recently, though? She did an interview with our Kyle Buchanan, our our friend for real this time. And part of it, she said that these movies physically take her away from the kinds of movies she would watch as an audience member. She has been so tactfully walking around saying, I don’t know what this shit is. I don’t know. I don’t know if it’s good. She was talking to she did an interview with Jimmy Fallon and she said, Every time I watch one of these movies, I think, oh, here’s the bad one. Finally, we finally messed up. It’s it’s like she sort of is indicating not only do I not watch these, I don’t know the difference between a good one and a bad one, which makes me believe it is a check taking situation, though she’s turned this into a really dynamic character. So in a way, it’s sort of, I think, become more of an artistic endeavor for her.


Ira Madison III: Well, she said, watching Eternals if she doesn’t know what a bad one is.


Louis Virtel: Okay, good. I knew you’d be instructive in this regard.


Ira Madison III: When’s the last time she made, like, one of the, quote-unquote “movies she’d like to watch”?


Louis Virtel: I know. Wind River. Maybe that.


Ira Madison III: Kodachrome.


Louis Virtel: Or. No, or  um Ingrid Goes West?


Ira Madison III: Ingrid Goes West was so fucking great.


Louis Virtel: She is amazing in it. I have a little I have a problem with how crazy the movie gets and the ending I don’t like. But Aubrey Plaza also fabulous. Exactly. Exactly. Perfect casting.


Ira Madison III: It, like Burn After Reading, is one of my it’s in my favorite genre of films. When the plot starts to unspool, when someone accidentally someone accidentally gets shot.


Louis Virtel: Like that one. Is it Scarlett Johansson Vegas movie?


Ira Madison III: Hmm. What movie is that?


Louis Virtel: Fun night? I get that confused with like, the other one that’s just like it. Yeah, it’s Scarlett Johansson. Like Kate McKinnon and stuff.


Ira Madison III: Oh Rough Night.


Louis Virtel: Rough night.


Ira Madison III: Rough Night by Lucia Anello.


Louis Virtel: Yes. Yes. Hacks fame.


Ira Madison III: Hacks. Yeah. She wrote it with her husband, Paul Downs. I love both of them. That movie is great. But getting back to actors who we think of taking things for a check, I feel like traditionally. Before the Marvel machine, you would assume those movies would be like like Jim Carrey doing like Mr. Popper’s Penguins.


Louis Virtel: Correct, yes.


Ira Madison III: You know like doing like doing like a goofy kids movie. And actors would always be like, I wanted to do something that my kids could watch with me. I’m like, that’s a lie.


Louis Virtel: Yeah. Also, we’re not like we’re not like running out of movies for children and adults. So its not like I have to get this one down on paper, otherwise the whole genre is fucked. But no, I would say a good nexus of money grab and what you’re talking about is Glenn Close in 101 Dalmatians which the scripting leaves something to be desired. But obviously it’s just, you know, a wall of paint that we want to look at what the costumes and Glenn shrieking, which she then primed on damages, which was also a show about a villain shrieking. But that was, I thought, pretty good news. Meanwhile, mostly what you get is like Cate Blanchett in Cinderella or Cate Blanchett in Thor Ragnarok, which is to say, all right, we’re going to play with the fondness of their features. We’re going to let them camp it up. But also, you’re going to be begging for those moments. And but when they’re not on screen, you’re going to be like, why the hell am I here? That said, people loved Thor Ragnarok. I didn’t get it at all.


Ira Madison III: I love it. I stan.


Louis Virtel: Obviously she probably wanted to do something with Taika. They’re from, you know, that part of the world.


Ira Madison III: That part of the world.


Louis Virtel: Yeah. Convicts land, as I call it. No laws, just vibes.


Ira Madison III: That’s a good example. I would say. There’s a few actors who who I feel like have never really done that.


Louis Virtel: Well, Cate Blanchett is a pretty interesting example because she’s been prestige her entire career. So she really hasn’t had to do this, I don’t think. But.


Ira Madison III: Uh huh. And I think maybe if you’re a woman, you sort of have to do them a bit more like Leonardo DiCaprio has ever had to do a non prestige film. Since. Right. Since. Since he blew up, you know, his the beginning of his career has the like Romeo and Juliet. It’s like the Titanic, which, you know, no one knew that that film was going to be as epic as it was. It was like it was over budget and too long and then like the man in iron mask and shit. But like the beach, I assumed he probably thought was going to be prestige. If there are 30 people who love going to New York, I’m one of the people who loves it. If there are 20, I am one of the people who loves that. If there’s one person who loves Gangs of New York, it is me.


Louis Virtel: Did you know that if you love a movie, it has nothing to do with being in a room with other people who like. Or don’t like it?


Ira Madison III: That’s not what Gaga told me.


Louis Virtel: Something about your spatial cognition is off.


Ira Madison III: Anyway, I am. I feel like I’m constantly the one defender of Gangs of New York, is what I’m saying.


Louis Virtel: Oh, sure. Well, do you know what I think is one of the most noteworthy cash grabs? And I assume it paid well over the past few years is Isabelle Huppert in Greta.


Ira Madison III: I think she liked that movie.


Louis Virtel: She had the heat from Elle. She had the heat from Elle, and they had to do something with her. They’re like, all right, well, this is a terrifying French woman who can play anything. What can we do? And they gave her this movie and they were like, Look, here’s the upside. You have a memorable character. You get to absolutely ruin Chloe Grace Moretz’s day, which I’m sure she signed right then and then, but otherwise it’s so one dimensionally villain esque where as most of Isabelle Huppert’s roles are like, not only do they have like a layer of eerie, but then something else happens and they’re like really vulnerable. But, you know, her characters are really complex and difficult and strange, whereas this woman is just an asshole.


Ira Madison III: That movie was so good.


Louis Virtel: I guess it kind of worked out. Did you say so good? Because I. I thought it was.


Ira Madison III: So good to watch.


Louis Virtel: It needed to. It needed to it needed way more Isabelle in it.


Ira Madison III: That’s fair. I mean when she spits the gum in her hair? Iconic


Louis Virtel: Yeah. That’s pretty funny.


Ira Madison III: Isabelle Huppert standing outside of a restaurant staring at Chloe Grace Moretz for, like, 24 hours. Iconic. Being told by the police, “there’s nothing we can do. She’s just standing there.”


Louis Virtel: Also, the scam she runs where people pick up her bag that she purposely leaves on the subway. Clever.


Ira Madison III: Yeah. I mean, I don’t know if I’d return it to her.


Louis Virtel: No, right. Now I have a purse. Great.


Ira Madison III: Yeah. I guess the problem with this too, is figuring out whether or not a film is like. What someone thought a film was going to be. Right. Like, I would never call Troy a cash grab. Like Brad Pitt during Troy. Like, I wouldn’t call that a cash grab, you know, that was like that seemed like it was going to be a big, like, epic. Like, it seemed like all the brokers in that film, like, were really, like, down for the cause for that film.


Louis Virtel: Yeah.


Ira Madison III: I liked Troy.


Louis Virtel: No, because I mean.


Ira Madison III: I don’t remember any of the plot.


Louis Virtel: No. I remember watching it back and thinking, Oh, this movie looks like a fucking screensaver. But at the same time, sometimes the screensaver you get is Avatar, which is the hugest, hugest movie ever. So.


Ira Madison III: Oh, yeah. Okay. First of all, Avatar 2, which this is not going to make any sense to you, but I’ve I’ve called it the the Chateau Charade of Films.


Louis Virtel: Go on.


Ira Madison III: Because Real Housewives of Atlanta has this Shereé Whitfield is a Real Housewife of Atlanta. And years ago, she was building her home, Chateau Shereé, and it took basically ten years. She’s back on the show now this season and we’ve finally seen Chateau Sheree and it’s gorgeous, but it took ten years to make. Like years ago, Nene on the like, the show was like at a reunion, made a joke where she called it Neverland. She was like to me, it’s a Neverland. What am I going to go visit? Sticks? And that’s how I thought about Avatar for years. Like the fact that I was sitting in Doctor Strange and I saw a trailer for Avatar. I was like, Oh, I guess this movie is happening.


Louis Virtel: I just think like the amount of time spent on it is so funny because what you ultimately get is a movie that looks like the illustration on a box of colored pencils. You know, like. Look at the water. Yeah. There’s grass.


Ira Madison III: I also watched the trailer and was like, who are these people? I can’t tell if they’re the same people from the first movie.


Louis Virtel: Yeah.


Ira Madison III: It’s like it’s the way of the water, right? I’m like, Yeah, I couldn’t tell if they’re the same people from the original movie. I was like, Where’s Sully?


Louis Virtel: Right. And also like now the words Sam Worthington are back in my head and it’s like, that’s way too much 2009 culture. Like, suddenly I’m rooting for Keri Hilson again. You’re taking me back.


Ira Madison III: And now I feel like I’m going to have to rewatch Avatar. And I famously did not like that movie.


Louis Virtel: No, of course, I mean, it was it was goggles. It was a movie about wearing goggles. Do you have any favorite cash grab actor roles that you think worked out or spectacularly did not work out?


Ira Madison III: You know what? Nicole Kidman, who we discuss with Julie Torres.


Louis Virtel: Yes.


Ira Madison III: Batman forever.


Louis Virtel: Great performance.


Ira Madison III: I feel like those were like the I feel like I loved the era, like the pre bar vote, like the the era where like you didn’t do a superhero movie like that or like an action movie where you play like, like for especially for women, right? Where they play like the love interest and it’s like, cool, got my check, but also got to do something fun.


Louis Virtel: Yeah. Right. And it’ll play on cable for years. I was gonna say about one time I was home for Christmas and on TBS they were playing Batman forever. And of course I was at my parents house. So like motion smoothing was on the television. And when you watch the movie, it really looks like it costs $15. It’s just it’s like it took me. So back to what a superhero movie used to be, which was, you know, maybe a little slimy and comic book looking and dark and. Quote unquote, noir. Noirish. But really, for the most part. Stupid, really? Like, just go in hard, stupid and everybody in it hamming it up.


Ira Madison III: Hmm. You know, I was going to suggest that, like, a Kate Winslet has never done a movie like this, but that I remember it. She was in movie 43.


Louis Virtel: Oh, my God, what a movie 43. Were a whole bunch of people in that?


Ira Madison III: Yeah and 43 people saw it.


Louis Virtel: Right.


Ira Madison III: She’s in it and 43 people saw the film Louis. Yeah. It was like, I think maybe just because of the directors, like, I think Elizabeth Banks directed it. Like, it’s just a bunch of weird short films that are bad, but everyone’s in it. You know, Seth Macfarlane, Dennis Quaid, Greg Kinnear commented, I wouldn’t want to be at that dinner party.


Louis Virtel: The era of just Carmen being in everything. I guess we’re still at it. We’re still in the common era.


Ira Madison III: And actually girl, like I’m looking up the cast of Avatar two and Kate Winslet is in it.


Louis Virtel: James Cameron. I mean, these actresses stay thankful and for better or for worse.


Ira Madison III: You know what? I mean Megan Fox got out. Wait. It wasn’t James Cameron she was fighting with, was it? She was fighting with um?


Louis Virtel: No. Michael Bay.


Ira Madison III: Michael Bay. Huh. How could I ever do that? Confuse Michael Bay and James Cameron. I mean, they’re. They’re so different. I feel like that girl holding up the belts in The Devil Wears Prada. I would say that Bad Boys is at least as good as true lies. Um, you know, I feel like, but also like cash grabs are obviously actors that like, you know, prestige sort of like, I guess white actors get to do, um, easier, you know, like, I feel like everything’s circumscribe if you’re, like, you know, Viola Davis before she got her prestige and starting a pursing her lips as Michelle Obama.


Louis Virtel: Right? Right. Though you know what I don’t know about cash grab, but actually I guess I would call it this like I remember that in Music of the Heart, the Meryl Streep movie where she plays the violin and teaches violin. Angela Bassett is like the principal who I don’t know. I don’t know if her angle is you can’t be teaching violin at this school or please teach violin like that at this school. I don’t know what she does, but it’s not nearly juicy enough for the Angela Bassett we know and love. So it must be some version of that, right?


Ira Madison III: Hmm I mean, or maybe she just wasn’t getting roles then.


Louis Virtel: That’s what I mean. No, I mean, potentially, yeah.


Ira Madison III: Um, I will say that I have never seen Music of the Heart and I reference it.


Louis Virtel: Its exactly what you expect.


Ira Madison III: I reference it all the time, but only because to me, the movie Music of the Heart is just the N’Sync video.


Louis Virtel: Right? Which is. Meryl’s good. I do think that song might be the best thing about it.


Ira Madison III: This. This poster is wild. No, you know what? I don’t think it’s. I think, like this was Angela trying to raise her profile because this is a Wes Craven movie, but it’s like the poster is like Angela Bassett in a her best, like, respectable church wig. And Meryl Streep is in the center with your curly hair, and her one hand is caressing. Um, Gloria Estefan, who’s on the other side of her, they’re all, like, smiling, like white women do, but their eyes are closed, and Meryl’s like, eyes are slightly open. But this is just like white women laughing the movie. And I’m sure Angela was like, Let me get in on that shit. Let me get on this shit with Meryl Streep. Okay, let me get up in this Meryl Streep shit.


Louis Virtel: Mm hmm. That was her signing the contract. As to her whole team.


Ira Madison III: She’s like, let me get in on this Meryl Streep shit.


Louis Virtel: Also, I wonder if she only signed on after Meryl signed on because you know who originally was supposed to do it? Madonna. And then she had creative differences with Wes Craven. And I’m sure Wes Craven’s creative difference was what if we get an actress. God love the woman.


Ira Madison III: I can’t imagine. And I’m sure Angela was like, I’m not doing that Madonna Shit.


Louis Virtel: Yeah. I want that Meryl Streep shit. Though she and Madonna were born on the same day, famously, August 16th, 1958.


Ira Madison III: Yeah. You know what? Both Leo’s. Both icons.


Louis Virtel: Living it. Yes.


Ira Madison III: Yeah. I did not know that they were the same exact age, though.


Louis Virtel: Just like Meryl Streep and Elizabeth Warren.


Ira Madison III: Where? Okay, you know what? I would like to see a movie that is like Angela Bassett and Madonna, just like them growing up, but like they were both born on the same day. So, like, I’m like, what does this mean culturally?


Louis Virtel: It sounds like you’re describing you must remember this, you know, like, oh, Jean Seberg and Jane Fonda. Let’s compare.


Ira Madison III: Yeah. Or like the Elizabeth Warren. I mean, I also feel like that’s just a very Ira / Louis movie.


Louis Virtel: Yeah.


Ira Madison III: Angela Bassett half. The Madonna half. And then it melds together.


Louis Virtel: We can both write our separate parts and then just submit them to somebody who stitches them together. And so it’s like, collaborative, but not really. Which is my favorite.


Ira Madison III: And then the movie ends with like Music of the Heart. And you think they’re finally about to meet.


Louis Virtel: Right.


Ira Madison III: But then. Then, of course, Wes Craven’s like, goodbye. And then Meryl joins. And then that’s history.


Louis Virtel: Right. The last line is, I have a dinner and she walks off.


Ira Madison III: Yeah, because I can’t imagine Angela Bassett has ever met Madonna. Maybe they’ve met. They’ve, they’ve never, they’ve, they’ve never shared a conversation.


Louis Virtel: I don’t know. Yeah. I don’t think Angela would have too much time and I wouldn’t recommend she have the conversation now either. So just stay on the set of 911. It’s better there.


Ira Madison III: I mean, that does remind me of that movie that I had said that I’d wanted to make on it years ago about it was Madonna in the nineties collecting black people.


Louis Virtel: Her just calling up Big Daddy Kane. She’s like, Guess what? You can be in the sex book. No, wait, quickly. I know we’ve been criticized for talking about Madonna too much in this show.


Ira Madison III: Have we?


Louis Virtel: Let me rephrase that. I’ve been criticized for talking about Madonna too much in the show. Did you know recently that Ingrid Cesari or Cazares? Madonna was like main woman who she still friends with posted a thing recently about how Sandra Bernhard is still mad after all these years that she’s not in the sex book. And that’s the reason they’re not friends anymore.


Ira Madison III: Wow. Really?


Louis Virtel: I mean, the sex book was fine. I if I was senator to I don’t need to be in it. I’m already in, like, the king of comedy. I have my own standup special. Anyway. Strange.


Ira Madison III: She wanted her Sandra Bernhussy in that book. Okayyy


Louis Virtel: Okay. Okay. Okay.


Ira Madison III: Do you think she, like, took Polaroids and sent em to Madonna and was like Madge. You know? What do you think?


Louis Virtel: I have a couple of ideas, yeah.


Ira Madison III: She’s like, Well, I’ll get to Sandra.


Louis Virtel: And also, you know, I think Madonna had also moved into her Rosie O’Donnell era at that point. So maybe there wasn’t room for two, you know, queer comics. Maybe it was just a one at the time thing.


Ira Madison III: Yeah. All right.


Louis Virtel: Rosie famously not in the sex book. I don’t mean to say she took her place or anything, but.


Ira Madison III: I would have loved to see Rosie O’Donnell in the sex book.


Louis Virtel: Fuck yeah. And her outfit from Exit to Eden, where she’s wearing that dominatrix outfit. Guys, look that movie up, actually. Nobody makes funnier jokes about Exit to Eden than Rosie O’Donnell. Look them up.


Ira Madison III: Have I seen Exit to Eden?


Louis Virtel: It’s her and like Dan Aykroyd and.


Ira Madison III: Dana Delaney?


Louis Virtel: Whom we. Oh, my God. I love Dana Delaney. And she’s obsessed with old movies and she’s friends with all the gay guys. I know, but not me. Dana, it’s me, Louis. You should be friends with me.


Ira Madison III: She should be friends with me. I’m the only one who said her tour de force brought on Desperate Housewives.


Louis Virtel: Well, I was too busy watching China Beach, her two time Emmy winning role. So it looks like I won.


Ira Madison III: We’ll see who’s the judge of that.


Louis Virtel: Okay. All right. Well, Dana, you’re invited to come on.


Ira Madison III: Yeah. Let’s get Dana on Keep It and we’ll see who she respects more.


Louis Virtel: [Laughter] That should be the point of all our interviews. Let’s get Julio back in here. Who did you come away with more respect for?


Ira Madison III: This poster is iconic. How have I not seen this movie? I’m watching Exit to Eden. I got to do it. Oh, okay.


Louis Virtel: Which by the way, is probably a cash grab to get back to the conversation we were allegedly having.


Ira Madison III: I will watch Exit to Eden and we will talk about it next week.


Louis Virtel: Okay. Good news.


Ira Madison III: Yeah. When did this come out?


Louis Virtel: 93.


Ira Madison III: 93. You know, there’s a lot going on in 93.


Louis Virtel: Maybe a little after because it’s around her Sleepless in Seattle era, for sure.


Ira Madison III: Rosie’s?


Louis Virtel: Yeah.


Ira Madison III: You know what? We should. Yeah, we should just have a whole little Rosie retrospective.


Louis Virtel: Yeah. How about she get on this show? Yeah.


Ira Madison III: Okay yeah.


Louis Virtel: This is me just screaming to the ether. I don’t really know how to email people.


Ira Madison III: Iman is in this movie?


Louis Virtel: Iman has a strange filmography because Iman is in Out of Africa.


Ira Madison III: Okay, you know what? I’ve got? I’ve got a lot of things to revisit.


Louis Virtel: Speaking of propping up Meryl Streep, wow. A theme has emerged.


Ira Madison III: I don’t know what the fuck we were talking about today, but when we’re back. We chat with Julio Torres.




Ira Madison III: He’s a former SNL writer, the co-creator of HBO’s Los Espookys, and now an author with the new book, I Want to Be a Vase, which is out June 7th. Please welcome to Keep It, Julio Torres.


Julio Torres: Hi, Ira.


Ira Madison III: Congrats on this book, which is which is very cute, which I what I need to come up with a different word. The cute because cute sounds awful when people say it. I feel like.


Julio Torres: It is a children’s book. So I think it’s fine that it’s if it if it were my like tell all autobiography and you called it cute, I think that would be different. But, you know, it is meant to be it is meant to be cute.


Louis Virtel: Your trauma as adorable. Yes. Yeah.


Ira Madison III: Um this I feel like was this inspired by a you’ve talked before about this SNL sketch that you wanted to do that you never got to do, which was about like a chandelier that I think like a janitor fell in love with the chandelier or the chandelier fell in love with the janitor. Or is this just like something that like you’ve always been interested in the interior lives of inanimate objects.


Julio Torres: You know? No, I think I think that I have all of like three ideas in this house, and I actually had it. I actually haven’t thought about that sketch. But yes, it’s a recurring theme to imbue inanimate objects with with inner lives.


Louis Virtel: Which, by the way, you did to, of course, great effect in your My Favorite Shape special a couple of years ago. I can’t believe that’s already two years ago. Life is moving too quick. I know, but do you have I mean, I have to ask about the inanimate objects thing. Do you literally, just like I imagine you could just look at things around you right now and you pick it up and it’s a person to you in some shape or form.


Julio Torres: Well, I. I don’t know. It’s something that I’ve had. I think I think that we all had that when we were kids to some extent. And then I just never really shook that or something. And I, I don’t know. I think that I’m very, very interested in like imagining the life of something or someone else. And it’s, like, not presumptuous to do it with an inanimate object. It’s sort of safe to do it with an inanimate object, and it just sort of lends itself to metaphor or in a way that’s, like, easy and accessible. And it just so happened to be also accessible for. For kids.


Ira Madison III: Mm hmm. And now, actually, other weird question. I keep having the Charlie Zach song like new shapes stuck in my head. Like, every time I think of your work because of the bass and the shapes special. Like, is. Is that an artist you care about? Is that is that a song that you feel like has resonated for you because of like the work that you do?


Julio Torres: No, it does not resonate with me. Okay but I don’t.


Ira Madison III: See that’s me imagining your interior life.


Julio Torres: I don’t know. Yes. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Yeah. Which you are more than allowed to do. No, I no. I can’t say that that has been an influence. I do. Not influenced but do care about Charlie Erickson as much as they care about all my fellow human beings.


Louis Virtel: Your argument is she is technically a human being and therefore.


Julio Torres: Right. Right. Someone we want to find in common who is Matt Whitaker.


Louis Virtel: Oh, yes. Who? By the way, I was just thinking that some of your delivery reminds me of Matt Whitaker. That’s very crazy that you bring him up anyway. Go ahead.


Julio Torres: Well, well, he is very he’s very he’s very slow. And the way that he speaks and you can tell that he’s he thinks every sentence.


Ira Madison III: Yeah. It’s a methodical conversation.


Louis Virtel: Yeah. Yeah. Mm hmm.


Julio Torres: But he he was saying something like they were he was trying to come up with, like, a formula to measure the the success of a of a pop star. And he thinks that pop stars are either. Loved, tolerated or hated by parents and kids. So he would say, for example, Ariana will have a long career because she’s loved by kids but tolerated by parents.


Ira Madison III: Mm hmm.


Julio Torres: And I wonder what Charlie I think loved and tolerated. So that’s. Yeah.


Louis Virtel: I also can’t really picture parents, like, noticing or even know in a way, there’s something specifically wired to gay men to really like.


Julio Torres: Yeah right.


Louis Virtel: Cherish her, yeah.


Ira Madison III: Your parents are probably be like, why is the garbage disposal on you? You’ll be like, Oh, no, I was listening to vroom vroom.


Julio Torres: Yeah, yeah, yeah.


Ira Madison III: But, she does. So I’ve seen this recent two or three times because I’m a I’m a dad, but I was most shocked by took the train to San Diego with like three friends to see a show there. And I was really shocked by how young the audience was at that show. And so I had no idea that she actually does have the like kids fan base.


Julio Torres: Yeah. Yeah. And that and that that not to be crude about it, but that’s where the money is, right?


Ira Madison III: Of course.


Julio Torres: That’ts where the.


Ira Madison III: Yeah.


Julio Torres: Because then that’s where the Twitter army is.


Louis Virtel: When I saw Katy Perry in Vegas, it didn’t occur to me until I watched it. And it was a ton of kids I could not believe. And of course, it’s like a very cheeky show too. So I guess like some of it would fly over their heads, but at the same time, it’s everything’s Nickelodeon color. So it’s also also for them, you know?


Julio Torres: Yeah, I would have I would have assumed that for her, median age was higher than than Charlie’s.


Louis Virtel: You’re right. So, of course, it’s like Vegas, too. So people are just kind of wandering into shows anyway. It’s very nebulous.


Julio Torres: Yeah, yeah, yeah.


Louis Virtel: Yeah. Of course. I need to ask about the news that you are or have worked with Tilda Swinton on an A24 movie. And at first when I heard this news, I thought of what a perfect pairing like Tilda Swinton stirred lesbians like four of my favorite shapes. You know what I’m saying? Like, it works out that Julio would work with her. And then I remembered you have an entire joke about her in your special. And I was wondering if that’s where I do.


Julio Torres: Yeah, I that is not where it began. But she, when I met her, she was familiar with the joke and, and definitely enjoyed the joke and she was familiar with the special too. But yeah, I mean, she’s, she’s truly also one of my favorite scenes and it’s for like, you know, to get to work with one of your heroines is, is great and she’s she’s so she’s actually very warm and very accessible.


Louis Virtel: No, she seems to me seems very normal as a person and like tuned in even though we like project this vision of like Bjork and Brandy are onto everything she does.


Julio Torres: It’s her features, I think. Yeah, it’s it’s her for her tool that she knows how to, how to use very well. But yeah, no she’s, she’s highly perceptive and very in tune with the people around her and like the energy’s around her.


Ira Madison III: Speaking of Matt, I was listening to your Las Culturistas episode again recently, like your first one, and you mentioned that Nicole Kidman.


Julio Torres: You’re so, Ira, you’re so studied. You’re so researched. Its very impressive.


Ira Madison III: I feel like I feel like it’s my trauma from, like, years ago, like not being prepared for, like, an interview once, like, like when I was doing print journalism. And now since then, I’m like, I have to know everything.


Louis Virtel: Yeah, right.


Ira Madison III: But no. Well, so you said Nicole Kidman was one of your look like your favorite actress. Back then.  Is that.


Julio Torres: Yeah.


Ira Madison III: Is that still true? And that was when The Beguiled was coming out. Like it hadn’t even come out yet. So now I’m wondering what you think about the Post Beguiled Kidman era, like the era we’re in now?


Julio Torres: See, she is truly one of my favorites and she’ll try anything. She will do a big, cheesy, bad movie. And be sort of very transformative in it or she will take risks that feel like other. Others might be uncomfortable with them. Birth is one of my favorite movies.


Ira Madison III: Mm hmm.


Julio Torres: Uh, where she, uh. She believes that a little boy is the reincarnation of her husband and has this affair with the little boy. And it’s just her in a very short haircut, looking very cold dishes. She’s she. All of her characters are, like, very cold. They’re all. They’re all a little chilly.


Ira Madison III: Mm hmm.


Julio Torres: Uh Yeah, it’s I. Yeah, I really enjoy her. I haven’t seen The Northman yet, which I know she’s in.


Ira Madison III: She’s fucking great in The Northman, and I feel like The Northman is the people expected it to be. I think the studio expected to be like a gladiator, but the only people I hear talking about the Northmen are gay men, and they love it.


Julio Torres: Yeah, the the poster is definitely misleading, because when I saw the poster, I was like, Oh, I’ll never see this movie. Like, there’s nothing in this movie for me. And then there were the Bjork was in it, and I was like, Wait, now? Yeah. And now I hear it’s great.


Louis Virtel: That movie has like five angles on and gay fandom going, you know, we have the Skarsguard and then the Anya, which, whom I feel like is a specific gay pull in a way. And then of course the hook. Hook, and you get angry, Nicole, too, which we only get like every like four years at this point. Yeah. Also, I want to say about birth, that was the last time we employed the extent of and harsh as a terrifying plot device. Yes. I meant, you know.


Julio Torres: Yeah, yeah, yeah. She was great in that.


Ira Madison III: Well, so then how do you feel about her AMC ad?


Julio Torres: I, I think I love it. I eat it up. I.


Ira Madison III: It’s so much fun. It’s so, it’s so wild. It’s so well that something that pure and just like schlocky and just like obviously just an ad in AMC theaters now, it took gay people like like loving it. But I went to see Doctor Strange, and it wasn’t just like gays in the audience who are, like, obsessed with this trailer. Like, everyone seems to love it now.


Julio Torres: Yeah, it’s a it’s a beautiful it’s a beautiful document in camp. I saw I saw Doctor Strange also. And I mean, I was kind of confused because I’m not a I’m not a marvel person, but I do love a. A witchy antagonist, which is what drew me in. And because I went to see it with bone, and bone was like, No, no, no, you like it. It’s very Bring me the girl. That’s the whole movie. And I loved it. She was just like “bring me the girl by sundown and no one gets hurt” and it’s just like oh my God, who is this cuckoo lady. I love her.


Louis Virtel: I also feel like I’m the protagonist. It’s been a while since I saw the last doctor. Strange. I saw the first one. The one with Tilda. Is he not, like, somebody who, like, touches his temples and has visions? That seems pretty new to me, too.


Ira Madison III: I mean, that’s So Raven, Louis.


Louis Virtel: Oh, that was Raven-Symone, right? Yes.


Ira Madison III: I love that like the witch shit in it. Like Elizabeth Olsen, like, really took the movie for me. And it’s it’s weird because she’s supposed to be the villain, because I’m just like, you just want to see her being crazy here?


Julio Torres: You kust want to see her. And she’s obviously very liked, very pretty and very. She looks very young. Mm hmm. So seeing them, like, seeing them was like, no, she her eye shadow has to be really dark because they’re really evil here. Her eyeshadow gets so dark. Its like the heaviest lid. And then, of course. And then, of course, she has beach waves because God forbid a woman in a big movie doesn’t have beach waves. And its so bizarre. But, yeah, I loved her in it. Her voice is such a choice. I don’t know where that choice comes from, but I really love it.


Ira Madison III: Well, she’s supposed to be like Russian. She’s from like this country, Sokovia. So she’s supposed to be Russian-esque.


Julio Torres: Oh, so that’s an accent?


Ira Madison III: Yeah, it’s an accent. Mm hmm. She’s giving like.


Julio Torres: Sure, I’ll take it.


Ira Madison III: Of sort of like what I would imagine. Like, because, remember, you said, like, you also love. Like I Dream of Jeannie. I try to imagine, like, that’s what she would be like if if she were, like, really angry. Or maybe that’s what the. Maybe that’s the show, what the evil sister is.


Julio Torres: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Or like, I’m surprised they haven’t remade that remade on I Dream of Jeannie.


Ira Madison III: I think probably because people are like, what though?


Louis Virtel: That’s so interesting because.


Julio Torres: Thats a Nicole project also.


Ira Madison III: Yeah.


Julio Torres: But Bewitched was so convoluted. The plot of that movie was. So did you watch it? You remember? Yeah.


Ira Madison III: Bewitched. Bewitched to me had the feeling of a movie that was rewritten 10,000 times, because where they landed on it makes no sense and has nothing to do with just loving the original Bewitched.


Julio Torres: No. So in the in the movie Bewitched, the sitcom Bewitched exists. And Nicole Kidman is an actress on that sitcom. However, she is also a witch. Mm hmm. So it’s like, why? Why? Well.


Louis Virtel: In a way, it’s just maligning Elizabeth Montgomery. They’re like, that was a haunted person playing Samantha Stephens.


Ira Madison III: So I would watch a not convoluted.


Julio Torres: Was she? I don’t know anything about her.


Louis Virtel: No, she was just an ordinary actress. Yeah.


Julio Torres: Oh I thought there was dark Hollywood story that I didn’t know about.


Louis Virtel: She was the marshal of the gay pride parade in West Hollywood once with Dick Sargeant, who later came out the second Darrin.


Ira Madison III: Mm.


Julio Torres: Oh, great.


Louis Virtel: So she’s pretty cool.


Julio Torres: She knows the gay.


Louis Virtel: Yeah. She was responsible for Paul Lynde getting the role on that show, though, so she also helped a gay.


Ira Madison III: Yeah. Half the cast was gay. I feel like half the cast of Bewitched was gay.


Julio Torres: I’m sure the creators we gay, I’m sure the writers were gay. Are you kidding?


Ira Madison III: Yeah, we are very much due for like I Dream of Jeannie revival, though I think that I think it’s what those are like. Two of the main shows that millennials watched in reruns as Kids and people would people would tune in for like a I Dream of Jeannie moment.


Julio Torres: I’m sure Zendaya has a script. I’m sure Olivia Rodrigo has a script. I’m sure. I’m sure they’re all sitting on all of their nightstands like I mean. I’m sure.


Louis Virtel: Barbara Eden’s still with us, by the way. So you even still get the cameo, which is exciting.


Julio Torres: You could you could do a Wonder Woman sort of situation where she cameoed. Right? The original Wonder Woman?


Louis Virtel: Yeah. Lynda Carter.


Julio Torres: Yeah.


Ira Madison III: Yeah.


Julio Torres: That’s. That’s another performance. That’s fun. Kal-El. No.


Ira Madison III: You mean Gal Gadot’s original Gal Gadot’s performance?


Julio Torres: Yeah, yeah. Yeah.


Ira Madison III: Yeah She. She is. Her. Now that. That voice is a choice because I don’t know what accent she was trying to do


Julio Torres: I don’t believe its a choice at all. I think I think that’s I think that’s her voice. Because I also saw Death on the Nile.


Ira Madison III: Okay. I was about to say Death on the Nile. And she is she is she has one voice.


Julio Torres: Yeah.


Ira Madison III: She just, no accent work for Gal Gadot.


Julio Torres: I’m. I’m going to take a nap.


Ira Madison III: Julio. It was great to have you here.


Julio Torres: Thank you for having me.


Ira Madison III: Yeah, I mean, your book. Your book is like it’s also, like, very wonderful. Like, I can’t wait to actually get it and, like, have it on my coffee table.


Julio Torres: Yeah, it’s a beautiful object, and I think it’s a children’s book that doubles as a coffee table book.


Ira Madison III: Mm hmm.


Louis Virtel: We rarely get that hybrid. Thank you for innovating with them.


Ira Madison III: I’m obsessed with the concept of a coffee table book anyway. Mostly just because I like. I wonder who reads them. And I feel like the people who read them, at least my guests who read them are I’m usually late. And so if I invite friends over for a dinner party or something to like, I’m still getting ready. That first person that arrives is always the person who’s sitting there going through it. Like, I feel like that those are the only people who’ve ever read that huge ass Rihanna book that I bought.


Louis Virtel: Right?


Ira Madison III: Like the big Rihanna coffee table book.


Julio Torres: You mean, like, actually read the text? People flip through it, but actually read the text?


Ira Madison III: Yeah. It’s like you got to be really bored. Or, like, you’re the only person there to be, like, going through that.


Louis Virtel: Oh, no. If I get to a party too early, I like, I guess I’m learning about Richard Avedon today or whatever.


Julio Torres: Yeah.


Louis Virtel: Any way, thank you for coming.


Ira Madison III: Yes. Which is all to say. Yeah. Yeah. Which is all to say that many people will be reading your book while waiting for me to get dressed.


Julio Torres: Great.


Because I’m usually 20 to 30 minutes late.


Julio Torres: Perfect. Great. Well, thank you.


Ira Madison III: Yeah. Thank you.


Louis Virtel: I Want to be a Vase by Julio Torres and illustrated by Julian Glander will be available from Atheneum books for young readers on June 7th, wherever books are sold.


Ira Madison III: Up next, Keep It.


Ira Madison III: And we’re back with our favorite segment of the episode. It is Keep It, Louis. What is your keep it this week? Is it going to hurt my heart?


Louis Virtel: I don’t think it is. I think you’re going to be in full agreement.


Ira Madison III: Okay.


Louis Virtel: Keep it to the Lady Gaga Top Gun theme. Hold my hand.


Ira Madison III: Oh, thank God.


Louis Virtel: Put your paws down. Woof


Ira Madison III: It is awful. It is. I. Here’s the thing. You know, I’m a Tom Cruise enthusiast.


Louis Virtel: Yes. Diagnosably. Correct.


Ira Madison III: Yeah. You know, like, I’m probably like have Scientology leanings. We don’t have to get into that yet.


Louis Virtel: Your thetan count is all over the place. Yeah.


Ira Madison III: But I’m also a little monster. I don’t. I do not get what went wrong here because the original Top Gun soundtrack is like is like eighties bombast and camp like Berlin. Kenny Loggins like that is. That seems like everything Gaga was giving us on Born This Way.


Louis Virtel: Yeah. I will say this. Something major that goes wrong here is you cannot make a non song into a song by over singing. And that is what is occurring here. Every once in a while, Gaga is like seemingly obsessed with, like, letting, you know, she has a really good voice. It’s like, oh, my God, I’ve been paying attention for even 10 minutes, let alone 15 years. Of course, you have a great voice, but it’s like first there’s like no instrumentation on the song, and I think it’s supposed to sound spare. And like, there’s a lot of room, like, you know, as quote unquote epic. But what it really sounds is under produced. Like, I’m just listening to a borderline a cappella performance and. It’s, of course, chockablock with clichés to just nothing you would want to scream out loud. You know, like, obviously, Hootie and the Blowfish has covered the sentiment before. Yeah, it’s just. And also, it could not be charting less. I saw it on the bubbling under hot 100 chart. That’s right. There’s an entire chart about not being on the chart and that’s where she is.


Ira Madison III: Oh, I know that. I listen to Sky Ferreira. Listen, I. this song is constructed so weird to me. The opening with the opening sounds like they’re, like bleeding goats or something.


Louis Virtel: Yeah. Oh, yeah. Which. So start off with just pure abrasiveness. That’s amusing to somebody, but we don’t know what that’s about, so.


Ira Madison III: And then. Nothing. Yeah. It seems under produced. It doesn’t have, like, a fun melody. Like, like every song that she made for a star is born. Fantastic.


Louis Virtel: Outside of I Don’t Like the Final One, which I also just think is squelching and cliches. The I’ll Never Love Again or whenever that’s called.


Ira Madison III: Yes that one. I don’t mind that one, but I feel like, you know, like it’s this is definitely no shallow.


Louis Virtel: Excuse me. That the song should be flattered. We just mentioned it in the same sentence as Shallow I.


Ira Madison III: This song is now Take My Breath Away. The cover by Jessica Simpson.


Louis Virtel: Oh, my God. When. When Jessica Simpson did that cover, I remember thinking, oh, this is horrible. And then you would hear, Take my breath away and everybody’s wedding, like, because they heard it from Jessica Simpson. And yes, something’s wrong with my generation. So.


Ira Madison III: That is actually a really interesting reversal in that the Jessica Simpson version made a lot of people from our age group get into the original song by Berlin.


Louis Virtel: Right. But I think.


Ira Madison III: Because you can’t play Jess, you can’t play that at your wedding. You can’t play Jessica Simpson’s. Take my breath away. I mean, but I would.


Louis Virtel: I think. But I think the reason girls my generation liked it was because Jessica Simpson sort of sounds like it’s it’s like like like most people. She isn’t a brilliant singer but wants to give it her all. And that’s what these girls sound like when they sing. So they were really into that.


Ira Madison III: Yeah. Well, anyway. Anyway, the original the original the original Top Gun soundtrack is fantastic. And everyone should go and listen to it. I mean.


Louis Virtel: Anyway Yeah.


Ira Madison III: Teena marie.


Louis Virtel: What Teena marie song is in it?.


Ira Madison III: Lead me on.


Louis Virtel: I love almost every Teena marie single outside of some of the soupyer ballads, exceptional. Square biz, lover girl, behind the groove.


Ira Madison III: There’s Lover Boy, Miami Sound Machine, Cheap Trick. This is an album.


Louis Virtel: Yeah, right. I miss man. Soundtracks were just, like, perfectly selected. Sequential. The track listing. I miss track listings.


Ira Madison III: Well, you know, my theory is the original top gun’s a horrible movie, and the soundtrack is saying, if this song is so, if this Gaga song is so bad about Top Gun, Maverick might actually be great.


Louis Virtel: Oh, that does fascinate me. I just saw a clip with Glen Powell in it. I didn’t know he was giving smoldering hot these days.


Ira Madison III: He’s always been giving smoldering hot. Did you not watch Scream Queens?


Louis Virtel: Yeah. Was he brutally hot on that? Hold on, Glen Powell is also the one in that Netflix assistance rom com with Zoey Deutch, right?


Ira Madison III: I think so.


Louis Virtel: Yeah.


Ira Madison III: I mean, I know that he’s the hot pilot who’s not racist and hidden figures.


Louis Virtel: Oh, right, right. So he’s like 11th billed in that movie.


Ira Madison III: Yeah.


Louis Virtel: But because in retrospect, that movie is mostly about Kirsten Dunst being like, I hate these black scientists.


Ira Madison III: And Harrison Ford. Take that aside. It wasn’t Harrison Ford. It seems like it should be Dennis Quaid, but it’s actually Kevin Costner. Ah, that’s right. Kevin Costner. Dennis Quaid would be putting the sign up. I think Dennis Quaid would be putting the whites only sign up at this point in his career, in his life.


Louis Virtel: Now, by the way, I have to think about how Kevin Costner’s like the world’s most popular television star right now. And it’s a show I’ll never see. So, anyway, perplexing. Ira, what is your Keep It this week?


Ira Madison III: My Keep It, I know we talked about this last week a bit with the Met gala, but my keep it goes to people’s obsession with Marilyn Monroe.


Louis Virtel: Ugh.


Ira Madison III: Specifically.


Louis Virtel: I hate it.


Ira Madison III: So Kim Kardashian wore the dress that Marilyn Monroe wore when she serenaded JFK. And whatever we get out, we already talked about how she, like, starved herself so she could fit into this dress, etc.. And then. she revealed that she wore another Marilyn Monroe dress. After the Met gala. It was a a sequined gown of hers that she’d wore to the Golden Globes in 62. And I just want to know, why are you playing this dead woman’s closet?


Louis Virtel: I’m wearing the gown her mother was wearing when she gave birth to Marilyn Monroe.


Ira Madison III: Marilyn Monroe needs to padlock her crypt. Okay, Can ghosts file restraining orders? I have a serious question. Like I. It is. I get when some people like do the re wearing some an iconic dress bomber. Right. But I’m like mm hmm. I don’t know. This. And when she got the lock of her hair from Ripley’s Believe It or Not. And then let’s talk about the fact that, like for her birthday one year, Connie, I got her the hologram of her father. You can’t give this to let the dead lie in peace. Because I don’t like it. I don’t like it.


Louis Virtel: It’s spooky. Yeah. Now, here’s the thing about Marilyn Monroe. We simply have. Discuss everything there is to discuss about Marilyn Monroe. And I know there’s an entire block of Twitter that’s ready to jump out of the woodwork and tell you the fucking things you didn’t know about Marilyn Monroe, that she was asexual or she couldn’t orgasm, or all the personal details. That was shocking. You have Marilyn Monroe that you somebody talking about Marilyn Monroe needs to know.


Ira Madison III: I think you’re just reading my Wikipedia, Louis.


Louis Virtel: Yeah, right. There are several Marilyn Monroe movies that are, of course, great. Some Like It Hot, which we talked about with Amber Ruffin, a bus stop. I enjoy Asphalt Jungle. There’s a whole bunch. She’s great. And all about Eve. Let’s just be done with this. I’m sorry. There’s just more interesting people. I think the thing that fascinates people about Marilyn Monroe annoys me, which is just like you. Oh, she was. She she was so magnetic, but she was also so sad. It’s like that’s not a complex vision of a human being, you know? It’s like you’re it’s like it’s like the Susan Boyle thing. Like, you can’t believe somebody who looks a certain way can sing. Well, it’s just. It’s, like, not complex. That’s all I can say about that.


Ira Madison III: That’s fair. You know? And I will also say what always happens on those, like, Twitter accounts is always a simplification.


Louis Virtel: Right.


Ira Madison III: This is one viral tweet about how Ella Fitzgerald could perform at like one of the hottest nightclubs in L.A., you know, because she was black. Until Marilyn Monroe, who enjoyed her, said that she would sit in the front row, get a table every night for that week that Ella performed to make like a media frenzy. And that would, you know, like help her be able to perform in bigger clubs. This is true. But the racial element is like completely fabricated because black people had played in this club before. The the thing that like Dorothy Dandridge, I think I pointed out, like in an interview once, was the fact that like Ella Fitzgerald was like fat, you know, like and she also wasn’t like the conventionally attractive, like a Dorothy Dandridge or like a Eartha KITT type. Eartha KITT had performed in that club before, you know, so it was more like them being like, we want, like a sexy pop jazz singer, too, because, like, Ella was like a true jazz singer and, like, wasn’t, you know, sexy in these people’s eyes. So they were like, why are we going to book her to perform? And that is why Marilyn did it. And it did create a frenzy. And then Ella never had to play small clubs again. But, you know, it’s just like but there’s always these things in viral tweets like that where someone just sort of, like, will either leave something out or just like make up something, and then it becomes part. Like, we all think it’s true.


Louis Virtel: Yeah. It becomes this convenient part of a tweetstorm that we just sign up for and believe in. And even though we have no idea who is posting this like, they have no history of credibility otherwise.


Ira Madison III: The other thing is that Ella said that they were friends, but they didn’t have a close friendship because Marilyn was a drug addict. And Ella was like, I’m not trying to get close to that. You imagine after the show, she’s like. Oh, you. After the show she’s like, you want some you want some uppers. And Ella’s like, I’m good baby.


Louis Virtel: I am good. Ella’s like, I have to go live into the nineties. So. Gonna. Bye Bye. There’s an awesome duet with Ella Fitzgerald and Karen Carpenter where they do a whole medley of songs and it’s on YouTube and it’s near the end of Karen Carpenter’s life. So you may it can be a bracing watch in certain ways, but there’s a point when Karen Carpenter is singing and Ella Fitzgerald, you see her go so pretty and it’s like the grandma emerged, so.


Ira Madison III: Aw, not her and all these, you know, icon, iconic white women.


Louis Virtel: Right. I didn’t I didn’t know she was flanking so many of our tragic late 20th century grandams.


Ira Madison III: Hmmm. She would have loved Rita Ora. I just know that in my heart.


Louis Virtel: Can’t confirm it either way.


Ira Madison III: Do you like Monkey Business?


Louis Virtel: As in the film?


Ira Madison III: Yeah.


Louis Virtel: I don’t know that I ever saw it.


Ira Madison III: It was Cary Grant and Ginger Rogers and Marilyn Monroe. I think it’s pretty cute.


Louis Virtel: Oh, I’ve never seen that one. There’s another Marilyn Monroe movie. That’s good. Don’t bother to knock. That’s a good one.


Ira Madison III: Hmm.


Louis Virtel: Oh, of course. How to Marry a millionaire. Okay, never mind. Keep talking about Marilyn Monroe.


Ira Madison III: Louis has changed his mind.


Louis Virtel: Yeah. Prince and the Showgirl. Yeah.


Ira Madison III: That monkey business about Cary Grant trying to just develop a youth elixir.


Louis Virtel: Oh. The Peter Teal origin story I see.


Ira Madison III: Anyway. Kim. Marilyn will possess you at some point if you don’t stop.


Louis Virtel: Which I’m sure is the whole point.


Ira Madison III: Actually, probably. I would I would like that. The possession of Kim K.


Louis Virtel: Somebody has got to take accountability for this whole woman. So if anyone, it’s got to be Marilyn.


Ira Madison III: What do you think Marilyn does? Like if she gets like her corporeal form again?


Louis Virtel: Yeah. Yeah. I don’t know.


Ira Madison III: Do you think she, like, marches to college campuses and, like, rips her poster off of people’s walls? I feel like she doesn’t love that white dress grater poster as much as, like, freshman girls in college love it.


Louis Virtel: Oh, no she’s probably sick of that. She’s like, just put up another Audrey poster. Leave me out of it.


Ira Madison III: Yeah. Oh, she didn’t want her munrussy out there like that.


Louis Virtel: Vile.


Ira Madison III: Anyway, I’m going to continue thinking about what Marilyn Monroe would do if she were walking amongst us. Like the first thing that she would do. I think that she would probably, probably go after everyone involved in the show Smash.


Louis Virtel: Oh, sure. I mean I mean, to be honest, Katharine McPhee wishes she were haunted by Marilyn Monroe, but. Well, nobody haunting that. Well, I guess David Foster’s on to her.


Ira Madison III: As the Crypt Keeper. But she does live with him.


Louis Virtel: Never mind. She’s surrounded by, like, cobweb covered pianos, etc..


Ira Madison III: And artists and artists he has kept chained up in his basement.


Ira Madison III: I. All of all of Chicago’s there. He never let them out. All right. That’s our show. Thank you to Julio Torres for joining us this week. And we’ll be back next week with more Keep It.


Ira Madison III: Keep It is a Crooked Media production. Our senior producer is Kendra James. Our producer is Chris Lord, our executive producers are Ira Madison, III.


Ira Madison III: And Louis Virtel.


Ira Madison III: Our editor is Charlotte Landes and Kyle Seglin is our sound engineer.


Ira Madison III: Thank you to our digital team, Matt DeGroot, Nar Melkonian, and Delon Villanueva for our production support every week.